I get anxiety when using hCG with TRT

[DS3]

@DS3 also, did u notice any differences in regards to labs with Empower’s HCG and novarel?

@Gman86 My T-dosage and overall protocol have changed since I last used Empower HCG so I don't have a valid comparison between labs. The benefits I have seen from Novarel to Empower HCG have namely been subjective cognitive and emotional benefits. Testicular stimulation seems to be similar if not identical.

 

[Gman86]

What have you heard about kisspeptin? What I've learned so far makes me think that it will require concurrent use of a SERM for guys on TRT. Otherwise, even if it stimulates GnRH production it may not yield gonadotropins—LH and FSH.

Oh very interesting. I haven’t done much research on it actually. Just keep hearing it might be a good alternative to HCG

 

[Gman86]

@Gman86 My T-dosage and overall protocol have changed since I last used Empower HCG so I don't have a valid comparison between labs. The benefits I have seen from Novarel to Empower HCG have namely been subjective cognitive and emotional benefits. Testicular stimulation seems to be similar if not identical.

Thanks for anecdotal report. Reliablerx has sifasi HCG, which is generic novarel, for $14.28 for 5,000iu’s. I know a guy that uses this brand and reports that it works really well. May give it a shot

Where do u get ur novarel and how much do u pay, if u don’t mind me asking.

 

[Still Feel Young]

What is Novarel.

If this question has not yet been answered: Novarel is brand name HCG

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Dr. Saya's minimal research indicates higher doses are needed.

Not really. His chart shows higher more sustained levels are achieved with higher doses. However, that does not mean that more per week or higher doses are actually better, or "needed".

Chrisler discussed the possible desirability of daily dosing small amounts which would provide more minimal baseline and peaks.

What's better? From the anecdotes of many many men, it varies tremendously.

I am taking 200iu EOD, that is my sweet spot.

 

[Stylo]

Forget the studies. I take 350iu a week split into EOD, and getting all of the benefits from it. Start low with 100iu a week as stated earlier and work your way up. Dont sweat it.

 

[Gman86]

Forget the studies. I take 350iu a week split into EOD, and getting all of the benefits from it. Start low with 100iu a week as stated earlier and work your way up. Dont sweat it.

What brand of HCG do u use?

 

[Stylo]

What brand of HCG do u use?

Empower. Perhaps it works too well that it has side effects for some. When I started TRT, I was given Test C, HCG and Anastrozole all to be taken twice a week. I did this for 12 weeks and when the doc changed my protocol, I decided to drop HCG and the AI altogether while raising my T dosage instead. I let my balls shrink to the size of shelled almonds, and tried to enjoy life. Another 12 weeks passed and I decided to add HCG at 100iu EOD. My protocol has been 50mg of Test C EOD, alternated by 100iu HCG EOD. No AI. Balls swole up, semen output has been like it used to be , and nothing feels off. This is a simple as it gets for me. No tweaking protocols just because my weekend sucked, or something didnt go my way. The least amount of HCG is always best coupled with a healthy amount of androgens. Some Docs like to put us on max HCG and the least amount of T for some reason. For me, its not optimal to depend on HCG for Endogenous T production. Its good for keeping things working as originally intended. The benefits are many. So keep it simple.

 

[Gman86]

Empower. Perhaps it works too well that it has side effects for some. When I started TRT, I was given Test C, HCG and Anastrozole all to be taken twice a week. I did this for 12 weeks and when the doc changed my protocol, I decided to drop HCG and the AI altogether while raising my T dosage instead. I let my balls shrink to the size of shelled almonds, and tried to enjoy life. Another 12 weeks passed and I decided to add HCG at 100iu EOD. My protocol has been 50mg of Test C EOD, alternated by 100iu HCG EOD. No AI. Balls swole up, semen output has been like it used to be , and nothing feels off. This is a simple as it gets for me. No tweaking protocols just because my weekend sucked, or something didnt go my way. The least amount of HCG is always best coupled with a healthy amount of androgens. Some Docs like to put us on max HCG and the least amount of T for some reason. For me, its not optimal to depend on HCG for Endogenous T production. Its good for keeping things working as originally intended. The benefits are many. So keep it simple.

Well fckn said! Couldn’t agree more with everything u just said. Thanks for the reply. So u definitely noticed a big difference in testicle size and semen output with the 350iu’s per week of EMPOWER’s HCG? I’ve gone on and off it, and don’t seem to notice any difference in either. I used to be very secondary, maybe I’m not anymore or something.

