Nandrolone ( Deca Durabolin) Improves Joint Pain in Hypogonadal Men Within 8 Weeks
- Thread starter Nelson Vergel
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- nandrolone pain
masters2121
New Member
I used 100mg per week for 10 weeks and noticed nothing but nipple sensitivity, im a sensitive guy.... I should have ran it for 20 weeks minimum imo at that dosage. I was trying to see if a small dosage would affect my shoulder any. Trying to avoid surgery. If i had to do it over again I'd probably do it for 3-6 months at low dosage again. My bp spikes pretty easily, so i keep my trt dosage pretty normal and anything else added mild. Im just an aaverag guy so i cant give any advice. I just know from my studies and experience i wasted that bottle and if i run it again im going twice as long.
Another Great Day
Active Member
Thank you very much. I noticed a post about increased LDL and looked up the side effects which do include elevated LDL. Did you ave any issues? I will ask Defy if I can try next month when I have my follow up. Thanks again!
masters2121
New Member
I did this last year up through November. Just had labs done. HDL 34, LDL 114, Total 159,normal. Triglycerides were 54, low. My hdl has been low since trt started. I eat strict paleo diet and exercise 6 days a week. Any steroid will suppress hdl and raise ldl from my experience and studies. Higher doses = increased side effects. Imo ldl can be managed for 20 weeks or however long if diet is strict, cardio up, and supporting your body with some supplements. I always take a cycle support guys use on orals, just to try and optimize my health.
Another Great Day
Active Member
Great - thanks!
Another Great Day
Active Member
Thanks!
It definitely works for joints. I’m on a low dose, 80mg/wk along with TRT. It took about 8 weeks but it was like OMG, I am nearly pain free after over a decade. I even started doing leg extensions with 100lbs with no pain and minimal knee creaking. Prior to treatment, I could barely extend my knee and hold it straight without pain, with no weights. That’s a huge improvement. I’m getting bloods later this month and will post back with any anomalies, but I plan to keep this up. Don’t want to go back feeling like an old man again.
Another Great Day
Active Member
Currently a patient at Defy. I asked a few months ago and was told I would need verification of shoulder surgery, or joint pain that had been treated. I checked with another antiaging clinic in the Midwest. They would prescribe but the cost was 4 times higher than average than the price at the local pharmacy.
Another Great Day
Active Member
I worked in the industry and understand why many drugs require a prescription but many of these products are only "allowed" with a physician's "approval" many people fully understand the benefits and risks of drugs but are not allowed access to them. Black market is an option but the risk of product quality is to high. Thanks!
Many concierge style medical centers will provide this treatment - but there’s is a whole protocol and timeline that needs to occur first. 1) you need to be a TRT patient for probably at least a year, 2) estrogen must be dialed in, 3) most places want you to try some GH releasing peptide to see if that helps (it usually does) 4) if pain still persists then you need to supply documented medical evidence of the injury which they evaluate (and may very well decline). It’s not for everyone – and quite frankly GH peptides work pretty well for most joint issues – in my case I had documented evidence going back over 20 years of chronic joint pain, surgeries, bone breaks – you name it – it took me probably about three or four months even to gather all the medical records
Another Great Day
Active Member
Would you mind sharing which peptides were successful in your treatment? Thanks!
Mk677 worked very well but I had too much water weight gain even at 12.5 mg/day. I then switched to Ipamorelin which also had a good healing and recomp effect (lost fat). Either of these helped a lot of my nagging joint issues but some of my injuries were a bit too much - which is why I had to start Nandrolone. But I bet most guys would find some relief with these peptides.
Another Great Day
Active Member
Thanks
Vince
Super Moderator
When you were using Nandrolone, did you adjust any of your other trt protocol. What about of testosterone and HCG were you using, along with your 100 mg of Nandrolone? Did you also take a testosterone panel at the time? If you did, can you post results.
