Progesterone Dose for Men

[Gman86]

Thanks. I have seen Dr. Lichten's video before. Not sure I can get my doc to write a prescription for nandrolone though. Not familiar with the Carnivore Diet and would appreciate some references.

U can always hit up a telemed clinic and get them to just prescribed nandrolone and keep the rest of ur protocol through ur doc now. Some telemed clinics, like frontline alternative medicine, for example, allows u to get prescribed individual compounds, without having to ditch ur current doc.

Checkout Dr Paul Saladino. He has a podcast, as well as a YouTube channel. Both are all about the carnivore diet. He’s really the only resource u need. Lmk if u end up checking him out and have any questions, or just any questions about the diet in general

 

[mhinesii]

U can always hit up a telemed clinic and get them to just prescribed nandrolone and keep the rest of ur protocol through ur doc now. Some telemed clinics, like frontline alternative medicine, for example, allows u to get prescribed individual compounds, without having to ditch ur current doc.

Checkout Dr Paul Saladino. He has a podcast, as well as a YouTube channel. Both are all about the carnivore diet. He’s really the only resource u need. Lmk if u end up checking him out and have any questions, or just any questions about the diet in general

Thanks

 

[Zibernet]

You made the statement, so the burden of proof is with you. And I'm looking for peer-reviewed, scientific research, not Ray Peat's opinion. How many around here would find credible his demonization of estrogen? How much of this is the result of the immunoassay-based test measuring C-reactive protein instead of estradiol?

Hey chill out, no one has a "burden of proof", we are just here exchanging ideas.
I trust Ray Peat's opinion on the topic, I follow his ideas, and they are doing me good.
If you want to follow someone else, go ahead, I was just letting you know.

 

[Gman86]

@Zibernet does Ray Peat have any thoughts on scrotal progesterone cream? If so, do u mind kind of summarizing them for me?

 

[Cataceous]

Hey chill out, no one has a "burden of proof", we are just here exchanging ideas.
I trust Ray Peat's opinion on the topic, I follow his ideas, and they are doing me good.
If you want to follow someone else, go ahead, I was just letting you know.

Ok, didn't intend to sound that intense. Nonetheless, I'm genuinely interested in whether this "idea" has a basis in reality. Googling "Ray Peat Progesterone" produces 10 million hits. Can you narrow this down a bit?

 

[DixieWrecked]

Hey chill out, no one has a "burden of proof", we are just here exchanging ideas.
I trust Ray Peat's opinion on the topic, I follow his ideas, and they are doing me good.
If you want to follow someone else, go ahead, I was just letting you know.

Everyone is chill man. Following typical forum etiquette, you should support the statement you just made and saying research it yourself is not helpful. If we all discussed like this, we would get nowhere. At least provide a link to an article by Ray Peat.

 

[DixieWrecked]

Here is an interesting study I found on promates concerning HCG and progesterone.

Effect of HCG on plasma levels of estrogens and progesterone during the luteal phase of the menstrual cycle in rhesus monkeys (Macaca mulatta). Stimulation of sex steroid production in Rhesus monkeys - PubMed

Effect of HCG on plasma levels of estrogens and progesterone during the luteal phase of the menstrual cycle in rhesus monkeys (Macaca mulatta). Stimulation of sex steroid production in Rhesus monkeys

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Zibernet]

Everyone is chill man.

Are you sure about that?

I trust everyone's common sense to be able to enter the Ray Peat rabbit hole.
It's fascinating to read about all of his energy theories, it is a true eye opener on everything you thought you knew.

Start with his website:

Progesterone Summaries - Progesterone Deceptions - Progesterone Supplementation - Dosage of Progesterone

Ray Peat

raypeat.com

Follow with Georgi Dinkov citations:

Inhibiting estrogen synthesis may treat / prevent ectopic pregnancy – To Extract Knowledge from Matter

 

[Cataceous]

...
Start with his website:

Progesterone Summaries - Progesterone Deceptions - Progesterone Supplementation - Dosage of Progesterone

Ray Peat

raypeat.com

Follow with Georgi Dinkov citations:

Inhibiting estrogen synthesis may treat / prevent ectopic pregnancy – To Extract Knowledge from Matter

These links seem unrelated to the claim that progesterone "expels e2 from tissues". A documented mechanism for progesterone's opposition to estrogen is in its downregulation of the estrogen receptor.[1][2] But making tissues less responsive to estradiol is quite different from making them "expel" estradiol in amounts sufficient to raise serum levels noticeably.

