What dose for me?

[TheDude]

I just did blood work for SHBG.

RIP SHBG:

9 nmol/l (11,4 - 52,3)

No big deal. Just need to shorten the frequency of injections.

 

[Verdilo]

Guys, i think that i found something which could cause big problems with my trt and why it was working so bad. Will share more light on this later because i am at work now. Maybe it will be a big game changer for me.

@TheDude

Yes i know about it very well but its still sad for me.

 

[Verdilo]

Ok, so this is what i found out. Today i made standard blood work for me (estradiol, prolactin) + added 2 more. Progesterone and lipids. This is how it looks like:

Progesterone 0.09 ng/ml * [0.20 - 1.40]

Lipids:

Cholesterol 151 mg/dl [140 - 200]
HDL 51.5 mg/dl [35.0 - 80.0]
Triglycerides 60.0 mg/dl [35.0 - 155.0]
LDL 87.5 mg/dl [50.0 - 155.0]

I saw some informations about progesterone and its probably important for testosterone and mine is too low, is it a hint to something? Anyone got an idea...?

 

[Verdilo]

Got my new blood work. I am pretty shocked how my body is aromatising. Just see this:

Week before:

Estradiol - 32.98 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 12.19 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]

Week after (today):

Estradiol - 70.74 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 25.49 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]
PSA - 2.260 ng/ml [0.000 - 4.000]

This score is on 2x70mg protocol, first week of changing. Did this blood work in the day of my next injection which will happen today at night.

 

[FeelingLost]

Got my new blood work. I am pretty shocked how my body is aromatising. Just see this:

Week before:

Estradiol - 32.98 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 12.19 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]

Week after (today):

Estradiol - 70.74 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 25.49 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]
PSA - 2.260 ng/ml [0.000 - 4.000]

This score is on 2x70mg protocol, first week of changing. Did this blood work in the day of my next injection which will happen today at night.

You are on the fast track to man boobs. That prolactin scares me more than the E2. However you need to address them both sooner rather than later.

 

[Verdilo]

I know, i just took 1/2 tablet arimidex and 1/4 Dostinex.

You know what is more interesting? That i didnt "felt" in my body that something is wrong with prolactin and estradiol. No itchy nipples, no gyno symptoms (was checking it everyday very carefuly). I was feeling even BETTER (erectile was better, mood and strenght on training) than before, lol! Thats why i am shocked after seeing this results.

Maybe it's because of testosterone protocol starting working up? And i didnt felt high prolactin, e2 symptoms as i supposed to before because of that...?

 

[FeelingLost]

I know, i just took 1/2 tablet arimidex and 1/4 Dostinex.

You know what is more interesting? That i didnt "felt" in my body that something is wrong with prolactin and estradiol. No itchy nipples, no gyno symptoms (was checking it everyday very carefuly). I was feeling even BETTER (erectile was better, mood and strenght on training) than before, lol! Thats why i am shocked after seeing this results.

Maybe it's because of testosterone protocol starting working up? And i didnt felt high prolactin, e2 symptoms as i supposed to before because of that...?

When my E2 and prolactin went out of range I did not have boob issues for 5 weeks. Then I had to put bandaids on my nipples because my teeshirt hurt them
I then developed water bags under my nipples. my PCP said I had Hyper-Prolactinemia.

 

[Verdilo]

When my E2 and prolactin went out of range I did not have boob issues for 5 weeks. Then I had to put bandaids on my nipples because my teeshirt hurt them
I then developed water bags under my nipples. my PCP said I had Hyper-Prolactinemia.

My t-shirt was hurting my nipples too but in my younger years way before any treatment, i dont have gyno though. I got but very, very small, was doing ultrasound of my chest to check it.

The problem with my prolactin is that it's supposed to be in normal range whole my life probably but when i am going on trt or clomid or hcg then it's going high. I got high prolactin when was puted on clomid therapy before. Took 1/2 tablet of dostinex and didnt have to take it anymore although i was taking 1 tablet of clomid EOD for a next month. Prolactin never went up again... I have a theory that changing my protocol is always making my prolactin going too high.

 

[TheDude]

I know, i just took 1/2 tablet arimidex and 1/4 Dostinex.

You know what is more interesting? That i didnt "felt" in my body that something is wrong with prolactin and estradiol. No itchy nipples, no gyno symptoms (was checking it everyday very carefuly). I was feeling even BETTER (erectile was better, mood and strenght on training) than before, lol! Thats why i am shocked after seeing this results.

Maybe it's because of testosterone protocol starting working up? And i didnt felt high prolactin, e2 symptoms as i supposed to before because of that...?

Saying 1/2 a tablet doesn't tell us much. How many mg?

Also, are you testing your T numbers as well or just E2?

 

[Verdilo]

Saying 1/2 a tablet doesn't tell us much. How many mg?

Also, are you testing your T numbers as well or just E2?

1 tablet = 1 mg. 1/2 a tablet is always making my estradiol going down for about a half so i think it will be ok.

Dostinex, 1 tablet = 0,5 mg. 1/4 a tablet should be ok but i am still "playing" with it. When last time i took 1/2 my prolactin droped from 23 to 5 and i was feeling like complete trash although it was in range still. 1/4 should be a better option i guess.