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
Novel pilot study
Introduction
Nandrolone’s complex relationship with joint health extends beyond healing in the rotator cuff model. Interestingly, various members of online bodybuilding communities and discussion boards have frequently asserted that nandrolone alleviates joint pain (16). While there have been two double-blind, placebo-controlled trials showing that nandrolone alleviates bone pain in post-menopausal osteoporosis, studies specifically evaluating joint pain are quite limited (62,63). In 1987, Bird et al. conducted a controlled trial in postmenopausal women with rheumatoid arthritis in which the intervention arm received intramuscular ND 50 mg every 3 weeks for 2 years finding no significant difference in joint or bone pain compared with the control arm as assessed by visual analog scales (64). Despite the equivocal findings in rheumatoid arthritis, there are two trials that, while limited, do support a role for nandrolone in the alleviation of non-inflammatory arthralgia. Darracott et al. found that, compared to placebo, weekly intramuscular ND resulted in clinically improved symptoms and patellar bone density measurements after 6 weeks in patients with patellofemoral pain syndrome, a condition in which patients experience peripatellar pain at the patellofemoral joint (65,66). More recently, Hohmann et al. conducted a double-blind, placebo-controlled randomized trial of ND in 10 patients who underwent total knee arthroplasty and were followed for 1 year. They found a significant improvement in quadriceps strength throughout the post-operative period in addition to improved Knee Society Score (KSS) at 6 weeks, 6 months, and 12 months in the group receiving nandrolone (67). The KSS includes an assessment of knee pain in its composite score but, unfortunately, the authors did not report the pain subscore specifically (68). Therefore, while promising, it is unclear if this study provides any evidence about nandrolone’s prospective use for joint pain.
As evidenced above, there is very little concrete data referencing any effect nandrolone may have regarding the alleviation of joint pain. However, nandrolone does have well-documented advantageous effects on bone and muscle along with quality trials showing its benefit in osteoporotic bone pain and historical documentation of its efficacy for patellofemoral pain syndrome. Therefore, it is reasonable to postulate that the anecdotal evidence ascribing non-inflammatory joint pain relief to nandrolone may be accurate. Additionally, male hypogonadism is linked with comorbidities such as diabetes and obesity, which are often associated with significant and debilitating joint pain (69,70). In such patients, the addition of nandrolone to their testosterone replacement regimen would avoid the potential side effect of ED, as discussed earlier, resulting in a highly-tolerable option for pain management, if efficacious.
The objective of the pilot study
Due to the paucity of research surrounding nandrolone and objective measurement of non-inflammatory joint pain—we designed a novel prospective pilot study to evaluate, quantify, and characterize the effects of ND on joint pain in hypogonadal men.
Methods
Study participants
All adult men with the diagnosis of hypogonadism (confirmed by sequential morning serum testosterone value of less than 300 ng/dL) who were currently using injectable intramuscular TTh were screened for the presence of joint pain at a single high-volume andrology clinic in Houston, Texas from August 2018 to January 2019. Inclusion criteria were men, aged 21–70 years old, confirmed diagnosis of hypogonadism currently treated with injectable intramuscular TTh, and report of significant joint pain at the screening. Exclusion criteria included prior nandrolone usage, inability to give informed consent, inability to perform intramuscular self-injection, an earlier diagnosis of solid organ cancer, and significant cardiovascular disease. All participants gave informed consent before inclusion in the study. The proposed study was reviewed and approved by our institutional review board.
Intervention
Eligible participants initiated intramuscular ND dosed at one-half of their current testosterone cypionate regimen (e.g., a participant using 200 mg testosterone cypionate weekly would continue that dose in addition to beginning 100 mg ND weekly). All other medications, including testosterone dosage, were kept constant throughout the trial period. The dose of ND was also kept constant until all data was collected.
