Can estrogen crash cause desensitization/knock out of the estrogen receptor - lets discuss!

[Lowe2guy]

Flaxseed dietary supplement versus hormone replacement therapy in hypercholesterolemic menopausal women - PubMed

Although 40 g of flaxseed is as effective as oral estrogen-progesterone to improve mild menopausal symptoms and to lower glucose and insulin levels, only hormone replacement therapy significantly improves cholesterol profile in hypercholesterolemic women and favorably modifies markers related to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Check that out. 40g ground flaxseed was basically a effective as HRT in reducing menopausal symptoms which is basically what we have.

Interesting gunna give that a shot before I try dbol or Fin again. I want to try ecdysterone but I cant get it where I am. Please let me know if it works for you.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Interesting gunna give that a shot before I try dbol or Fin again. I want to try ecdysterone but I cant get it where I am. Please let me know if it works for you.

Gotcha.

 

[glob]

I’ve been having those electric shock feelings but not in my legs rather in my arms and neck. Funny thing is my estrogen on paper is normal even on the high end but I feel every symptom of low e2. I’m experiencing every negative side effect including hairloss which I was told “doesnt look like MPB” as its diffuse and all over my head.

Something really odd is I made an attempt to stop this Hairloss with finasteride because I value my hair so much and what can I possibly lose as I feel so shitty already, I used it for a month and about 3 weeks in holy crap did I ever feel GREAT! By far the best I’ve ever felt,all low e2 symptoms were gone. 0 bloating, my previously painful joints (knees,back,shoulders,elbows) no longer hurt at all, pumps in the gym were skin tearing again, strength shot up, libido was insane felt like a crazed sex freak lol my wife can attest to that, morning wood returned and I had the most positive/confident mood Ive had in a long time.

Unfortunately I quit finasteride because a week later my hair started flying off my head at an alarming rate. Same rate as when I crashed my e2 for the last time which I cant seem to recover from. Im at a loss for words and cant even theorize why this occured… I’m completely clueless. Upon cessation of finasteride my symptoms gradually returned (probably when DHT built up again) but who knows.

Im at my witts end with this shit tbh, I dont know what to do. Since using finasteride i’ve tried everything from raising my trt dose which makes me feel even worse to lowering my trt dose which makes my libido a tad bit better but my joints hurt even more. Im tempted to just take finasteride again to get relief from these symptoms but I value my hair (whats left of it) and the thought that an anti androgen is making me feel that way is kind of scary when its supposed to do the exact opposite.

Anyone have any ideas?

What is your protocol and injection frequency?

 

[Lowe2guy]

What is your protocol and injection frequency?

150mg split into EOD test only

 

[Lowe2guy]

Gotcha.

Hey man hows it going now?

 

[GreenMachineX]

Hey man hows it going now?

Ehhh, not great. Haven't worked out in 6 months. Still dealing with weird effects throughout the day and not sleeping well, but I'm convinced it's not e2 now. I've been experiment with different types of b12 and folate and have extremely different responses of energy, anxiety, etc. I think I'm on the right track as of today with an experiment so I'll have to report back.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Hey man hows it going now?

How about you?

 

[Coconutz]

I was suffering from low e2 for years from abusing exemestane while bodybuilding. . I've been experimenting with injectable and oral estradiol valerate for the last 2 months
Holy shit. Thats was the missing piece. It's like a light just switched on in my brain. No more night sweats, libido waaaaaaay back. I dropped 10lbs of water weight in a week and am lean as I've been for a while. And get this! My minor gyno lumps are slowly going away. From taking ESTROGEN!!. I literally feel like I'm on cycle on my usual 200mg test E. My muscles are so full all the time, and all I've been doing for 6 months is cardio and yoga. Im still trying to find my perfect dose, as I feel I can use WAY less test now. I've kept my trt as high as 300 just to try to get more estradiol in my system. I'm not touching anything for a while. I feel too good to try to change anything right now.

I think yall should just find some estrogen and Give it a try. Its cheap and.nothing to lose at this point. It aint gonna hurt ya with such a short half life. 2mg oral EV for 200mg of test E works for me. Didn't take the injection long enough to let it build up in my blood to form a concrete opinion.

 

[Lowe2guy]

How about you?

Still the same, the flax seed didn’t help at all. Im about to switch to infrequent dosing in hopes itll help

 

[Lowe2guy]

I was suffering from low e2 for years from abusing exemestane while bodybuilding. . I've been experimenting with injectable and oral estradiol valerate for the last 2 months
Holy shit. Thats was the missing piece. It's like a light just switched on in my brain. No more night sweats, libido waaaaaaay back. I dropped 10lbs of water weight in a week and am lean as I've been for a while. And get this! My minor gyno lumps are slowly going away. From taking ESTROGEN!!. I literally feel like I'm on cycle on my usual 200mg test E. My muscles are so full all the time, and all I've been doing for 6 months is cardio and yoga. Im still trying to find my perfect dose, as I feel I can use WAY less test now. I've kept my trt as high as 300 just to try to get more estradiol in my system. I'm not touching anything for a while. I feel too good to try to change anything right now.

