Nandrolone (Deca) Base TRT Trial

[bmosby]

I'm sorry you aren't feeling your best. I'm still researching but it sounds promising. So far i am leaning toward nandrolone at 150-160mg week and test prop(depending on source but shouldn't be an issue) at 20mg week. Like I said I'm still researching options but this thread really is hopeful to help a lot of guys. Good luck on the trt journey fellas.

 

[Mr.63]

Damn, it’s literally the worst when u feel like this on a protocol. Not only does it suck suffering, but it sucks losing that feeling of trying something out and being excited for the possibility of it making u feel how u hoped HRT would make u feel. So it’s definitely a sucky situation all around. Been through it many times.

Nobody would fault u for tapping out right now. But if I were u, I would definitely try adding a low dose of test first, before tapping out completely. Preferably test prop if u have access to it

I will try to hang on a little bit more.
Last sunday i added 15mg of test. Since i pin 2x per week its going to be 30mg per week total.
Also lowered the nandrolone to 75mg 2x per week as my bp was raising to. And i wouldnt be comfortable in my head doing 200mg life long.
Also started doing daily cardio after training in hopes to reduce bp.

This night i had strong wood almost the whole night and a pretty sexual dream to. But the moment i wake up, i dont feel horny at all.
Maybe im on the right pad.. who knows. Time will tell.

 

[Gman86]

I'm sorry you aren't feeling your best. I'm still researching but it sounds promising. So far i am leaning toward nandrolone at 150-160mg week and test prop(depending on source but shouldn't be an issue) at 20mg week. Like I said I'm still researching options but this thread really is hopeful to help a lot of guys. Good luck on the trt journey fellas.

That sounds like a perfect starting protocol, as far as a nandrolone based protocol goes. Love that u would start with such a low dose of test, and love that u would use prop. So much easier and faster to dial in, if u have access to it. And 150-160mg of nandrolone sounds like a great dosage, that can obv be run indefinitely

 

[Gman86]

I will try to hang on a little bit more.
Last sunday i added 15mg of test. Since i pin 2x per week its going to be 30mg per week total.
Also lowered the nandrolone to 75mg 2x per week as my bp was raising to. And i wouldnt be comfortable in my head doing 200mg life long.
Also started doing daily cardio after training in hopes to reduce bp.

This night i had strong wood almost the whole night and a pretty sexual dream to. But the moment i wake up, i dont feel horny at all.
Maybe im on the right pad.. who knows. Time will tell.

Really really hoping these are at least signs that things are improving, now that u have a little bit of test in the mix

 

[baconlatte]

Ive been doing deca solo for about 3 weeks now and it has been awfull.
Depressed, irritable, bad mood, anxious the little libido i had on trt is now completely gone.

Only positive is the gym. I grow like a weed. But that is not my main priority. I want my libido back, not mass gainz.

Im afraid im fucked for life. I really hoped this would the holy grail protocol and that this would be everything i hoped trt would be but its not. I feel so bad i dont even feel like continueing this.

Hold up. Did you just switch from Test to Deca or you just started Deca from zero?

 

[baconlatte]

Sarcastically, I think the only benefit with Test vs Nand is that I was 10-15% stronger on Test. NPP is better in every other way. If I could solve that 1 missing piece everything would be perfect. Now my cabinet looks like a pharmacy of Test and DHT derivatives.

I've tried baby doses of Anavar, Proviron, Mast, Primo, and EQ. Didn't feel anything from the orals and the injectables caused me to breakout (within 2-3 days) with no real sexual benefit. Each time it would take 3-6 weeks for the acne to clear. I've become so sensitive to this shit that I feel like I can tell what and when I injected by the quality of my skin lol.

I just received Dbol, Tbol and Tren which I plan on trying in the near future.

This is me as of last week on 150mg NPP + 1,000iu hCG. 40yo 172lbs haven't had bf% tested in a while.

Update since my last post:

-I tried Dbol for 2 weeks. First week at 5mg daily, second week at 10mg daily. I literally didn't feel a damn thing. My body typically responds quickly so I dropped Dbol.