 

[TheDude]

1 tablet = 1 mg. 1/2 a tablet is always making my estradiol going down for about a half so i think it will be ok.

Dostinex, 1 tablet = 0,5 mg. 1/4 a tablet should be ok but i am still "playing" with it. When last time i took 1/2 my prolactin droped from 23 to 5 and i was feeling like complete trash although it was in range still. 1/4 should be a better option i guess.

How often are you taking the AI?

 

[Verdilo]

How often are you taking the AI?

I am still "guessing". When was on clomid it was about 1/2 a tablet e5d. With testosterone is another game and its aromatasing different so i have to make blood work once per week to see where my levels are with this protocol.

Testosterone levels i will check after 4 weeks of this protocol. Currently i am during my second week.

 

[Verdilo]

Well, my guess was good about prolactin but bad in taking care of too high e2.

Blood work done today:

Estradiol - 6.42 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 8.65 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]

I am confused, dont know why i am feeling so bad last few days since i took arimidex and dostinex. Why i was feeling much better when my levels were like this:

Estradiol - 70.74 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 25.49 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]

I know that i crushed my e2 but i dont believe thats the case of my very bad mood and overall weak feeling. Without trt treatment my e2 levels were always very low and i didnt feel that bad then.

I am thinking about checking thyroid levels one more time but dont know if does it make sense. My tsh, ft3, ft4 were in range in the past (couple of months ago) and i also got thyroid ultrasound and everything was ok. I dont know where to look for possible problems and not progressing with my treatment at all. I am now starting my 3rd week with 2x70mg protocol and feeling like sh*t.

 

[Weasel]

Your e2 is at 6.42 and you're still wondering why you feel bad?

 

[lowe2sucks]

what did you expect? e2 is important to feel good.. dont buy those 20-30pg/ml sweetspot bullshit that ksman and other boards try to push. sweetspot is different for everybody and may very well be 70pg/ml for you. many folks never allow themselfes to go outside range with e2 and wonder why they never feel right. in the past I always felt like testosterone is working better with high e2 levels and still do.

 

[Verdilo]

The reason why i messed up with e2 and arimidex is simple. My aromatase was so much different when on clomid therapy and totally different now on trt. On clomid if i would take 0.75 mg of arimidex with e2 levels of 70 i would probably hit something between 20-30. On trt this dose is making my e2 going below range to 6 points.

Same thing with dostinex for too high prolactin. On clomid i needed 1/2 a tablet to make my prolactin go to 7 points. When used same dose of dostinex on trt i almost crushed my prolactin below range, was about 4 points. Now i learned, took 1/4 a tablet and my prolactin is perfectly in the middle.

That was my frist time lowering e2 while being on trt and now i see how different arimidex treatment it need from clomid therapy.

The reason why i dont believe its low e2 causing my problems because i got similar e2 levels before starting any treatment (when was low t, fsh, lh) and i didnt feel that bad as now...

Thanks for answers too.

 

[Systemlord]

what did you expect? e2 is important to feel good.. dont buy those 20-30pg/ml sweetspot bullshit that ksman and other boards try to push. sweetspot is different for everybody and may very well be 70pg/ml for you. many folks never allow themselfes to go outside range with e2 and wonder why they never feel right. in the past I always felt like testosterone is working better with high e2 levels and still do.

I also believe that 20-30 pg/ml range is just too damn narrow for everyone to fit into when we have guys all over on TT and FT range with no symptoms.

 

[Verdilo]

I also believe that 20-30 pg/ml range is just too damn narrow for everyone to fit into when we have guys all over on TT and FT range with no symptoms.

Do you believe that i could felt better because of such high estradiol levels? Just look:

Estradiol - 70.74 pg/ml [7.62 - 42.60]
Prolactin - 25.49 ng/ml [4.04 - 15.20]

Numbers are sick and to be honest, before i got my blood results i didnt expect that i will have so high e2, was expecting something from prolactin but definitely not that high score. My body didnt tell me anything. No itchy nipples, no gyno in progress and my erectile was sooooo much better, strange a little bit with prolactin and e2 on this level...

 

[OMI100]

Arimidex is STRONG stuff.....
When I was taking I had some compounded scored tabs made at 0.07ml/tab.
That titrates out a dose at the rate of 0.5MG/week.
By splitting tabs (1/2 tab a day) I reduced the dose to 0.25MG/week, broken down to a small daily dose.
I am not on an AI currently, but even the 1/4 tab (0.25mg/week) was still a bit much for me when I was using it.....

 

[Weasel]

Arimidex is STRONG stuff.....
When I was taking I had some compounded scored tabs made at 0.07ml/tab.
That titrates out a dose at the rate of 0.5MG/week.
By splitting tabs (1/2 tab a day) I reduced the dose to 0.25MG/week, broken down to a small daily dose.
I am not on an AI currently, but even the 1/4 tab (0.25mg/week) was still a bit much for me when I was using it.....

And for that matter Dostinex is very strong stuff and can **** with dopamine and other neurotransmitters as well. That could be the reason you feel like shit as well..