Quick Survey

[madman]

Yeah my blood work was done at 0830. I have another appointment for the same time coming up where I hope they will run more labs. I am really hoping there is a doctor that will at least allow me to try TRT and see if it effects my symptoms. From everything I have read it is clear-cut Low Testosterone but I don't have a medical background so I'll just have to wait and find out what a professional says.

I would not say clear cut low but borderline low (low/normal) especially for your age but you still need to know where your free t sits!

 

[madman]

As you can see https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4648196/figure/F1/ under 15 nmol/L or roughly 425 ng/dl is when low t symptoms generally seem to occur.

 

[FeelingLost]

Yeah my blood work was done at 0830. I have another appointment for the same time coming up where I hope they will run more labs. I am really hoping there is a doctor that will at least allow me to try TRT and see if it effects my symptoms. From everything I have read it is clear-cut Low Testosterone but I don't have a medical background so I'll just have to wait and find out what a professional says.

Don't hope use the list Madman gave you and get it to your doc asap or just use that list when you contact discountlabs. Whatever you do don't piss your Dr. off you will need him/her for the physical Defy requires before they will accept you as a patient.

 

[DaveK22]

showing all symptoms of Low T except ED;

You should elaborate on this a bit

 

[madman]

Here is another study regarding total t threshold level in younger many. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bju.12970/full

 

[mckbrooks96]

You should elaborate on this a bit

Just to recap, I'm 21 so that should show the significance of how much this is effecting me.

1) Low Libido (to the point where my gorgeous wife has put on lingerie and I've told her I'm not interested, partially because I'm tired as hell 24/7 and because I'm just not interested in having sex)
2) Zero energy. I work a desk job so it's not like I have a reason to be tired, however I get off work at 330 and as soon as I sit down at home I pass out most days.
3) I go to the gym 5 times per week for 1-2hrs a day and have seen zero improvement. (To elaborate, my workout partner and I started at the same weight/reps and could run about the same distance/speed. He has now doubled his free weights and his bench has increased by 30%. I have increased by 10% putting in the exact same amount of work, however I eat a much cleaner diet.)
4) Mood swings (which is why the doctor thought I had bipolar. I have a two year old daughter (not bio) and I can't seem to control my temper no matter how minor the situation.)
5) Depression and Anxiety (This has been a factor for a few years but I have been prescribed over a dozen different medications and none of them have ever taken the edge off, but I know they're not placebos because occasionally I will get the bad side effects like suicidal thoughts, despite having everything in life I could ever ask for. Leading me to believe I have a chemical imbalance.)

I also believe I may have fertility issues. I have purposefully tried to have kids in the past to no avail. I have not had any fertility tests done though so I can't completely confirm this, but my wife is extremely fertile, leading me to think it's me.

Also seems like I have gynecomastia but not to the extent of some people, just that I carry more weight in my "tits" than most people. Seems much more noticeable when I am seated than standing. I also have tenderness near my nipples commonly which I have chalked up to high E2 after reading on various forums.

These things are all starting to effect my marriage and my role as a father. I want to be able to play with my kid after work, I want to be able to keep a level head and not get angry over the little things, and I want to have my libido back. It's not fair to my wife that she now thinks that I'm either cheating on her or not interested purely because I don't have libido. For a 21 year old couple it is pretty devastating to not have a sexual relationship. I can understand being in our 40s, done with having kids, settled in and ready to be empty-nesters but at 21 it doesn't seem healthy. At this point I'm almost willing to do anything to get a "normal" life back.

 

[mckbrooks96]

Try and get an average from multiple tests and do the other tests mentioned. The lower lab ranges now are bullshit. Too many people test in 900’s naturally for those ranges to make any sense. Should be less than 1%.

Id expect something 600+ TT at 21. A place like Defy makes a lot of sense to me. I’d give a restart a try. If you need TRT just make sure you know what you want. You probably could stay fertile with HCG, but it’s not guaranteed. Can’t tell you how many friends when your age never wanted kids and have multiple in their 30s.

Yeah we already have one kid (hers) and so we aren't too worried about kids if I do have fertility issues. I have already discussed that possibility with her and she is on-board even if that is the case. I would be lying if I said I didn't want a biological kid but it's not something I would lose sleep over if every thing else got better.

Don't hope use the list Madman gave you and get it to your doc asap or just use that list when you contact discountlabs. Whatever you do don't piss your Dr. off you will need him/her for the physical Defy requires before they will accept you as a patient.

Will do, I've written down what tests are needed to see if the doctor will put the order in. If not, I'll at least stay cordial enough to get a physical done. I noticed you are in Denver, I'm actually in Colorado Springs. Is there a local doctor that you see? If you wouldn't mind giving that information?

 

[FeelingLost]

Will do, I've written down what tests are needed to see if the doctor will put the order in. If not, I'll at least stay cordial enough to get a physical done. I noticed you are in Denver, I'm actually in Colorado Springs. Is there a local doctor that you see? If you wouldn't mind giving that information?

All the Uros and Endos are booked for weeks and only really interested in cancer. TRT is a waste of appointment time to them. I'm a Defy patient.

