"TRT/HRT/Nutrition/Cognition/Wellness/LT student of the game"

[tareload]

Thanks for watching my back Brother

While I am vertical I got your back Brother. Take care.

 

[Belekas]

While I am vertical I got your back Brother. Take care.

Cheers to many more buddy! Yesterdays fiasco messed me up today feeling like I've been drinking for a week or so plus a nasty migraine type headache ffs lol

 

[Belekas]

8 weeks on 80mg e3.5d update:

Feeling drained, tired and moody. BP elevated, a bit short of breath. Not much to say but I've pretty much got all the sides even from this low dose Sustanon. Also started getting very low BG in the morning fasted, never had this happening before. Seen my GP today she said thats fine but will run bloods EOM to check diabetes, kidneys, liver, thyroid, pancreas and everything else. Weird af cuz such reading is def borderline hypoglycemia. Started eating a lot more of complex carbs and protein from meat/fish and healthy fats and will try to get back into normal range BG upon waking up.

My experienced buddy thinks all this happening most likely from Estrogen surge. And since my test dose is so small the ratio is not right and I get sides. Advised me to get Arimidex/Anastrazole and just try a small dose to see if it helps. Getting that is a problem where I'm at because I don't have Rx so msg'ed a few guys see if they can help as buying a "cat in the bag" option from online suspicious sites is def not looking like a bright option.

So thats pretty much it. Tomorrow is my injection day. I also have some pharmacy grade Test-E so thought maybe changing esters would work, but at this point in time its probably not worth it till I get bloods done end of next month. It's a bitch to feel complete mess when I was feeling great before starting treatment but IIWII.

Any suggestions, or similar stories are welcome

Have a great weekend guys.

 

[Belekas]

Quick update:

Fasted BG back to 4.7mmol/l after being 3 for a couple of days, but might have been longer as I haven't measured. Started eating 4000-5000 calories/day split in 6 meals and that has worked. Body overworked, overstressed, underslept from the years of working nights in heavy stress environment and underfed as I've tried to fast during the nights for all the proclaimed benefits right. Well that didn't work out for me. End of month going to do some bloods for thyroid, liver, kidneys etc so will have a bit better picture on current health. Removed sugar and most fast burning carbs, but will have COR before/after workouts. 1 or 2 weekly cheatmeals as too much healthy food won't do the trick. Body supercompensating from all the calorie deficits, undereating, calorie restrictions, bad habits, for too long periods of time and heavy training on top of that as well.

Current diet: eggs, chicken, salmon, turkey,beef (not often)rice, some oats, potatoes, some pasta but will be rarely as needs preparation, vegetables and fruits. For healthy fats- Extra virgin olive oil mostly and some peanut/almond butter here and there, some nuts like almonds and brazil, cashews. COR pre/post workout. Will experiment with other wholefood sources along the way. Will have occasional toast with eggs, but just some as key now is to utilise mostly low glycemic index, slow burning carbs, so slow down my metabolism.

Once I do bloods then will post here and be able to discuss with greater detail. So now lots of food till I puke lol, more rest and 3x/week training with 3-4x cardio for me.

Also interested what is your experience with salt? For me it def helps with performance and gym stuff, but feel it amps me up and most likely increased my BP a bit. Yesterdays tried 5g of sea salt and today got some headache in the morning. BP still reasonable though but elevated since starting TRT. So not sure yet but its also def connected to me vision as my eyes have became very sensitive over the years. Put glasses on get a headache, remove them gets better, so put them back on, no headache for a while, then again. Absolutely crazy stuff and can drive you nuts lol

 

[Belekas]

Interesting stuff. Strength went up for around 4-5 weels ruffly on same calories, sleep and stress levels, etc. Peaked around week 5 I believe IIRC. So 8+ weeks in, 2000kcal higher food intake, same sleep and stress regime and todays chest workout not that effective as then. Only 4 sets of 8 reps. At 5th week was 4 sets of 10 or 12 reps don't remember exactly. A bit too much food today pre workout and since didn't have much time went in fuller then expected and that as well took a hit on performance. Rookie mistake but IIWII. But nonetheless interesting stuff as first 5 weeks were the best considering how I felt. Probably has to do with natural test still active. As soon as it shut down all became just meh.