 

[Nocalves]

Always when I add progesterone, my e2 goes down. But everybody is different.

 

[Gman86]

Always when I add progesterone, my e2 goes down. But everybody is different.

Did u notice any subjective changes when u were on progesterone and E2 would decrease?

 

[Zibernet]

Lyle McDonald and Broderick Chavez, after having coached thousands of clients each, are firmly opposed to progesterone, and very much pro e2:

‎Beast Fitness Radio's Podcast on Apple Podcasts

‎Forme et santé · 2022

podcasts.apple.com

 

[Nocalves]

Did u notice any subjective changes when u were on progesterone and E2 would decrease?

Yes, Classic low e2 symptoms..

 

[DixieWrecked]

Lyle McDonald and Broderick Chavez, after having coached thousands of clients each, are firmly opposed to progesterone, and very much pro e2:

‎Beast Fitness Radio's Podcast on Apple Podcasts

‎Forme et santé · 2022

podcasts.apple.com

Is there a time stamp when they start talking about progesterone?

 

[Zibernet]

Is there a time stamp when they start talking about progesterone?

The whole podcast is fascinating, it won't be time lost to listen it all

 

[DixieWrecked]

The whole podcast is fascinating, it won't be time lost to listen it all

You for real? You want people to listen to an hour and a half podcast to find the part where they talk about progesterone, the topic of this thread, because you like it?

The idea is to contribute to this community in ways that are helpful. Making claims and then assigning homework to members to research your claims is at best unhelpful, and at worst idiotic. You seem like you could have great things to contribute if your posts weren't so lazy.

 

[Zibernet]

You for real? You want people to listen to an hour and a half podcast to find the part where they talk about progesterone, the topic of this thread, because you like it?

The idea is to contribute to this community in ways that are helpful. Making claims and then assigning homework to members to research your claims is at best unhelpful, and at worst idiotic. You seem like you could have great things to contribute if your posts weren't so lazy.

I guess everyone contributes to the amount they have time or energy for.
I'm just laying info here, so that anyone more courageous than I am can dig and perfect their knowledge with this material.

I didn't know my small contribution to this community would cause so much anger. I'm sorry for upsetting you.

 

[Gman86]

Does anyone know whether progesterone is catabolic or improves protein synthesis? I’ve seen info saying that it’s catabolic and breaks down muscle, but I’ve also seen info showing that it greatly increase protein synthesis. @Cataceous would u know by any chance?

 

[Cataceous]

Does anyone know whether progesterone is catabolic or improves protein synthesis? I’ve seen info saying that it’s catabolic and breaks down muscle, but I’ve also seen info showing that it greatly increase protein synthesis. @Cataceous would u know by any chance?

I don't know, but it doesn't sound like there's a significant effect at typical male serum levels: "The metabolic effects of progesterone are most relevant to pregnancy."[1] The article suggests catabolism: "On protein metabolism, it has been suggested that progesterone may have a catabolic action in man, and that the basic effects may be a lowering of several plasma amino acids and an increased total urinary nitrogen excretion without an associated aminoaciduria." It's a reason to keep levels physiological.

 

[Gman86]

I don't know, but it doesn't sound like there's a significant effect at typical male serum levels: "The metabolic effects of progesterone are most relevant to pregnancy."[1] The article suggests catabolism: "On protein metabolism, it has been suggested that progesterone may have a catabolic action in man, and that the basic effects may be a lowering of several plasma amino acids and an increased total urinary nitrogen excretion without an associated aminoaciduria." It's a reason to keep levels physiological.

Checkout this quick video if u have time. He seems to think that progesterone definitely helps with gaining muscle, I’m curious if u think his conclusions are correct or if u see any issues with how he came to those conclusions.