My Ongoing TRT Mystery

[SSHSSA74]

Benzos make me feel great, able to do chores, have sex, live life without the judge in my head. However, I only take them in dire situations. I sleep well on them and wake up feeling normal, not drugged. However I sometimes get rebound anxiety from them.

I have never tried Benzos, but am interested. I rarely sleep well. A couple of bourbons before bed sometimes helps.

 

[osirisrisen]

I have never tried Benzos, but am interested. I rarely sleep well. A couple of bourbons before bed sometimes helps.

I would never recommend anyone take benzos unless needed and prescribed by a knowledgeable doctor. I have taken maybe 20 benzo tablets over the last 15 years as a total last resort when having a panic attack.

I’ve simply noted the benzo response (sexual function, mood, drive, etc.) as a means to locate some benefit/disregulation in my GAD1 and general anxiety system that benefits from this. Just trying to see where hormones help and where other interventions are needed.

 

[GreenMachineX]

I’m not sure that field of SNPs is researched far enough to be effective yet. However, I have read that slow comt responds well to HydroxyB12 and also some adaptogens like Ashwagandha. Who really knows though?

I know that my b12 and folate are low and that any Bcomplex makes me super angry within a few minutes. I haven’t messed with folate but typically methyl types of supps make me feel bad. I do think the COMT think has merit because anything that slows COMT (ecgc, green tea, etc) does make me feel truly awful, and this was before learning of my COMT defect. I can recall one time I was in LA and had some special high end green tea and it basically put me down for the day.

The only sources for help with these that I have found are Ben Lynch’s book Dirty Genes and Nutrahacker. Amy Yasko seems to think that everyone needs to start with low dose Lithum OroTate before messing with b12 or folate. Not sure how much merit that has either.

I have yet to mess with the HydroxyB12 but have it here on my counter.

I know to stay away from most stimulants, as I am very sensitive to those.

How low is your b12? Are you taking anything for it yet? I've recently stopped all supplemental B's and am so much more calm, but my b12 is 362, on the low end. Unsure what to do.

 

[osirisrisen]

How low is your b12? Are you taking anything for it yet? I've recently stopped all supplemental B's and am so much more calm, but my b12 is 362, on the low end. Unsure what to do.

B12 is 692 pg/ml (232-1245) below halfway
folate is 14.1 no range but low on the graphic range bar

any b complex makes me angry, I’m considering just taking b6 and then adding hydroxycobalamin for b12

I always see that b vitamins are the panacea for all mental health issues, but they seem to exacerbate mine.

 

[osirisrisen]

Currently off all trt for three months:

Total T is 312 (264-916)
Free T is 5.0, flagged low

The good, less panic, no air hunger
The bad- sleep is bad, haven’t had energy to go to gym, just feel a bit flat, no sex drive

Obviously I need to be on some kind of TRT, but I am also planning on having my first child in the next six months. I’m considering 75mg Xyosted for simplicity and to try Enthate without preservatives. Meeting with Defy this month to discuss fertility options. Encomiphine did not help whatsoever.

Should I get a semen analysis now, or just wait till I’m on a good protocol and then test to see if it is working? I figure no sense if I currently have fertility off TRT when doing the deed is next to impossible. I’d rather have the drive and energy and hope that HCG or HMG will give me the fertility.

 

[GreenMachineX]

B12 is 692 pg/ml (232-1245) below halfway
folate is 14.1 no range but low on the graphic range bar

any b complex makes me angry, I’m considering just taking b6 and then adding hydroxycobalamin for b12

I always see that b vitamins are the panacea for all mental health issues, but they seem to exacerbate mine.

Wish my b12 was there...mine keeps bouncing around 360, up to 500, then dropped back to 360 again even while supplementing... covid may have dropped it again then though.

I've notice eating any veggies with folate, or taking folate, makes me ridiculously irritable.

 

[tropicaldaze1950]

B12 is 692 pg/ml (232-1245) below halfway
folate is 14.1 no range but low on the graphic range bar

any b complex makes me angry, I’m considering just taking b6 and then adding hydroxycobalamin for b12

I always see that b vitamins are the panacea for all mental health issues, but they seem to exacerbate mine.

Niacin, alone and in B-complex always made my hyper. Also feel worse on B6. Used it conjunction with zinc, per the protocol used by the late Dr. Carl Pfieffer. Methylcobalamin doesn't agree with me either. I inject cyanocobalamin, 1000 mcg, twice a month, down from multiple injections per week. Haven't had my B12 tested for quite some time. Many of us are lab rats, LOL.

 

[SSHSSA74]

Wish my b12 was there...mine keeps bouncing around 360, up to 500, then dropped back to 360 again even while supplementing... covid may have dropped it again then though.

I've notice eating any veggies with folate, or taking folate, makes me ridiculously irritable.

What are normal levels of b12?

 

[Willyt]

What are normal levels of b12?

And why would humans be deficient in B12 in the modern age? I can understand the cause of vitamin D deficiency because we are outside less, but less so with B12

 

[Fortunate]

Currently off all trt for three months:

Total T is 312 (264-916)
Free T is 5.0, flagged low

The good, less panic, no air hunger
The bad- sleep is bad, haven’t had energy to go to gym, just feel a bit flat, no sex drive

Obviously I need to be on some kind of TRT, but I am also planning on having my first child in the next six months. I’m considering 75mg Xyosted for simplicity and to try Enthate without preservatives. Meeting with Defy this month to discuss fertility options. Encomiphine did not help whatsoever.

Should I get a semen analysis now, or just wait till I’m on a good protocol and then test to see if it is working? I figure no sense if I currently have fertility off TRT when doing the deed is next to impossible. I’d rather have the drive and energy and hope that HCG or HMG will give me the fertility.