Also breathing heavier and nose seems more congested as days go. Even started snoring which I never did pre TRT. Don't like it but will continu to hang on till I bloods EOM and complete ones next month.

Body composition changing nicely. Downstairs department working good. Libido normal. Benefits are great but the negatives are not so at this point. Will see what the next 4 weeks bring. Would be great if breathing and BP stabilized, so will see.

 

[Belekas]

Interesting stuff. Strength went up for around 4-5 weels ruffly on same calories, sleep and stress levels, etc. Peaked around week 5 I believe IIRC. So 8+ weeks in, 2000kcal higher food intake, same sleep and stress regime and todays chest workout not that effective as then. Only 4 sets of 8 reps. At 5th week was 4 sets of 10 or 12 reps don't remember exactly. A bit too much food today pre workout and since didn't have much time went in fuller then expected and that as well took a hit on performance. Rookie mistake but IIWII. But nonetheless interesting stuff as first 5 weeks were the best considering how I felt. Probably has to do with natural test still active. As soon as it shut down all became just meh.

Also breathing heavier and nose seems more congested as days go. Even started snoring which I never did pre TRT. Don't like it but will continu to hang on till I bloods EOM and complete ones next month.

Body composition changing nicely. Downstairs department working good. Libido normal. Benefits are great but the negatives are not so at this point. Will see what the next 4 weeks bring. Would be great if breathing and BP stabilized, so will see.

I'm eating lots and packing on weight so this attributes to it but overall its getting out of control and girl said she couldnt sleep tonight first time in over a decade lol Breathing through mouse sucks and my nose comes and goes in waves during the day. Evening it always comes back into my sleeping time intensifies. Was never snoring before fwiw. Will see how this goes into end of next month and see what blood tests show. Most likely if it persists even with slight body weight drop Ill try reducing my test dose to something 50-70mg weekly. Wake up still fatigued in the morning. Ofc lots of food might be contributing to it also but for now will try to put on as much mass as possible to compensate for the last 3 years.

Lets get it.

 

[Belekas]

Hey guys,

have you experienced something like nosal congestion when starting and into TRT? It's been killing me lately and I'm around 2 months in. Never had it before. Girl said she won't be sleeping with me anymore as she was wide awake since 4am last night while I was sleeping like a rock doing sounds like a chimney cleaner lol I'm injectecting 100mg split e3.5 day and today is injection day and I noticed it got better in the morning and now its 6pm and I actually can breath a lot better. Might be a coincidence though. But perhaps it flares up after injection so will see what todays shot tells. Also my breathing gets heavier and feels like I'm out of breath a bit like I did a sprint or something. Feel def more wired and BP still elevated but not bad fwiw. Like overstimulation or something. Mind you I'm very sensitive to everything including meds, drugs, alcohol etc. Labs only end of month and next month so can't share more data, sadly.

p.s. I've read most of the threads re this issue but thought to ask your experienced opinion so hope ya'll don't mind

@readalot @Cataceous @FunkOdyssey @Charliebizz @BigTex @Nelson Vergel

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Hey guys,

Have you experienced something like nasal congestion when starting and into TRT? It's been killing me lately and I'm around 2 months in.

Yes, in my case I attributed it to a flare-up of my LPR (laryngopharyngeal reflux) symptoms, caused by TRT. You have already been complaining that it worsened your GERD symptoms so I think it's a strong possibility for you as well. During LPR flares, my sinuses swell shut and I can't breathe properly through my nose. This type of inflammation does not respond to steroid sprays but does respond to nasal decongestant sprays like afrin (careful, these are addictive).

LPR can also cause asthma symptoms, hoarse voice, coughing, post-nasal drip, etc. You mentioned your breathing becomes heavier and you feel out of breath which sounds like the asthma symptoms that are associated with reflux. I have some permanent lung scarring from mine that was picked up on a CT scan.