 

[Stylo]

Absolutely. I went from almost no balls to normal sized balls that don’t sag,but are big enough to feel the difference. I dont pay too much attention to it anymore actually, mainly because they feel normal. Less is more when it comes to the stuff.

 

[Westin]

Empower. Perhaps it works too well that it has side effects for some. When I started TRT, I was given Test C, HCG and Anastrozole all to be taken twice a week. I did this for 12 weeks and when the doc changed my protocol, I decided to drop HCG and the AI altogether while raising my T dosage instead. I let my balls shrink to the size of shelled almonds, and tried to enjoy life. Another 12 weeks passed and I decided to add HCG at 100iu EOD. My protocol has been 50mg of Test C EOD, alternated by 100iu HCG EOD. No AI. Balls swole up, semen output has been like it used to be , and nothing feels off. This is a simple as it gets for me. No tweaking protocols just because my weekend sucked, or something didnt go my way. The least amount of HCG is always best coupled with a healthy amount of androgens. Some Docs like to put us on max HCG and the least amount of T for some reason. For me, its not optimal to depend on HCG for Endogenous T production. Its good for keeping things working as originally intended. The benefits are many. So keep it simple.

Interesting. Im about to go from 120mg TC split 3 X weekly (40mg) to 150mg split (50mg) 3 X weekly. I had dropped the HCG due to E2 but did notice some shrinkage.

So is the 150TC Split is 3 X a week or literally every other day? The 100iu is 3 times a week? HCG isnt causing E2 issues but reversing the shrinkage?

Just want to make sure Im accurate because Im about to go there? How much TC were you on before 150mg, or did you start there?

Thanks.

 

[Stylo]

I suck at math, so lets see if I have this right for 150mg a week. EOD breaks down into 3x one week and 4x the following week. So you have to work with it in two week intervals. 150x2weeks=300. 300 divided by 7 equals roughly 43mg. So you want to take 43mg EOD.
My original protocol was 160mg a week, 800iu HCG a week and 1mg Anastrozole a week. The bump on TC wasnt dramatic, but I cut my HCG intake down to more than half. The idea is to stimulate leydig cells with small pulses of HCG as if it were my body doing it naturally. 2 large shots of HCG can spike E and cause some side effects. So yes balls have responded to the smaller doses of HCG without the nastyness it can bring when overdosing.

 

[Westin]

What?

 

[Cataceous]

.. The idea is to stimulate leydig cells with small pulses of HCG as if it were my body doing it naturally. ...

This doesn't work because hCG has a half-life of around one or two days, whereas the LH you're trying to replace has a half-life of around 20 minutes. Regular low doses of hCG may simulate the normal LH background levels, but not the pulses. This difference may at least partly explain why hCG causes excess aromatization.

 

[Stylo]

Like I said, forget the studies and all of the brainy stuff. Exhibit A: shows that my balls were non existent, and HCG at 100iu EOD brought them back. So it works. Youre right, Pulsations is not the correct word to describe it since a single shot does not mimic that.

 

[DS3]

Like I said, forget the studies and all of the brainy stuff. Exhibit A: shows that my balls were non existent, and HCG at 100iu EOD brought them back. So it works. Youre right, Pulsations is not the correct word to describe it since a single shot does not mimic that.

@Cataceous is just trying to say that HCG does not mimic physiological pulses of endogenous LH due to its long half-life. Whether or not smaller dosages work for you (as they seem to but a semen analysis would be required for confirmation) is inconsequential to that fact.

 

[jerzy]

I've tried starting HCG several times over the last two years with similar results. By day 7 I start to have anxiety from it. I've tried 500 eod, 350, and 250 with the same results. I keep trying because it helps with my mood and well being the first couple of days. The doc seemed stumped, but I told him I stopped it. He didn't seem concerned. Thoughts

Hey I have had the same thing happen. I did it for 2 weeks or so first week 1,000IU EOD, and then 500 IU EOD and stopped my balls are hurting and getting back to work so Im done with PCT finally. It did I feel like mess with my mood

 

[JmarkH]

Hey I have had the same thing happen. I did it for 2 weeks or so first week 1,000IU EOD, and then 500 IU EOD and stopped my balls are hurting and getting back to work so Im done with PCT finally.

Could it possibly be because 1,000iu EOD is 4x-8x a standard weekly dose? I get that fertility doses are higher, but surely there is a reasonable limit.