I think yall should just find some estrogen and Give it a try. Its cheap and.nothing to lose at this point. It aint gonna hurt ya with such a short half life. 2mg oral EV for 200mg of test E works for me. Didn't take the injection long enough to let it build up in my blood to form a concrete opinion.

Whats your injection schedule look like? Also does your bloodwork show high estrogen while you were having the symptoms?

 

[Coconutz]

Whats your injection schedule look like? Also does your bloodwork show high estrogen while you were having the symptoms?

30mg daily test e has been my protocol for a while. ShBG is always 15-20 High estrogen?? I dont even know what that feels like. Lol. I stopped testing estrogen 2 years ago. All my hormones actually. It was absolutely AWFUL for my OCD, which is soooo alleviated when i dont have low E2.. I've been doing this a long time, and know how my body responds to testosterone and don't need a number on a piece of paper to know if I feel great or not. Thats the key to this.. feeling great. And now, I feel the best I have in a loooong time. And it's undoubtedly from the estradiol. I want to lower my test eventually to see if I can get by on lower doses now that I have E2 in my system. Even start taking progesterone again, which crushed my e2 in the past. Scrotal test cream also eventually killed my E2 on another protocol I tried, after feeling amazing for quite a while. Adding exogenous estradiol opens up so many more TRT protocol options for the low E2 guys. Gotta relearn ones body all over again once other hormones are introduced.

Id definitely consider feeling amazing at this point still the honeymoon phase.. my fingers crossed it isn't though, since I've been steady on 30mg test e daily for a good 6 months, and oral Estradiol Valerate which has a 20hr half life. It's been 2 months since starting E2 supplementation.ill be back to reassess how I feel here and there. I dont get online much in thr spring. Gotta get that free vitamin D!

 

[Lumalux]

Take for example libido. My libido is higher with crashed e2 than it is with high e2. It's even higher with low e2 than when im on a normal level.

I go completely sex maniac mad when im to low on e2. Then there are those who can't even get an erection from going to low.

Maybe you can help me with this. My last estradiol reading a couple of months ago was normal at 20.5. My free T is low at 6.1 and total T is on the low end of OK at 415. I am 56.

Lately I have been getting fierce night sweats. The other night I woke up literally soaked. My t-shirt was wet and my legs were wet. Same the following night. Very unpleasant. But my sex drive is really good. Like almost too high which I don't mind. Do you think my E2 has dropped or is it high? Which typically causes night sweats in men?

 

[GreenMachineX]

Still the same, the flax seed didn’t help at all. Im about to switch to infrequent dosing in hopes itll help

Ground flaxseed?

 

[Bmac]

I was suffering from low e2 for years from abusing exemestane while bodybuilding. . I've been experimenting with injectable and oral estradiol valerate for the last 2 months
Holy shit. Thats was the missing piece. It's like a light just switched on in my brain. No more night sweats, libido waaaaaaay back. I dropped 10lbs of water weight in a week and am lean as I've been for a while. And get this! My minor gyno lumps are slowly going away. From taking ESTROGEN!!. I literally feel like I'm on cycle on my usual 200mg test E. My muscles are so full all the time, and all I've been doing for 6 months is cardio and yoga. Im still trying to find my perfect dose, as I feel I can use WAY less test now. I've kept my trt as high as 300 just to try to get more estradiol in my system. I'm not touching anything for a while. I feel too good to try to change anything right now.

I think yall should just find some estrogen and Give it a try. Its cheap and.nothing to lose at this point. It aint gonna hurt ya with such a short half life. 2mg oral EV for 200mg of test E works for me. Didn't take the injection long enough to let it build up in my blood to form a concrete opinion.

Your story is identical to mine. I used aromasin over an extended period of time and certain symptoms never seemed to recover/improve. I tried x, y, and z to fix the low e2 symptoms until I said what do I have to lose and directly supplement e2. The increase in muscle fullness and improvement in mobility was the sign that I was on the right track.

 

[Lowe2guy]

Ground flaxseed?

Yep ground flaxseed, I’m day 5 into E2 cream and guess what? Loll symptoms are improving, my joints are already better my sleep is better no more hot flashes, itchy scalp is gone and my muscle are becoming more full. This confirma everything. Despite my low SHBG my body clearly doesnt like frequent injections it causes e2 to become to low. Im gunna drop the e2 cream and go to an E5D schedule to hopefully bump up aromitization.

 

[JustPanicNoDisco]

Yep ground flaxseed, I’m day 5 into E2 cream and guess what? Loll symptoms are improving, my joints are already better my sleep is better no more hot flashes, itchy scalp is gone and my muscle are becoming more full. This confirma everything. Despite my low SHBG my body clearly doesnt like frequent injections it causes e2 to become to low. Im gunna drop the e2 cream and go to an E5D schedule to hopefully bump up aromitization.

What dose were you using and where were you applying it?

What was your TRT protocol when using the e2 cream?

 

[Coconutz]

Your story is identical to mine. I used aromasin over an extended period of time and certain symptoms never seemed to recover/improve. I tried x, y, and z to fix the low e2 symptoms until I said what do I have to lose and directly supplement e2. The increase in muscle fullness and improvement in mobility was the sign that I was on the right track.