Source: Nandrolone decanoate relieves joint pain in hypogonadal men: a novel prospective pilot study and review of the literature - PMC
Introduction
Nandrolone’s complex relationship with joint health extends beyond healing in the rotator cuff model. Interestingly, various members of online bodybuilding communities and discussion boards have frequently asserted that nandrolone alleviates joint pain (16). While there have been two double-blind, placebo-controlled trials showing that nandrolone alleviates bone pain in post-menopausal osteoporosis, studies specifically evaluating joint pain are quite limited (62,63). In 1987, Bird et al. conducted a controlled trial in postmenopausal women with rheumatoid arthritis in which the intervention arm received intramuscular ND 50 mg every 3 weeks for 2 years finding no significant difference in joint or bone pain compared with the control arm as assessed by visual analog scales (64). Despite the equivocal findings in rheumatoid arthritis, there are two trials that, while limited, do support a role for nandrolone in the alleviation of non-inflammatory arthralgia. Darracott et al. found that, compared to placebo, weekly intramuscular ND resulted in clinically improved symptoms and patellar bone density measurements after 6 weeks in patients with patellofemoral pain syndrome, a condition in which patients experience peripatellar pain at the patellofemoral joint (65,66). More recently, Hohmann et al. conducted a double-blind, placebo-controlled randomized trial of ND in 10 patients who underwent total knee arthroplasty and were followed for 1 year. They found a significant improvement in quadriceps strength throughout the post-operative period in addition to improved Knee Society Score (KSS) at 6 weeks, 6 months, and 12 months in the group receiving nandrolone (67). The KSS includes an assessment of knee pain in its composite score but, unfortunately, the authors did not report the pain subscore specifically (68). Therefore, while promising, it is unclear if this study provides any evidence about nandrolone’s prospective use for joint pain.
As evidenced above, there is very little concrete data referencing any effect nandrolone may have regarding the alleviation of joint pain. However, nandrolone does have well-documented advantageous effects on bone and muscle along with quality trials showing its benefit in osteoporotic bone pain and historical documentation of its efficacy for patellofemoral pain syndrome. Therefore, it is reasonable to postulate that the anecdotal evidence ascribing non-inflammatory joint pain relief to nandrolone may be accurate. Additionally, male hypogonadism is linked with comorbidities such as diabetes and obesity, which are often associated with significant and debilitating joint pain (69,70). In such patients, the addition of nandrolone to their testosterone replacement regimen would avoid the potential side effect of ED, as discussed earlier, resulting in a highly-tolerable option for pain management, if efficacious.
The objective of the pilot study
Due to the paucity of research surrounding nandrolone and objective measurement of non-inflammatory joint pain—we designed a novel prospective pilot study to evaluate, quantify, and characterize the effects of ND on joint pain in hypogonadal men.
Methods
Study participants
All adult men with the diagnosis of hypogonadism (confirmed by sequential morning serum testosterone value of less than 300 ng/dL) who were currently using injectable intramuscular TTh were screened for the presence of joint pain at a single high-volume andrology clinic in Houston, Texas from August 2018 to January 2019. Inclusion criteria were men, aged 21–70 years old, confirmed diagnosis of hypogonadism currently treated with injectable intramuscular TTh, and report of significant joint pain at the screening. Exclusion criteria included prior nandrolone usage, inability to give informed consent, inability to perform intramuscular self-injection, an earlier diagnosis of solid organ cancer, and significant cardiovascular disease. All participants gave informed consent before inclusion in the study. The proposed study was reviewed and approved by our institutional review board.
Intervention
Eligible participants initiated intramuscular ND dosed at one-half of their current testosterone cypionate regimen (e.g., a participant using 200 mg testosterone cypionate weekly would continue that dose in addition to beginning 100 mg ND weekly). All other medications, including testosterone dosage, were kept constant throughout the trial period. The dose of ND was also kept constant until all data was collected.
Source: Nandrolone decanoate relieves joint pain in hypogonadal men: a novel prospective pilot study and review of the literature - PMC
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