Just so you know if you start a mono tes program it will shut your balls down that means no sperm no natural Tes production. Your balls will atrophy 10-20% in size and pull back up close to your body like when you were 11 years old.
You will be tied to the needle or compounding cream for the next 50 years.

 

[mckbrooks96]

All the Uros and Endos are booked for weeks and only really interested in cancer. TRT is a waste of appointment time to them. I'm a Defy patient.

Just so you know if you start a mono tes program it will shut your balls down that means no sperm no natural Tes production. Your balls will atrophy 10-20% in size and pull back up close to your body like when you were 11 years old.
You will be tied to the needle or compounding cream for the next 50 years.

Yes I know and I am completely at terms with that. As long as I can live my youth I wouldn't care if it took 5 years off my lifespan. I just want to get some good quality years and if I'm already feeling this way I can't imagine being 50.

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

While I agree with much of what's been suggested here, I have a different overall perspective. I think many people who have been transformationally helped by hormone- based solutions tend to jump to hormones as an answer; kind of the "if you have a hammer everything looks like a nail" syndrome. While low T may be part of your issue, either as a primary cause or as a downstream result of some other issue, your symptoms sound like they could come from many other sources such as an infection, thyroid issues, food intolerances, nutrient issues, or various other things.


You might want to consider consulting with one of the leading Functional Medicine docs like Dr. Ruscio or Cole to try to get a broader investigation of what is at the core of your issues. I think Defy is outstanding when it comes to hormones, but seems to be rather mainstream when you get into any issues outside of hormones. I'm not saying hormones may not be a good temporary or possibly permanent fix, but I would bet there is something else going on as well that needs to be fixed. I had some of your symptoms at one point and radically changing my diet was a big part of fixing them. Just my two cents.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

Hey guys I'm new to TRT and just looking to find a little more information. I haven't seen anything like this yet and thought it would be interesting.

Starting Total Testosterone:
Current Total Testosterone:
Treatment Type:
Length of Treatment:

I'm not sure if this is allowed here but essentially I'm just trying to find out if my total testosterone level is something to be worried about. (21 year old with 380ng/dL, showing all symptoms of Low T except ED; Range given was 195-836.)

Also if it's acceptable I would be interested in seeing who is treating you. I spoke with my GP and he basically told me that I was "Normal and operating perfect for my age."

For next time, the easiest way is to create a poll by starting a new thread and clicking Go Advanced, as shown below.

 

[ERO]

I believe Defy will accept labs that have been run within a certain number of days prior to your contacting them. Call them and ask. They won't dodge your question.

Yes, labs done within I believe 90 days are good to go. Do give them a call and ask all the hard questions!

 

[ratbag]

Endocrinologists are really the frontline MD's for diabetes and thyroid. Yet because they are governed by hospital administration or medical school they only look at lab results and they'll only respond if you are way out of range, otherwise you get pronounced as normal! Lets face it the whole world has hormone issues simply because all forms of pollution are endocrine disruptors. Our hormone levels on average are far lower than they were 50 years ago. Endocrinologists spend their time looking at lab results. The problem with this is that their determinations are based upon the reference ranges used. The ranges used today are based upon the public's average ranges which are already too low. So because you are in range they deem you to be normal.

This is where private hormone specialists are different. Like Defy our sponsor. They know lab ranges are too low and they know what it takes to make you feel normal (in most cases). Hospital MD's and PCP's are only following what they were taught and they won't do more because it'll cost more and in their opinion isn't necessary. Yet millions of people go to their MD's with complaints and for the large part are diagnosed as being normal. This is the difference between endocrinologists and the specialists who are constantly re-educating themselves. The private specialists know how to make you feel better because of evidenced based medicine. They have learned the hard way what works and why and take the time to get your protocol right. This is something the average MD doesn't have time to do.. and even if they did have the time, the admin wouldn't let them run the extra labs needed to do so. Lets face it... it's politics!

 

[rb44]

21 year old here as well that has struggled with Low T, so I know how you feel. Many doctors turned me away because of my age and told me I was in the normal range even with a TT level of 186. I contacted Defy and did all the labs and ended up going the clomid route with 12.5 mg ED and noticed an immediate improvement. TT jumped up to 788 and all my low t symptoms are gone. Would highly recommend going thru Defy and giving Clomid a try before jumping into TRT.

Happy to answer any questions you have! Best of luck

 

[JMP]

I agree with rb44. Go speak with Defy (I am a patient as well) and give clomid a try. It can't hurt and will possibly help tremendously. If it doesn't work, TRT is an option later on. I am in my low to mid 40's and had a 380 TT when I sought help from Defy. Many of the same symptoms as you are experiencing. At about 7 months into TRT, I couldn't imagine going back to how I felt before (and neither could my wife). Don't let a doctor tell you everything is fine if you don't feel fine. I got the same run around and finally took matters into my own hands. Fight for a better life for you and your family. It can happen with time, patience, and the proper care. Good luck!

 

[ratbag]

This shows how important it is to work with an MD that really knows what to do with TRT. The more your MD knows the more options you have and the better chance of success. However using clomid isn't as simple as that. Clomid works best on younger people. The majority of people on this site are older... I understand that it works for you but older people experience many bad symptoms on clomid, this is common information. It's great this has helped you and I'm glad you shared this info with us because it's important for us all to understand what works for who.