Is donating current sperm and option? That would let you use current sperm and not wait to trial Xyosted. It may be expensive, though.

 

[GreenMachineX]

What are normal levels of b12?

The range for my b12 lab was 250 to 900 or something, so I'm at the low end of normal, but my TRT doc wants me at 800 or more.

And why would humans be deficient in B12 in the modern age? I can understand the cause of vitamin D deficiency because we are outside less, but less so with B12

I have MTRR A66G mutation which could account for this, but I've also been taking 1g vitamin C with each meal for years. Did some info that vit c destroys the cobalamin in food or supplements.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Niacin, alone and in B-complex always made my hyper. Also feel worse on B6. Used it conjunction with zinc, per the protocol used by the late Dr. Carl Pfieffer. Methylcobalamin doesn't agree with me either. I inject cyanocobalamin, 1000 mcg, twice a month, down from multiple injections per week. Haven't had my B12 tested for quite some time. Many of us are lab rats, LOL.

Have you had your b12 tested again yet? I've been given a 30mL vial of cyanocobalamin and told 1mL (1mg) every 2 weeks, but that doesn't sound like enough. What was your schedule in the beginning?

 

[tropicaldaze1950]

Have you had your b12 tested again yet? I've been given a 30mL vial of cyanocobalamin and told 1mL (1mg) every 2 weeks, but that doesn't sound like enough. What was your schedule in the beginning?

No. I was/am self treating, buying B12 from a manufacturer in Thailand. On my next labs, I'll pull my B12 level. As with so many of my experiments, after the initial strong positive response,(sleep, blood sugar, mood) I returned to baseline. That said, I believe B12, whether injections or oral supplementation, is overlooked or ignored by doctors.

 

[ajax31]

No. I was/am self treating, buying B12 from a manufacturer in Thailand. On my next labs, I'll pull my B12 level. As with so many of my experiments, after the initial strong positive response,(sleep, blood sugar, mood) I returned to baseline. That said, I believe B12, whether injections or oral supplementation, is overlooked or ignored by doctors.

For myself, I have found a negative relationship between B12 and zinc. Meaning that low zinc levels and high B12 are often found together.

Does taking B12 injections induce or aggravate a zinc deficiency? I don’t know.

By the way, it takes months, not days or weeks, to reverse zinc deficiency

 

[osirisrisen]

An update on things.

labs drawn off everything, three weeks after stopping enclomiphine. These are from over a month ago

total test 467 (250-1100)
free t 69 (35-155)
shbg 32 (10-50)
dht 45 (12-65)
e2 ultra sensitive 17pg/ml
hematocrit 40.6% low
hemoglobin 13.9g/dl (13.6-17.5)
vit d 18ng/ml low
tsh 0.98

The good:
finally hematocrit dropped and no more air hunger issues

The bad

everything else, ocd thoughts, anxiety, depressed, no working out, no energy, dizzy, laying in bed all day today,feel awful

The anxiety feels like it has blocked me from trying the Xyosted I have or any other treatment

im also wondering if the enclo was still boosting t a bit then bc my total t and shbg have never been that high off trt before. And possibly now I’m actually way lower as my system adjusted to the Enclo being out.

 

[osirisrisen]

Just posting some updates/thoughts as this is my log.


Still off all sups and hormones, went to the cryrobank today and had samples frozen. Specimen was all good, and saved 11 vials. So now I can feel safe to go back on TRT (and maybe HCG) and know that I will be able to have kids down the road!


The Interesting:

Weight is down 20lbs and anxiety/ocd is still way more intense than it has ever been. Dr. did some labs and while TSH and T4 are in range, my FT3 was 4.7 (2.5-3.9). This was flagged high and could mean hyperthyroidism. Honestly this would be a freaking relief if this was the case. yes I’m hoping for a diagnosis for something bad lol. It would explain the increased panic, ocd, heart feelings, and general malaise I’ve been going through.

Hoping my doctor calls me back soon and suggests an endo that is thorough. Previously my Hashimotos antibodies were slightly, ever so slightly above range once too.

 

[Systemlord]

Weight is down 20lbs and anxiety/ocd is still way more intense than it has ever been.

Hyperthyroidism can cause weight loss.

 

[osirisrisen]

Hyperthyroidism can cause weight loss.

Yes, which is an interesting revelation. I previously thought that since stoping TRT and not really going to the gym like I used to, I dropped 15-20 lbs. However, it wasn’t like I was an IFB pro and was walking around lIke some jacked gym monster. Eating has increased and weight is still 199 when my usual weight is 212-220ish. Spent so many years thinking I was hypo but this could be something.

Full hair loss back in college when all this started 20 years ago, another interesting clue.

 

[Systemlord]

I tried thyroid treatment a few years ago, after my second dosage, I felt like a drank way too much coffee. I was jittery and shaky.

My Free T3 was 3.6 prior to treatment, middle of the road levels. That’s why I chuckle when someone comes in here wanting to optimize thyroid levels with TSH <2.5.

Optimal range is very individual.

 

[osirisrisen]

I tried thyroid treatment a few years ago, after my second dosage, I felt like a drank way too much coffee. I was jittery and shaky.

My Free T3 was 3.6 prior to treatment, middle of the road levels. That’s why I chuckle when someone comes in here wanting to optimize thyroid levels with TSH <2.5.

Optimal range is very individual.

This reminds me of my first foray into all of this and the STTM forums. They would tell you to take more desiccated and tell people all this stuff to keep cranking up the thyroid hormone. Then they’d say if there were side effects that they had t3 “pooling” and the answer was MORE T3. Then once people were sweating, shaking, and pooping themselves, they’d say they must have done something wrong.