It's night and day supplementing estrogen. I can't believe I'm saying that lol. Care to share your protocol?

I think a lot of bodybuilders need to be warned not touch aromasin. It worked amazing in my 20s while bodybuilding and blasting a gram plus of test plus whatever else.. but It seems to permanently disable the aromatase enzyme, or close to it for years and years after discontinuation. If notpermanently. I literally took that shit for probably 5-6 years straight, and 12 years total off and on. I'm 40 now.

My sleeps been amazing, and what I thought was eczema that I've had for years is going away. Ive tried posting this on bodybuilding forums, and got completely flamed. Soooo. Fuck em. One day when they are in our shoes they'll understand.

 

[JustPanicNoDisco]

It's night and day supplementing estrogen. I can't believe I'm saying that lol. Care to share your protocol?

I think a lot of bodybuilders need to be warned not touch aromasin. It worked amazing in my 20s while bodybuilding and blasting a gram plus of test plus whatever else.. but It seems to permanently disable the aromatase enzyme, or close to it for years and years after discontinuation. If notpermanently. I literally took that shit for probably 5-6 years straight, and 12 years total off and on. I'm 40 now.

My sleeps been amazing, and what I thought was eczema that I've had for years is going away. Ive tried posting this on bodybuilding forums, and got completely flamed. Soooo. Fuck em. One day when they are in our shoes they'll understand.

Can you and everyone else reporting good results from exogenous E2 post their regimen (how much T they're taking, on what schedule, and how much E2 they're taking, in what form)

Oh, and if anyone has bloodwork, that would be awesome too.

Per my readings on the pharmacokinetics of E2 (at least transdermally), serum levels scale linearly (e.g., 1 mcg would raise blood levels by 1 pg/mL while 50mcg would be expected to raise blood levels by 50 pg/mL)

 

[Coconutz]

Yep ground flaxseed, I’m day 5 into E2 cream and guess what? Loll symptoms are improving, my joints are already better my sleep is better no more hot flashes, itchy scalp is gone and my muscle are becoming more full. This confirma everything. Despite my low SHBG my body clearly doesnt like frequent injections it causes e2 to become to low. Im gunna drop the e2 cream and go to an E5D schedule to hopefully bump up aromitization.

Just wait till the libido comes back!

Can you and everyone else reporting good results from exogenous E2 post their regimen (how much T they're taking, on what schedule, and how much E2 they're taking, in what form)

Oh, and if anyone has bloodwork, that would be awesome too.

Per my readings on the pharmacokinetics of E2 (at least transdermally), serum levels scale linearly (e.g., 1 mcg would raise blood levels by 1 pg/mL while 50mcg would be expected to raise blood levels by 50 pg/mL)

Supplementing exogenous estrogen is the same as test. Everybody's gonna be different and respond to this differently. Gotta find YOUR sweet spot, which I'm still trying to do.

It's been only 2 months for me. But I've been taking test e 30mg IM daily for 6 months or so. Before that I was messing with Test No Ester, which absolutely helps raise e2, but too painful to keep up with daily. 2mg oral estradiol Valerate per 200mg test enanthate is what I'm taking right now. 20mg DHEA in the mornings too..

Like I said in a previous post, eventually I'd like to see how low I can go on my test. Lots more experimenting to do. Especially with progesterone and pregnenelone that used to destroy my libido. I'm guessing from the progesterone antagonizing antagonizing estrogen. Especially dosing frequency. I'd do unspeakable acts if I could get away from daily injections.

But right now, I sleep like a baby, have boners that can chip diamonds, and I feel like a million bucks. I'm not changing a thing for a while.

 

[JustPanicNoDisco]

Just wait till the libido comes back!

Supplementing exogenous estrogen is the same as test. Everybody's gonna be different and respond to this differently. Gotta find YOUR sweet spot, which I'm still trying to do.

It's been only 2 months for me. But I've been taking test e 30mg IM daily for 6 months or so. Before that I was messing with Test No Ester, which absolutely helps raise e2, but too painful to keep up with daily. 2mg oral estradiol Valerate per 200mg test enanthate is what I'm taking right now. 20mg DHEA in the mornings too..

Like I said in a previous post, eventually I'd like to see how low I can go on my test. Lots more experimenting to do. Especially with progesterone and pregnenelone that used to destroy my libido. I'm guessing from the progesterone antagonizing antagonizing estrogen. Especially dosing frequency. I'd do unspeakable acts if I could get away from daily injections.

But right now, I sleep like a baby, have boners that can chip diamonds, and I feel like a million bucks. I'm not changing a thing for a while.

Wiki reports that estradiol valerate has an oral bioavailability of 3-5%, so if you're taking 2000mcg, you're getting 60 - 100 mcg of estrogen per day, thereby raising your e2 levels by about 60-100 pg/mL per day.

Some other people around here have taken much higher doses (100-200 mcg / day injections).

It's interesting to see where everyone's "sweet spot" is.

Question: Does anyone know if using exogenous estradiol can changed aromatase expression? @Cataceous @madman @Nelson Vergel