What should trough level be with topical testosterone formulations?

[sh1973]

I wanted to see what’s considered a good trough level with topical gels and creams 24 hours after application. I’ve seen several guys over the years state their trough levels are only in the 300ng range. Then drugs like Androgel and testim say to get trough level between 350-750ng 24 hours post application. It seems it would be difficult to have a trough much above 300-400ng considering the rapid half life of topicals. I realize most doctors want a level 2-6 hours after application, but it would be nice to know. Anyone that has been on topicals long term please chime in.

 

[captain]

Most doctors will cut your dose if its 750 at 2hrs after the dose so it would be hard to be there in the trough. This is where the doctor don't care what the prescribing info says. Your talking total T levels and T is not active. Its the byproducts of T that are active and the levels of them are what's important. The levels of the byproducts of T probably don't rise and fall at the rate of T. I would doubt DHT levels run in sync with T levels over 24hrs.

 

[sh1973]

Thanks captain

 

[Vince Carter]

I wanted to see what's considered a good trough level with topical gels and creams 24 hours after application. I've seen several guys over the years state their trough levels are only in the 300ng range. Then drugs like Androgel and testim say to get trough level between 350-750ng 24 hours post application. It seems it would be difficult to have a trough much above 300-400ng considering the rapid half life of topicals. I realize most doctors want a level 2-6 hours after application, but it would be nice to know. Anyone that has been on topicals long term please chime in.

You're pretty close, a daily topical would be approaching the low T baseline I would assume, but any one testing a trough like that is doing his testing all wrong to begin with so it's a pretty moot point any way.

 

[sh1973]

Yeah it seems pretty dumb but that’s what the literature says that comes with agel or testim. Seems checking peak after application would make the most sense for sure.

 

[captain]

Fortesta dosing info at 2hrs equal to or greater than 500 and less than 1,250 ng/dL. LabCorp top of range is now 916 and all the doctors look at that and not the prescribing info. You come rolling in at 917 the world may end at that point. I know from split dosing that the spike when you apply is where the action happens. Using the same amount split morning and night has a different effect. Labs look like your using less T. For me it felt like I was using less. If I could increase the dose it may have worked better and it would still be in range. That may be a trick to use to be able to use higher doses and cheat the top of range on labs. I think HCT would show that you was using more but the rest of your labs may still look like your using less. Why would you do this? A smart man told me that you have to do what's best for you.

 

[blackebob]

I cannot remember if I was tested before or after application. Andro gel has had my Total T over 1500 before.

 

[OMI100]

I cannot remember if I was tested before or after application. Andro gel has had my Total T over 1500 before.

My guess - AFTER
I use a compounded cream and when I forget to NOT apply it in the morning of labs I can end up that high.
If that reading was NOT after application you would be applying waaaaaaaay more than you need.
What do your prior labs look like?

 

[sh1973]

I cannot remember if I was tested before or after application. Andro gel has had my Total T over 1500 before.

I briefly used Axiron and it had my levels over 1400ng 4 hours after application, but the skin irritation from it was atrocious.

 

[captain]

I found that skin irritation was from not spreading gel enough. I would get chemical burns then after spreading it out more it never happened anymore.

 

[blackebob]

I am looking for the lab before my clomid torture. The 1500 was 4 months after the clomid, and it was 4 pumps andro gel. I have always wondered if the clomid reset something half way. I have never been able to feel as good as I did before taking the clomid. I know it was supposed to be a restart type of thing, but would it keep goiung for this long, 2 years?