-After a short break I tried 10mg Tbol. It's only been 3 weeks now. Endurance in the gym is up a little; I feel like my well is deeper when I'm trying to bust out those last reps. But the biggest benefit has been EQ/sensitivity/semen volume. I don't know the biological mechanism behind it but, for now, I'm firing on all cylinders like before AAS. It almost brings a tear to my eye being able to experience my old orgasms again lmao. I may drop the dose to 5mg to see if it's still effective.

Again...it's only been 3 weeks. I'm hoping this isn't another honeymoon like I've had with hCG, Proviron and Mast. Now the big questions are 1) what does my bloodwork look like? 2) how much Tbol is safe to take? and 3) how long is Tbol safe to take for?

-Now that I've spent an extended amount of time on NPP, I've noticed I don't have nearly the same "pump" that I had on Test, even though my "Test serum" levels are significantly higher now. On Test, I would wake up pumped as if I just finished a workout. On NPP, I only get the gym pump, and even then, it fades away pretty quickly. I have no complaints about the way I look, but I do look much flatter now than I did on Test. Just an observation.

-I noticed I'm REALLY sensitive with regard to acne. I don't think I'm able to go above 120 - 150mg without break outs that left some permanent marks.

I stopped hCG for a few weeks trying to get my acne under control. I was surprised to learn the issue was high T, not high e2. After I noticed no change, I added back hCG and dropped NPP to 120mg. My skin has been clearing up nicely since dropping to 120mg.

tl;dr: I'm on 120mg NPP, 1,000iu hCG, 10mg Tbol. Feeling 10/10.

 

[Mr.63]

Hold up. Did you just switch from Test to Deca or you just started Deca from zero?

Switched from test to deca.
Did my last pin of test 9 december and started deca on 15december

 

[baconlatte]

Switched from test to deca.
Did my last pin of test 9 december and started deca on 15december

I had a feeling this might’ve been the case. You may still have exogenous Test floating around in your system interacting with the Deca.

Not sure if your best option is to 1) power through for another month or so and see how it goes or 2) PCT, come off everything for a few months, and try Deca fresh.

 

[Fernando Almaguer]

Ive tried test with 100 mg deca. really not all that great, just ok. Watery, bloated, strong but lil more acne and higher hct, just better with test only and small amounts of hcg for me

 

[Mr.63]

I had to stop the experiment.
I just felt awfull. If this is how i would feel the rest of my life, its not worth living.
The deca is legit, i have labs from janoshik.

Also bloodpressure is doing crazy things. When waking up and going downstairs i immediately take my bp. And its always 129-130/70-75. This is ok but i would want it lower.
Then while at work every time i take bp its 150-165/90-100. Or doing small stuff at home like taking the trash out.. boom 150/75. Then if i sit down for 10min it comes back to around 135/75. This is fluctuating wildly imo. Is this even normal??
2 and a half weeks ago i started doing daily cardio around 15-20mins. BP doesnt move.

Then the main reason i tries deca base is for libido.
Before, on 125mg test per week i enjoyed sex. Had no real erection problems. But just wasnt reallt horny. But once in the mood everything was ok. But i really miss that urge to have sex.
But oh boy.. on deca base im literally disgusted from sex. I dont want anything to do with sex. I dont feel like a man anymore. I tried having sex with the wife but i cant hold my erection it just dies on me. Its awfull.

I really hoped this would work but i dont even want to try anymore its not worth it.

Im going to switch back to trt and try some masteron in The future maybe.

But do i wait for the deca to clear my system or just start back up immediatly?
I don want an extra rise in bp or e2 .
When should i start to feel normal again?

 

[Gman86]

I had to stop the experiment.
I just felt awfull. If this is how i would feel the rest of my life, its not worth living.
The deca is legit, i have labs from janoshik.

Also bloodpressure is doing crazy things. When waking up and going downstairs i immediately take my bp. And its always 129-130/70-75. This is ok but i would want it lower.
Then while at work every time i take bp its 150-165/90-100. Or doing small stuff at home like taking the trash out.. boom 150/75. Then if i sit down for 10min it comes back to around 135/75. This is fluctuating wildly imo. Is this even normal??
2 and a half weeks ago i started doing daily cardio around 15-20mins. BP doesnt move.