With LPR, you have gaseous reflux containing aerosolized pepsin digestive enzyme which can inflame the upper airways and vocal cords. The pepsin lodges in the tissues and waits to be activated by acidic food and beverages to cause more damage. It can be permanently deactivated with sufficient alkalinity, so sipping alkaline water is often helpful.

 

[Belekas]

Yes, in my case I attributed it to a flare-up of my LPR (laryngopharyngeal reflux) symptoms, caused by TRT. You have already been complaining that it worsened your GERD symptoms so I think it's a strong possibility for you as well. During LPR flares, my sinuses swell shut and I can't breathe properly through my nose. This type of inflammation does not respond to steroid sprays but does respond to nasal decongestant sprays like afrin (careful, these are addictive).

LPR can also cause asthma symptoms, hoarse voice, coughing, post-nasal drip, etc. You mentioned your breathing becomes heavier and you feel out of breath which sounds like the asthma symptoms that are associated with reflux. I have some permanent lung scarring from mine that was picked up on a CT scan.

With LPR, you have gaseous reflux containing aerosolized pepsin digestive enzyme which can inflame the upper airways and vocal cords. The pepsin lodges in the tissues and waits to be activated by acidic food and beverages to cause more damage. It can be permanently deactivated with sufficient alkalinity, so sipping alkaline water is often helpful.

Thanks and good to know. Weird thing with my pain after eating as soon as I switched to 100% clean food and upped my food intake it pretty much completely went away. Now I experience it very rarely if I stay on my diet and eat same foods over and over again. So more or less this one I can manage, for now. But need to be careful and mindful of what and how much I eat.

Now that LPR asthma symptoms def are there. I also get heaviness on my lung from time to time but just use some Salbutamol and its good again. Weird, as I rarely needed it before TRT and only when I've got seriously sick like Rona or a strong flu, but now it's here and flares up from time to time. The nosal congestion, this one is a lot more serious for me as its tough to breath when nose shuts off completely. Hope it goes away or will go even lower on my dose to try and see if that improves.

Have these symptoms improved after you came off?

Will have some blood tests done end of month and complete blood tests done next month so will post here for more data to work with. Always appreciate your insights

Regards,
Bel.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Have these symptoms improved after you came off?

Yes -- this is an ongoing condition for me that I am always dealing with, but the symptoms improved significantly when I stopped TRT and went back to my normal baseline. There was also some dose-responsiveness with regard to how much TRT exaggerated them. They would flare up very badly whenever I increased the dose, and then the symptoms would ease up somewhat and stabilize at a new level (still higher than before I raised the dose).

I've posted at length about the diet and lifestyle modifications that can help you manage this issue, if you check out my previous reflux related posts.

 

[Belekas]

Yes -- this is an ongoing condition for me that I am always dealing with, but the symptoms improved significantly when I stopped TRT and went back to my normal baseline. There was also some dose-responsiveness with regard to how much TRT exaggerated them. They would flare up very badly whenever I increased the dose, and then the symptoms would ease up somewhat and stabilize at a new level (still higher than before I raised the dose).

I've posted at length about the diet and lifestyle modifications that can help you manage this issue, if you check out my previous reflux related posts.

I hear you and I've read them. My issue now is more nasal congestion then chest pain after eating which I have under control for now like I've said in previous post. Diet on point, even though I'm gaining weight its still not flaring up on 4000-5000kcal like it used to before eating 2500-3000kcal. Just had my sustanon shot so will see how it goes the next couple of days. My plan is to hold current dose and then go lower towards 50-70mg/week same split and eventually to one shot per week. If nothing works will be getting off even though I like the athletic gains a lot its not worth for me as I want to be as healthy as possible including cognitive functions as well which might decline some from oversimulation as well, I believe.

