UK (London) based new member
- Thread starter Jay189
- Start date
Nice. How’s the weather? 
With who I’m with, I pay Annual membership for the dr to advise/discuss blood work and write prescriptions. Im not doing HCG at the moment so it’s just weekly sustanon injections for me. Sustanon is ALOT cheaper then test E or C here for some reason.
So membership £190 year
Sustanon £100 year
My GP is doing bloods so that’s free.
syringes/needles etc are like £20 for year.
so works out about £25 month.
There are other clinics who charge a lot more, anywhere from £50-150 month.
With who I’m with, I pay Annual membership for the dr to advise/discuss blood work and write prescriptions. Im not doing HCG at the moment so it’s just weekly sustanon injections for me. Sustanon is ALOT cheaper then test E or C here for some reason.
So membership £190 year
Sustanon £100 year
My GP is doing bloods so that’s free.
syringes/needles etc are like £20 for year.
so works out about £25 month.
There are other clinics who charge a lot more, anywhere from £50-150 month.
Sounds like you’ve found a great package there.
Ihave used hcg from the start over 18 months back with trt. Started with sustanon but moved to test E and preferred it. Currently 140mg a week split into E3D pins.
Also tried Deca for about 6 months at low dose 90mg a week then dropped to 60mg a week. Been off about a month now of deca and realise I prefer to be on in-terms of overall well-being and joints.
It’s a real journey dialling everything in and sometimes you’ve just got to let your body adapt rather than keep playing with doses and different protocols
Ihave used hcg from the start over 18 months back with trt. Started with sustanon but moved to test E and preferred it. Currently 140mg a week split into E3D pins.
Also tried Deca for about 6 months at low dose 90mg a week then dropped to 60mg a week. Been off about a month now of deca and realise I prefer to be on in-terms of overall well-being and joints.
It’s a real journey dialling everything in and sometimes you’ve just got to let your body adapt rather than keep playing with doses and different protocols
Hi Jay
I've been on TRT since 2017. Started out under NHS. After 6 months or so, lots of research, and abysmal results, I went private. Things improved vastly over a year though I'm not yet where I want to be - perhaps I have 'over expectations' or my sell by date truly has expired. Nonetheless...
I've since switched back to the NHS after many 'conversations' with my doc who I must say does listen and take on board - I'm prescribed Test E and administer it myself at a protocol dictated by me. As long as I don't read sky-high numbers on tests then all is good. I consider myself one of the fortunate ones as many many docs in the UK know little to nothing of TRT and will extend themselves no further than what the book says.
Given the research I've done there is only one clinic in the UK that I'd use.
themenshealthclinic.co.uk
Good luck.
I've been on TRT since 2017. Started out under NHS. After 6 months or so, lots of research, and abysmal results, I went private. Things improved vastly over a year though I'm not yet where I want to be - perhaps I have 'over expectations' or my sell by date truly has expired. Nonetheless...
I've since switched back to the NHS after many 'conversations' with my doc who I must say does listen and take on board - I'm prescribed Test E and administer it myself at a protocol dictated by me. As long as I don't read sky-high numbers on tests then all is good. I consider myself one of the fortunate ones as many many docs in the UK know little to nothing of TRT and will extend themselves no further than what the book says.
Given the research I've done there is only one clinic in the UK that I'd use.
The Men's Health Clinic | Global Leaders in Testosterone
Expert management of Testosterone Deficiency and more at our internationally acclaimed, CQC regulated clinic led by Dr Robert Stevens.
themenshealthclinic.co.uk
Good luck.
You’re very lucky I’d say. test E on the nhs? Never heard instances of that tbh.
Unfortunately the many GPs I’ve spoken to at my surgery are completely Useless and When you throw studies at them of average levels of test per age group that makes the NHS level redundant or nonsensical, they’re blissfully ignorant and unaware.
I decided to go private early on, well Actually that’s not true. I had blood tests come back from GP years ago (all within normal range they said), so I didn’t question anything. Got put on antidepressants etc. Felt no different after a year. It’s only when I did a private blood test and actually SAW the levels and then read up about all
This stuff that I realised this is probably what I need.
I know of TMHC who you mentioned. They have a very good reputation. They might be cheaper then Harley street alternatives Who are crazy pricey but still unfortunately out of my price range. I’m with another clinic who are cheaper and seem to be pretty good so far.
