Fertility: Sperm count up after adding HCG to TRT

[Nelson Vergel]

Bad news. Despite moving from 400 IU 2x a week to 300 IU 3x a week my sperm count came back at ZERO.
So i went from ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cream and NO HCG to 7.14 million sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (70mg 2x a week) and HCG (400 IU 2x a week) and finally back to ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (60mg 2x a week) and HCG (300 IU 3x a week)

Healthman

I have repeated on this forum that I have yet to see anyone improve sperm count with less than 350 IU HCG (most have done so with 400 to 500 IU two to three times per week plus TRT).

These studies prove it:

Two Studies That Used HCG with Testosterone

 

[HealthMan]

I am gonna ask Dr to increase HCG to 500IU EOD and have another semen analysis done in 3 months. To be fair I told him fertility is not high priority at the moment but I just would like to be "normal"... meaning having normal sperm production and be ready to have a baby whenever I want. And i dont want to wait until the day i want to become dad again to find out if HCG or something else is going to work. I want be have peace of mind that TRT and fertility can coexist for me. Fertility is the only thing tha bothers me on TRT... everything I feel amazing and my labwork shows all health parameters improving.

Anyone else here can share their experiences with HCG dosage and fertility?

 

[HealthMan]

You are right Nelson. But dont you think it is weird that my sperm count actually decreased with total weekly HCG dosage increased from 800IU to 900IU?

 

[HealthMan]

Try HCG 500IU 3x week and retest. If that doesnt work add HMG. If that doesnt work quit TRT (which would be hell on earth)

 

[Nelson Vergel]

"So i went from ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cream and NO HCG to 7.14 million sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (70mg 2x a week) and HCG (400 IU 2x a week) and finally back to ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (60mg 2x a week) and HCG (300 IU 3x a week)"

So, if it worked before, why would it not work now at 70 mg + HCG @ 400 or 500 IU twice per week?

 

[HealthMan]

"So i went from ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cream and NO HCG to 7.14 million sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (70mg 2x a week) and HCG (400 IU 2x a week) and finally back to ZERO sperm count while on testosterone cypionate (60mg 2x a week) and HCG (300 IU 3x a week)"

So, if it worked before, why would it not work now at 70 mg + HCG @ 400 or 500 IU twice per week?

But Nelson, it improve sperm count using 800IU a week. Then i increase to 900IU a week and it went back to zero. So HCG 2x a week at 400IU sperm count was 7.14million. And with HCG 300IU 3x a week sperm count zero. Weird no?
Also to be considered fertile my total sperm count should be over 40 million. Another odd thing. My testes are fuller now than previous HCG dosage

 

[HealthMan]

One thing that might explain this is using Dr Saya's study on HCG dosage. 150IU clears from the blood after 24 hours while 500IU clears after 72 hours. Not sure where 300IU clearance would be. Probably not a linear interpolation. So despite the fact total weekly dosage increased the number of hours where my body had little to no HCG in the blood was probably higher with the 3x week 300IU protocol. And that would explain the drop to zero (in theory leydig cells need constant estimulation to produce sperm) and 500IU 3x a week should provide that.

 

[HanOng]

Hi HealthMan

I am sorry to hear about the unexpected negative results.

May I clarify on the schedules of your protocol?

You were zero count while on TRT alone (duration?) before switching to testosterone cypionate (70mg 2x a week) and HCG (400 IU 2x a week) for 9 weeks which raised counts to 7million.

How long were you on the testosterone cypionate (60mg 2x a week) and HCG (300 IU 3x a week) which dropped your levels back to zero?

Did you doctor share the estimated timeline to reach the 40million target?

 

[HealthMan]

Hi HealthMan

I am sorry to hear about the unexpected negative results.

May I clarify on the schedules of your protocol?

You were zero count while on TRT alone (duration?) before switching to testosterone cypionate (70mg 2x a week) and HCG (400 IU 2x a week) for 9 weeks which raised counts to 7million.

How long were you on the testosterone cypionate (60mg 2x a week) and HCG (300 IU 3x a week) which dropped your levels back to zero?

Did you doctor share the estimated timeline to reach the 40million target?

3 months at 300IU 3x a week. I am changing that as of today to 500IU EOD and will retest in 3 months.

 

[Dhobb006]

But how long do you take the hcg at 500iu? Forever?

 

[HealthMan]

But how long do you take the hcg at 500iu? Forever?

Assuming that dosage makes me fertile again... for as long as i want to be fertile

 

[HealthMan]

It has been 2 weeks since i increased hcg from 300 to 500IU 3x a week (and i decreased testosterone cypionate from 0.30ml to 0.25ml twice a week). Assuming this will drop my total testosterone levels a little bit (before this change my TT was 1295). Everything feels good but my resting heart rate is up from 70 to low 80 and feeling a bit of anxiety. Does anyone here ever experienced this with higher dosages of HCG? These are the only 2 things i changed in my protocol. I will have blood work again in a couple of weeks and i am wondering if this is something that might go away with time with the body getting used to the higher dosage of HCG.

 

[Vince Carter]

Give it a couple more weeks to balanace out...shoot for 4 weeks of a steady new protocol. YOu may find that HCG just isn't your thing, or even the higher dose your body disagrees with. I've done it all with HCG, dosing and frequency and it's always just like "water"...nothing there in the way of how I feel, subjectively. I know my nuts aren't shrunken and dead but I get nothing from HCG beyond that. I'm actually taking a break from it about three weeks now from having used 500iu E3.5D.

 

[HealthMan]

Give it a couple more weeks to balanace out...shoot for 4 weeks of a steady new protocol. YOu may find that HCG just isn't your thing, or even the higher dose your body disagrees with. I've done it all with HCG, dosing and frequency and it's always just like "water"...nothing there in the way of how I feel, subjectively. I know my nuts aren't shrunken and dead but I get nothing from HCG beyond that. I'm actually taking a break from it about three weeks now from having used 500iu E3.5D.

Tks Vince. This is my plan. Never had issues with HCG before but also never tried higher dosages.

 

[HealthMan]

Tks Vince. This is my plan. Never had issues with HCG before but also never tried higher dosages.

After a few weeks all back to normal. Will do another fertility test in a couple of months. I was wondering if HCG IM vs Subq would have a more pronounced effect on fertility. All i found in the internet were two studies using much higher doses of HCG showing different results (one showed much better absorption IM and the other showed a better absorption Subq).

 

[Nelson Vergel]

No difference in PK for either injection method. I inject using shallow IM.

 

[HealthMan]

In 2 weeks i will get another sperm analysis done after switching my HCG protocol to 500IU 3x a week over 2 months ago. Testicles look fuller but HCG has such an stimulatory effect on me. Hopefully in 3 weeks i will be posting the results here

 

[HealthMan]

After 68 days on HCG 500IU 3x week my sperm count is up to 12 million (normal is over 40 million). All other parameters are normal (motility, ph, fwd progression etc). So it is starting to work! I will retest in 60-90 days. After this time i expect much better results

 

[Vince Carter]

thats great news

 

[HealthMan]

thats great news

Thanks! Curious to see how the numbers will look a couple of months from now under this protocol