 

[Belekas]

Will be going on extensive testing next month including echoscopy, endoscopy and colonoscopy together with extensive blood tests as well. Hope to find the root cause of my chest/sternum pain after eating or even drinking water, as it has flared again now. Hopefully the later will be clear and show no damage and potential threats. Have to decrease food again now so looks like my short lived offseason has came to an end. No point slamming food if pain is unbearable afterwards. So will try to eat just 3000kcal of healthy food with occasional dirty cheats mixed in. Funny thing is I get most pain after eating healthy food and pretty much never get pain after eating greasy pizza and some biscuits. Weird af. Anyone else have/had such situation? Tried medium fat, low fat, no luck, same pain. So portion sizes are down and will eat every 2.5-3hrs. Also get some bloating all together with pain after eating and stomach discomfort. See what food reduction does to it. Been a bitch lately and so tireing as pain wears you out, I'm sure some guys know what I'm talking about. So fingers crossed and lets see.

9.5 weeks on TRT. Started at 80mg, now at 100mg split E3.5D Sunday morning and Wednesday evening FWIW. Also taking a MultiVitamin, Vitamin D3+K2, Vitamin C, Zinc 50mg 2-3 times per week with Copper, and today took 10mg Boron. Also aim for 15ml Omega3 fish oil/day to get at least 3500mg EPA+DHA.

Started following my nosal congestion pattern which appears to flare up on the injection day before sleep and gets milder going into the next injection day. So far no evidence but started loging and will see how it looks after a month or two. Some blood tests end of this month so be interesting to see.

Hope you guys are doing good and lets make the best we can from what we have and get even more healthier and active going into new year)

 

[Belekas]

Fasted morning BP seems to be stabilising after 2 months. Had a good 8-9hr sleep today without waking up to pee in the middle of the night as most days. Yesterday limited water consumption 3-4hrs till bed time. Seems to help. Today is injection day. Shot will be taken in the evening around 8 so will see how sleep and tomorrows morning BP will look like. Yesterday had a great back workout and really pushed myself in the gym. Today is lazy off day at home. Will go for a light walk later on. Less water today as experimenting with mineral and bottled water instead of regular tap through Brita filter. Will update what I find. Breathing also a lot better today, like I said before, nosal congestion seems to back off right around injection day leading into the shot. Interesting one, so see what happens.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Funny thing is I get most pain after eating healthy food and pretty much never get pain after eating greasy pizza and some biscuits. Weird af. Anyone else have/had such situation? Tried medium fat, low fat, no luck, same pain. So portion sizes are down and will eat every 2.5-3hrs. Also get some bloating all together with pain after eating and stomach discomfort.

Yes -- "healthy food" has more FODMAPs, more fiber, and more resistant starch. All of these indigestible forms of carbohydrate are fermented by your gut flora and contribute to the gas production that drives reflux. The bloating is another sign that you're producing more gas than you can handle.

 

[Belekas]

Yes -- "healthy food" has more FODMAPs, more fiber, and more resistant starch. All of these indigestible forms of carbohydrate are fermented by your gut flora and contribute to the gas production that drives reflux. The bloating is another sign that you're producing more gas than you can handle.

Yeah mate these are the obvious facts and I've been playing with them, manipulating for a long time. Most stories I hear is that folks do better on simple, clean, low fodmap food fwiw. Sometimes I do a lot better with fast-burning carbs then slower ones. Keep food simple to what I digest best. It's a mission as I have to eat a fair amount of food per day to function properly and be at my best. Yesterday was playing with water and noticed I get chest pain after drinking tap water pretty much right away so got some sparkling mineral water and still water from shop. Still a hit and miss. In the morning I feel good if I don't drink at all just have a meal. Then the trouble starts happening when I want to drink some water as I have to consumer lets say 2-3L/day. Trying to drink 30-60min post meal still get too full even from one glass and then chest discomfort. Can't go without drinking it, right? Next month will have extensive testing as it's been a bitch lately. Reduced food and already better. Also sleep improved and BP dramatically. So on the right road and will continue. Fwiw started taking d3/k2 solid brand supp and additional potassium so that also might have contributed to BP drop FWIW.