Then the main reason i tries deca base is for libido.
Before, on 125mg test per week i enjoyed sex. Had no real erection problems. But just wasnt reallt horny. But once in the mood everything was ok. But i really miss that urge to have sex.
But oh boy.. on deca base im literally disgusted from sex. I dont want anything to do with sex. I dont feel like a man anymore. I tried having sex with the wife but i cant hold my erection it just dies on me. Its awfull.

I really hoped this would work but i dont even want to try anymore its not worth it.

Im going to switch back to trt and try some masteron in The future maybe.

But do i wait for the deca to clear my system or just start back up immediatly?
I don want an extra rise in bp or e2 .
When should i start to feel normal again?

Damn, sorry it didn’t work for u man. Clearly something’s very off.

I would personally just start whatever protocol u plan on using. Wouldn’t worry about timing things properly. Just stop the deca, and start taking whatever u plan on doing protocol wise going forward

Probably the most successful protocol I’ve seen work for the most people is a test base with a dht derivative. So maybe give that a try. Test with proviron. Test with masteron. Test with primo. Test with low dose proviron is probably ur best bet if feeling good, and having things function well sexually, are the main priorities, and building muscle is secondary. Plus proviron comes as a pill or capsule, so it’s also a very convenient add on

 

[Seagal]

You could start by adding DHT or a derivative (preferably proviron) back into circulation.

 

[Mr.63]

@Gman86 when should these effects from deca start to fade?

I have read somewhere that the effects from proviron are mostly temporary? Is this true?
I have experienced this to many years ago, but i was on cycle then.. i started to lose my libido and EQ at some point on cycle, i then added in proviron and things were amazing! But after 2 weeks it all faded away..

And what are your thoughts on my BP?
Is it normal to have such high readings when working or doing other things and then drop back to 135-130/75 when resting?

 

[Gman86]

@Gman86 when should these effects from deca start to fade?

I have read somewhere that the effects from proviron are mostly temporary? Is this true?
I have experienced this to many years ago, but i was on cycle then.. i started to lose my libido and EQ at some point on cycle, i then added in proviron and things were amazing! But after 2 weeks it all faded away..

And what are your thoughts on my BP?
Is it normal to have such high readings when working or doing other things and then drop back to 135-130/75 when resting?

Honestly not sure if effects from proviron tend to only be temporary for most people. I would assume that if after 2 weeks the positive effects go away, that there hasn’t been enough time to possibly build up a tolerance, and that it’s simply a case of probably taking too much, and once it built up in the system, it cause hormones to be in a place where the positive effects went away. That’s my guess at least.

The body can obv build up a tolerance to medications. Pain medications are a good example. But that takes time. Even if someone can build up a tolerance to something like proviron, I would imagine it takes a lot longer than 2 weeks. Again, if that’s even possible with things like dht derivatives

And I’m not an expert in BP, but I would assume that’s completely normal for BP to be temporarily elevated in the situations u provided. Checkout this study where they monitored BP during intense weight lifting. People’s blood pressures got as high as 480/350! So 150-165/90-100 doesn’t seem that bad during exertion in retrospect lol

Arterial blood pressure response to heavy resistance exercise - PubMed

The purpose of this study was to record the blood pressure response to heavy weight-lifting exercise in five experienced body builders. Blood pressure was directly recorded by means of a capacitance transducer connected to a catheter in the brachial artery. Intrathoracic pressure with the...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[William Greystoke]

So Dr Lichten is a huge fan of nandrolone, but doesn’t have any guys on a nandrolone based protocol, as far as I know. He likes to use it in the more traditional way that most of us have seen it be used. A 2:1 ratio of test to testosterone. Here’s the protocol and dosages that he most commonly prescribes, based off of what he says in interviews


120-160mg test cyp

40mg-60mg of deca

25mg of Winstrol (Stanozol) once per week

-likes to see his patients’ peak level at 1000-1200

-likes roughly around 2:1 deca:test ratio

This all was very informative, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience,
I had a low t , bellow lower range (age 48 and all symptoms of hypogonadism), started with test cyp 150 mg per week, went up and currently 250 mg per week, went every 2 months by 20 mg up so far , additionally add deca , starting 80 mg and came up to 150 mg per week.So far felt only improvement going up, not a single side effect or anything felt bad…my libido came back, sex drive really nice.only no morning wood at all, I am using around 750 of hcg , and all is good.My muscles get better and muscle mass improved but I am also pushing gym seriosly.Sometimes I am wondering if I have a bit more space for additional improvement , would it be logical to go up with test cyp additionally 20 mg up or nandrolone?, what would be logical to do first?, would Winstrol as add be beneficial to me?

