My clinic says gel is less suppressive than injectables and easier to come off

[transetpmedia]

I’ve been on TRT for coming up to 3 years. Due to having various issues with it, I am considering trying to come off it. I was on cypionate for 1.5 years, then sustanon for a year and now testogel for last 4/5 months. I enquired about stopping with my clinic and they said that gel was less suppressive than injectables and so no PCT is required. Besides the half life clearance time of injections be gel, is recovery from gel actually quicker? From what he is saying it’s like suggesting that my fsh and lh would have risen since I moved to gel but I would have thought it would still be tanked regardless.

 

[Seagal]

I’ve been on TRT for coming up to 3 years. Due to having various issues with it, I am considering trying to come off it. I was on cypionate for 1.5 years, then sustanon for a year and now testogel for last 4/5 months. I enquired about stopping with my clinic and they said that gel was less suppressive than injectables and so no PCT is required. Besides the half life clearance time of injections be gel, is recovery from gel actually quicker?

I recall one study that found that after about one week after cessation of T gel, that men returned to baseline T levels. I think that heavily depends on the duration of the TRT period and whether HCG was used and of course there is inter-individual variability.

From what he is saying it’s like suggesting that my fsh and lh would have risen since I moved to gel but I would have thought it would still be tanked regardless.

For me LH and FSH was close to zero on androgel. However, mine were not tested prior to starting TRT, thus I don't know the difference. Only a blood test can tell how your individual response is, comparing LH on injections vs gel.

The T gel will be cleared within one week, that's imo a big advantage compared to your previous injections of long esters.

 

[Systemlord]

Besides the half life clearance time of injections be gel, is recovery from gel actually quicker?

Yes. I recovered HPTA functionality after 8 days stopping oral T which has a similar half-life to T gels. I didn't feel bad the week I stopped either, I actually felt better 2 days after stopping. I woke up on day 8 feeling better and that's how I knew and confirmed it with labs the next day.

My HPTA recovery log: I have reversed my type 2 diabetes (SHBG 31/glucose 80) and may have never had hypogonadism!!

I’ve made the decision to come off TRT and restore my natural hormone production and reverse my diabetes. I’ve identified my problems on TRT and they are as follows, Testosterone suppresses hepcidin, which is a peptide hormone that regulates iron absorption. When hepcidin is suppressed more iron...

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From what he is saying it’s like suggesting that my fsh and lh would have risen since I moved to gel but I would have thought it would still be tanked regardless.

No, this isn't right.

 

[transetpmedia]

Yes. I recovered HPTA functionality after 8 days stopping oral T which has a similar half-life to T gels. I didn't feel bad the week I stopped either, I actually felt better 2 days after stopping. I woke up on day 8 feeling better and that's how I knew and confirmed it with labs the next day.

My HPTA recovery log: I have reversed my type 2 diabetes (SHBG 31/glucose 80) and may have never had hypogonadism!!

I’ve made the decision to come off TRT and restore my natural hormone production and reverse my diabetes. I’ve identified my problems on TRT and they are as follows, Testosterone suppresses hepcidin, which is a peptide hormone that regulates iron absorption. When hepcidin is suppressed more iron...

www.excelmale.com

No, this isn't right.

Back to baseline in 8 days? Damn, I’m quite surprised by that. People talk about horror stories after stopping injectable, maybe they should just take gel for the interim rather than serms.

Was that Jatenzo if I recall correctly? How do you feel off?

 

[madman]

I’ve been on TRT for coming up to 3 years. Due to having various issues with it, I am considering trying to come off it. I was on cypionate for 1.5 years, then sustanon for a year and now testogel for last 4/5 months. I enquired about stopping with my clinic and they said that gel was less suppressive than injectables and so no PCT is required. Besides the half life clearance time of injections be gel, is recovery from gel actually quicker? From what he is saying it’s like suggesting that my fsh and lh would have risen since I moved to gel but I would have thought it would still be tanked regardless.

Transitioning from injectable to TD gel would cause less suppression overall of the hpta but keep in mind the gel will still have a strong impact on the hpta.

At least the TD formulation has a much shorter half-life and will be out of your system quicker.

Natural Test Shut Down

Howdy, Basic question--I tried the search feature but could not find definitive information on the following. The specific question: Is there a dosing of Testosterone Enanthate (in mg per week) below which you can expect to preserve what is left of natural testosterone production? Does the...

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Maximus: Oral TRT+ (native T + enclomiphene + pregnenolone)

Because the oral testosterone need hundreds of mg, it requires a specially formualted tablet to get absorbed by the lymphatic system. I'm on Jaetnzo @237 mg twice daily, or 3318 mg per week.

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FIGURE 1 | Percent change in mean gonadotropin levels (LH & FSH), from baseline through 6 months of testosterone treatment. Nasal testosterone (blue), dosed t.i.d., adapted from (15), n = 33. Topical testosterone (orange), dosed daily, adapted from (9), n = 123. IM injectable - 100 mg testosterone enanthate, (red), adapted from (10), n = 10. All changes from baseline were statistically significant. Nasal testosterone—FSH p = 0.03, all others p < 0.001. Standard error calculated using the delta method

Novel administration methods for treating low testosterone

Novel methods for the treatment of low testosterone (2023) Julius Fink & Shigeo Horie Abstract Introduction Testosterone replacement therapy is a promising and growing field in modern healthcare. Several novel testosterone preparations aiming at providing an efficient drug without side...