Unfortunately the many GPs I’ve spoken to at my surgery are completely Useless and When you throw studies at them of average levels of test per age group that makes the NHS level redundant or nonsensical, they’re blissfully ignorant and unaware.
I decided to go private early on, well Actually that’s not true. I had blood tests come back from GP years ago (all within normal range they said), so I didn’t question anything. Got put on antidepressants etc. Felt no different after a year. It’s only when I did a private blood test and actually SAW the levels and then read up about all
This stuff that I realised this is probably what I need.
I know of TMHC who you mentioned. They have a very good reputation. They might be cheaper then Harley street alternatives Who are crazy pricey but still unfortunately out of my price range. I’m with another clinic who are cheaper and seem to be pretty good so far.
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
These guys support ExcelMale.com
balancemyhormones.co.uk
Here are a few of their latest videos:
HRT & TRT UK Clinic - Hormone Tests - Weight Loss - Balance My Hormones
Balance My Hormones are a HRT & TRT UK clinic with over 20 years experience in hormone imbalance, providing Testosterone & Hormone Therapy in the UK.
balancemyhormones.co.uk
Here are a few of their latest videos:
These are interesting interviews.
Nelson mentions that deca is not recommended for long term use due to effect on HDL.
I was left wondering what might be an advantageous protocol with deca whereby the benefits could be enjoyed such as on joints, but the downside risks minimised.
For instance if you cycled low dose deca with T what would that cycle look like in terms of dose, duration and off period, whilst continuing with just T?
Nelson mentions that deca is not recommended for long term use due to effect on HDL.
I was left wondering what might be an advantageous protocol with deca whereby the benefits could be enjoyed such as on joints, but the downside risks minimised.
For instance if you cycled low dose deca with T what would that cycle look like in terms of dose, duration and off period, whilst continuing with just T?
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
100 mg of nandrolone plus 100 mg of testosterone if your hematocrit and HDL are OK after 6 weeks (hematocrit under 54, HDL over 40). Some guys use 100 N plus 150 T. The length of the nandrolone “cycle” is dependent on how well both variables behave at those low doses. Most guys do well unless they have apnea, they smoke, or have low HDL before starting.
You will hear arguments about nandrolone to testosterone dose ratio on ExcelMale and other sites from guys who spread the “deca dick” myth. All anabolics shut down T and they all need to be used with TRT. You will also hear from some guys who spread misinformation about nandrolone used to replace T. I have researched and read about nandrolone for over 30 years and I am tired of all the misinformation. You will also find posts here that say it’s bad for men since it has similarities to progesterone.
You will hear arguments about nandrolone to testosterone dose ratio on ExcelMale and other sites from guys who spread the “deca dick” myth. All anabolics shut down T and they all need to be used with TRT. You will also hear from some guys who spread misinformation about nandrolone used to replace T. I have researched and read about nandrolone for over 30 years and I am tired of all the misinformation. You will also find posts here that say it’s bad for men since it has similarities to progesterone.
Sorry for my lack of knowledge here, (I am here to learn and I appreciate yours and others insight.)... just wondered if you’re on TRT and run another compound like Deca (albeit it low dose), will you still need to run an AI alongside it for those Estrogen/progesterone sides? If so, from the start or only when E2 at a certain level or after noticing sides? And what/if any PCT do you need if you’re doing TRT?
As if on TRT you’ll still be pinning T when the Deca stops.. so is clomid or nolva still needed? Because you Wana keep any gains (will you get some low dose?) obviously but not get your normal production back, as you’ll be Staying shut down with the test anyway. If you have Any materials or links on this for reading Where I can learn, would be much appreciated. Thanks.
As if on TRT you’ll still be pinning T when the Deca stops.. so is clomid or nolva still needed? Because you Wana keep any gains (will you get some low dose?) obviously but not get your normal production back, as you’ll be Staying shut down with the test anyway. If you have Any materials or links on this for reading Where I can learn, would be much appreciated. Thanks.
Quick views
I don’t run an AI and generally ought to be avoided unless bloods or symptoms suggests it’s required.
PCT is irrelevant. TRT is a long term protocol and you will be shut down whether you are just taking Test or Test plus deca.
For the same reason as above clomid and nolva are not relevant unless you are looking for a fertility solution, but in this case I think there are better options.