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

This all was very informative, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience,
I had a low t , bellow lower range (age 48 and all symptoms of hypogonadism), started with test cyp 150 mg per week, went up and currently 250 mg per week, went every 2 months by 20 mg up so far , additionally add deca , starting 80 mg and came up to 150 mg per week.So far felt only improvement going up, not a single side effect or anything felt bad…my libido came back, sex drive really nice.only no morning wood at all, I am using around 750 of hcg , and all is good.My muscles get better and muscle mass improved but I am also pushing gym seriosly.Sometimes I am wondering if I have a bit more space for additional improvement , would it be logical to go up with test cyp additionally 20 mg up or nandrolone?, what would be logical to do first?, would Winstrol as add be beneficial to me?

It's not clear why you would change anything if you are in a good place overall. 400mg per week is a hefty dose already.

 

[William Greystoke]

It's not clear why you would change anything if you are in a good place overall. 400mg per week is a hefty dose already.

It is only my thought , would any extra 20 mg of one those put me in perfect spot, like I said I didn't felt any bad side effects, with lower dosages I felt more less some days like I am not on trt, so it makes me wonder if I am truly in sweet spot or some small adjustment would get me there , or any adjustment woul bring me back that morning wood other people talk about.
Thank you for your reply,

 

[Gman86]

This all was very informative, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience,
I had a low t , bellow lower range (age 48 and all symptoms of hypogonadism), started with test cyp 150 mg per week, went up and currently 250 mg per week, went every 2 months by 20 mg up so far , additionally add deca , starting 80 mg and came up to 150 mg per week.So far felt only improvement going up, not a single side effect or anything felt bad…my libido came back, sex drive really nice.only no morning wood at all, I am using around 750 of hcg , and all is good.My muscles get better and muscle mass improved but I am also pushing gym seriosly.Sometimes I am wondering if I have a bit more space for additional improvement , would it be logical to go up with test cyp additionally 20 mg up or nandrolone?, what would be logical to do first?, would Winstrol as add be beneficial to me?

I definitely wouldn’t go up any further with either test or nandrolone. Ur weekly androgen load is clearly already pretty high lol

To get morning wood back I would probably either lower ur nandrolone dose a bit, or add a small dose of a dht derivative, like proviron, for example. Like even just start with 5mg/ day of proviron. With anything u take, u always want to take the lowest effective dose, to achieve ur goals. When u’ve been in the HRT game as long as I have, u realize that one of the most important things, when it comes to success, is being patient, starting with the lowest effective dose, titrating up slowly, if needed, and not overshooting the sweetspot with things

With u being on a test base, u want to take the lowest effective dose of nandrolone, to achieve ur goals. Test and nandrolone aren’t usually the best when used together. Due to test being a high metabolite converter. Aka it converts into estrogen and dht at pretty high rates, compared to other AAS. And estrogen is the main stimulator of prolactin, in the male body, so it also tends to raise prolactin levels to a pretty good degree.

Then u have nandrolone, that sensitizes estrogen and prolactin receptors, making whatever estrogen and prolactin u have in ur system more potent. Nandrolone also supposedly increases the rate at which testosterone converts into estrogen. And then there’s also a progesterone component, since nandrolone is a progestin. So overall u just have to be careful when using test and nandorlone together. Their individual properties make them a little risky to use together.

So when using a test base, u always want to use the lowest effective dose of nandrolone, to reach ur goals, and when using a nandrolone base, u always want to use the lowest effective dose of test, again to achieve ur goals

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I definitely wouldn’t go up any further with either test or nandrolone. Ur weekly androgen load is clearly already pretty high lol

When you hear that your androgen load is high from Gman... it's high. Lol

 

[Gman86]

When you hear that your androgen load is high from Gman... it's high. Lol

Hahah facts!