P.s
Havent seen such fasted morning BP since starting TRT 2+ months ago. Good sign, so happy for this one. Will continue to do what ai do and take now.)

 

[Belekas]

My BP went from sub 120/80 morning fasted pre TRT to as high as sub 140/100 in the period of a bit more then 2 months and now back to sub 120/80 again this morning. Those who are interested this is what I've improved/done over this time:

No work at nights, probably a major one here.
Quit smoking, another major one.
Potassium 400mg.
Magnesium 400mg.
Electrolites.
Recently NAC.
Recently D3+K2.
Zinc 50mg 3x/week.
Copper 3x/week.
Put on some weight.
Try to have 4-6 smaller meals across the day, mostly 4-5.
Basic diet protein, carbs and healthy fats.

Thats probably it. I reckon 2 first ones are major ones to spike BP. Supplements help as well but first need to treat the root cause. And all of this shit TAKES TIME. Gotta be patient when starting out. Lesson learned. It's easy to judge and give advice when you standing on the side without being involved in it but once you get involved it's actually funny to see how quick I can become impatient and try to deviate from my plan. So always gotta keep myself in check, prepare and GIVE IT TIME TO PLAY OUT. When feeling off even few months can feel like a lifetime and the urge to manipulate protocol or this or that will be greater then ever. This is were I believe it really pays to have a good Doctor or specialist working with you and it doen't matter that you've done this for decades, it still is a great option IMO.

 

[tareload]

Good sign, so happy for this one. Will continue to do what ai do and take now.)

Congratulations and really happy you are feeling better. To clarify what is in bold, you are taking AI or BP improvement was without the AI?

 

[tareload]

My BP went from sub 120/80 morning fasted pre TRT to as high as sub 140/100 in the period of a bit more then 2 months and now back to sub 120/80 again this morning. Those who are interested this is what I've improved/done over this time:

No work at nights, probably a major one here.
Quit smoking, another major one.
Potassium 400mg.
Magnesium 400mg.
Electrolites.
Recently NAC.
Recently D3+K2.
Zinc 50mg 3x/week.
Copper 3x/week.
Put on some weight.
Try to have 4-6 smaller meals across the day, mostly 4-5.
Basic diet protein, carbs and healthy fats.

Thats probably it. I reckon 2 first ones are major ones to spike BP. Supplements help as well but first need to treat the root cause. And all of this shit TAKES TIME. Gotta be patient when starting out. Lesson learned. It's easy to judge and give advice when you standing on the side without being involved in it but once you get involved it's actually funny to see how quick I can become impatient and try to deviate from my plan. So always gotta keep myself in check, prepare and GIVE IT TIME TO PLAY OUT. When feeling off even few months can feel like a lifetime and the urge to manipulate protocol or this or that will be greater then ever. This is were I believe it really pays to have a good Doctor or specialist working with you and it doen't matter that you've done this for decades, it still is a great option IMO.

AWESOME job Brother Belekas.

 

[Belekas]

Congratulations and really happy you are feeling better. To clarify what is in bold, you are taking AI or BP improvement was without the AI?

Thank you Brother for helping me stay on track without deviating much from the original plan. A man with a plan is tough to beat No AI as theres none around where Im at and just patience and every other natural option to get healthier and maintain proper balance. Also I think me dropping 1000kcal also helped of excessive water retention on top of all the things that were happening and I was doing on the daily basis.

 

[tareload]

Thank you Brother for helping me stay on track without deviating much from the original plan. A man with a plan is tough to beat No AI as theres none around where Im at and just patience and every other natural option to get healthier and maintain proper balance. Also I think me dropping 1000kcal also helped of excessive water retention on top of all the things that were happening and I was doing on the daily basis.

Fantastic summary and lesson for us all. I am glad you hung in there and did not confound your experiment with the AI. I know it is tough to do when you are suffering. Here's to your health and whatever gainz you can squeeze in there as well while feeling good and healthy!