TRT doses are relatively low, or should be, so worrying about keeping gains shouldn’t really come into it. When I started TRT I was about 12% bf and 93kg. 18 months later I’m similar bf and 96.5kg, having topped at 98kg when adding deca for 6 months.
I don’t run an AI and generally ought to be avoided unless bloods or symptoms suggests it’s required.
PCT is irrelevant. TRT is a long term protocol and you will be shut down whether you are just taking Test or Test plus deca.
For the same reason as above clomid and nolva are not relevant unless you are looking for a fertility solution, but in this case I think there are better options.
TRT doses are relatively low, or should be, so worrying about keeping gains shouldn’t really come into it. When I started TRT I was about 12% bf and 93kg. 18 months later I’m similar bf and 96.5kg, having topped at 98kg when adding deca for 6 months.
90mg deca once a week for around 4 months then 60mg for about 2 months.
TRT was typically 120 - 135mg per week In this 6 month period.
overall I enjoyed deca, felt generally better, elbows joint discomfort much improved and felt stronger and added some muscle. Did find erections slightly harder to achieve but sex life remained fairly active throughout.
Also take HCG and viagra 50mg on any day I expect to have sex, and find even if that is several hours later I still benefit.
unfortunately due to being too busy earlier and covid I didn’t get and bloods whilst on deca, which I regret.
Am just over 4 weeks off deca now and weight has dropped a few kgs but that more likely due to very basic home trading since March.
just had bloods today as the clinics have reopened and if all is good then will return to deca and get further bloods in 2 months to assess whether it is causing any issues to key health markers.
TRT was typically 120 - 135mg per week In this 6 month period.
overall I enjoyed deca, felt generally better, elbows joint discomfort much improved and felt stronger and added some muscle. Did find erections slightly harder to achieve but sex life remained fairly active throughout.
Also take HCG and viagra 50mg on any day I expect to have sex, and find even if that is several hours later I still benefit.
unfortunately due to being too busy earlier and covid I didn’t get and bloods whilst on deca, which I regret.
Am just over 4 weeks off deca now and weight has dropped a few kgs but that more likely due to very basic home trading since March.
just had bloods today as the clinics have reopened and if all is good then will return to deca and get further bloods in 2 months to assess whether it is causing any issues to key health markers.
Last edited:
Yes I agree and have questioned it.
increase Based on my latest blood work he said and not much change to mood/symptoms. Total T was sitting at 7-12nmol pre TRT. Now at about 14.9nmol.. Im Not sure where 200mg will put me but il have bloods done in about 6 weeks to see. He also said further blood work before considering an AI (I did ask about having on one standby just in case). He said he's not so much interested in the numbers but my symptoms.
increase Based on my latest blood work he said and not much change to mood/symptoms. Total T was sitting at 7-12nmol pre TRT. Now at about 14.9nmol.. Im Not sure where 200mg will put me but il have bloods done in about 6 weeks to see. He also said further blood work before considering an AI (I did ask about having on one standby just in case). He said he's not so much interested in the numbers but my symptoms.
madman
Super Moderator
Way too high of a jump going from 125-200mg/week.
A dose increase of 20mg/week can result in a big jump in TT/FT levels.
If I were to increase my dose 10-20mg/week it will result in a 300ng/dL increase in TT.
Keep in mind that you were only injecting Sustanon 125mg once weekly and although your current TT 14.9 nmol/L (430 ng/dL) trough (7 days post-injection) level is sub-optimal that your peak TT/FT levels will be much higher earlier in the week.
The downfall of high dose once-weekly injections is that there will be a big variation between the peak--->trough level and blood levels will not be as stable throughout the week.
125mg every 5 days or increasing the overall weekly dose to 150 mg and injecting 75mg twice weekly (every 3.5 days) would be a more sensible move.
200mg once weekly is going to most likely have your peak TT/FT/e2 levels too high let alone it will drive up your hematocrit/hemoglobin.
Although symptom relief is what truly matters blood work is still critical not only to make sure blood markers are in a healthy range but more importantly minimize any potential negative side-effects as there is such a thing as too high T levels for therapeutic treatment.
On average most men can easily achieve a healthy TT/FT level using 100-150mg/week of T and yes some need slightly higher doses but in many cases, 200mg/week is rarely needed to achieve such.
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