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Figure 6: Effects of different types of T preparations on FSH (dark grey) and LH (light grey). Data from [22] [14]

My reply from an older thread: Advantage to tapering down my test before starting my pct?


No need to taper when coming off testosterone using replacement doses.

When abusing testosterone/AAS in high-doses.....sure as it can soften the blow before starting a course of pct but keep in mind that the crash is inevitable and to what degree /length depends on many factors.

Recovery of the HPG axis will come down to dosage of testosterone/AAS used, duration of use, type of AAS used whether T only or T+AAS or T + multiple AAS), age of the individual.

Older men would tend to have a more difficult time recovering than younger men.

Higher doses and longer duration of use will have a greater negative impact on the recovery of the HPG axis

Use of nandrolone or trenbolone will have a greater negative effect on the recovery of the HPG axis

On average most men on trt are injecting 100-200 mg/week of testosterone only and the duration of use can be anywhere from months to years depending on whether the individual continues trt indefinitely or decides to come off such as in your case.

Use of PCT (post cycle therapy) will in no way prevent the crash following HPG axis recovery it will just soften the blow and speed up the recovery process/minimize the length of being in a hypogonadal state.

The main goal of PCT is to not only increase LH production which will stimulate the Leydig cells in the testes to produce endogenous testosterone (ITT) but most importantly making sure the testes are responsive to the LH stimulation as in many cases when on trt or steroids if no hCG was used during this time than the Leydig cells become dormant and the seminiferous tubules shrink which results in testicular atrophy due to shutdown of the HPG axis and LH/FSH production. This results in the Leydig cells no longer producing endogenous testosterone and the Sertoli/germ cells no longer producing sperm.

Use of hCG when on trt or steroids should aid in the recovery process when coming off as it mimics LH and will keep the Leydig cells active (producing some degree of ITT).

Even without the use of a PCT, the natural production of LH will kick in fairly quickly but natural endogenous production of testosterone let alone spermatogenesis can take much longer as the critical aspect of the recovery process is the responsiveness of the Leydig cells in the testes to the LH.

No one can say exactly how long it will take you to recover let alone how you will feel during the transition.

Some men on trt choose to stop cold turkey (no PCT) and recover okay with some bumps along the way whereas others may struggle before things get better.

Others choose to implement a PCT which may make the transition much quicker/smoother but again everyone is different as again there are numerous factors involved.




Some key points here!

* Some men on trt choose to stop cold turkey (no PCT) and recover okay with some bumps along the way whereas others may struggle before things get better.

* Others choose to implement a PCT which may make the transition much quicker/smoother but again everyone is different as again there are numerous factors involved.

 

[madman]

Back to baseline in 8 days? Damn, I’m quite surprised by that. People talk about horror stories after stopping injectable, maybe they should just take gel for the interim rather than serms.

Was that Jatenzo if I recall correctly? How do you feel off?

You would mean back to being hypogonadal!

Feedback on lab results

I've been on TRT for close to four months and am on 200mg/ wk of test cyp. I am doing ED injections. I am thinking of dropping my dosage by 20%. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!! Thank you!

www.excelmale.com

 

[Systemlord]

Was that Jatenzo if I recall correctly? How do you feel off?

I feel significantly better, better every day that passes. TRT fu** me up somehow related to the way my body uses iron and it's taken months for my body to recovery. I believe TRT is the cause of my mass urinary loss of calcium via iron uptake changes.

I always had symptoms of iron overload on TRT, I believe through the suppression of hepcidin.

TRT upregulates receptors and it's in this way I believe TRT made things worse for me.

My most recent estrogen test shows 18 pg/mL, more testing coming in.

My muscles are getting harder the more time passes. My muscles were always swollen but soft on TRT, joints always hurting, inflamed, clicking and popping.

 

[transetpmedia]

I feel significantly better, better every day that passes. TRT fu** me up somehow related to the way my body uses iron and it's taken months for my body to recovery. I believe TRT is the cause of my mass urinary loss of calcium via iron uptake changes.

I always had symptoms of iron overload on TRT, I believe through the suppression of hepcidin.

TRT upregulates receptors and it's in this way I believe TRT made things worse for me.

My most recent estrogen test shows 18 pg/mL, more testing coming in.

My muscles are getting harder the more time passes. My muscles were always swollen but soft on TRT, joints always hurting, inflamed, clicking and popping.

I’m on my second day off (53 hours since last dose) and I feel really really good. I started getting this tingling sensation in my testicles yesterday afternoon/evening. But it feels like stuff is getting turned on. Today it has gotten much stronger though, and based on gel half life I should be close to bottoming out by now in terms of levels. I should point out that I’m only 30 years old and my pre TRT were actually quite good (the reason why I got on TRT is a very long story). I have done sarms in the past and I found stopping them more challenging, but perhaps the worst is yet to come.

 

[Systemlord]

I bounced back fast and I'm 52, so you have the advantage being younger, therefore I would say you'll fair better than I did.

My body is still recovering from whatever TRT did to me. The last few days have been nothing short of extraordinary in terms of how I feel. I've only been off TRT 2.5 months and I feel leaps and bounds better than the first week of TRT.