Thyroid-Hypo.. what is lowest amount of NDT that has helped?

[BillyJ03z]

After years of struggling with fatigue, mild depression and lack of energy even after being on TRT for the past 10 plus years, I decided to finally give thyroid meds Armour Thyroid a shot... my Rt3 is fine, but my FT is at the very low bottom 5% of range and my FT3 is at the top 80% of range.. My doc started me on 30mg of Armour thyroid and will increase by 15 every 2 weeks and see if I feel better.. has anyone used NDT (ie. Armour) and if so did it help and what was the minimum or maximum you felt better with...

 

[Vettester Chris]

You need to post the labs. If your Free T4 is at the bottom and Free T3 is at the top of the range, then Free T3 is possibly pooling. How does the RT3/ Reverse T3 ratio look? If FT3 is pooling then TSH will drop or level out, which is why FT4 will start to sink... To boot if FT3 is pooling then the low reserve of FT4 will convert at higher rates of Reverse T3. If this is the problem then adding NDT is just going to be problematic.

 

[BillyJ03z]

I am at work at the moment so I don't have access to my full labs but I do have some the of the numbers I saved in my phone.....

TSH - 2.7 ulU/mL (.45 - 4.5)
Free T3 - 3.9 pg/mL (2.0 - 4.4)
Free T4 - .91 ng/dL (.82 - 1.77)

Reverse T3 - I can't remember the exact number but when I did the calculation my RT3 was low/not an issue. *Also, my antibodies were also good not an issue...

I was told that I might be pooling but the fact that my RT3 was not an issue I'm just wondering if it's just my FT4 being out of whack..

I do find myself having a lot of brain fog/memory issues and I have researched that T4 affects these functions.

thoughts???

 

[Vettester Chris]

I am at work at the moment so I don't have access to my full labs but I do have some the of the numbers I saved in my phone.....

TSH - 2.7 ulU/mL (.45 - 4.5)
Free T3 - 3.9 pg/mL (2.0 - 4.4)
Free T4 - .91 ng/dL (.82 - 1.77)

Reverse T3 - I can't remember the exact number but when I did the calculation my RT3 was low/not an issue. *Also, my antibodies were also good not an issue...

I was told that I might be pooling but the fact that my RT3 was not an issue I'm just wondering if it's just my FT4 being out of whack..

I do find myself having a lot of brain fog/memory issues and I have researched that T4 affects these functions.

thoughts???

Yeah, you're kind of on the right track with the RT3 and FT4 ... T4 converts to T3 and RT3. If something is causing T3 to pool then the demand increases for T4 to convert to higher rates of RT3. However, when FT4 is only at 10.5% of the reference range (as in your case), the amount of RT3 will reflect and be relative to FT4; resulting in lower serum levels.

This is where you will see some people take T3 only (Cytomel) treatments, allegedly to "flush" out RT3. What's being overlooked is that Reverse T3 isn't some foreign toxin needing purged, it is counter reaction marker to conserve resources when the body has various imbalances and/or is in a state of injury or sickness.

Also, consider this as you're moving forward on thyroid treatment ... As noted above, T4 converts to T3 (and T2, T1). In a normal functioning thyroid we might look at T4 as being the reserves, which feeds downstream with conversion to the more highly potent T3. For energy, metabolism, ATP, it would be fair to say that FT3 reaching the cells in the body is truly where the rubber hits the road. In an optimal arena, many including myself might say that an optimal FT3 serum level is somewhere in the 50%-to-80% area of the respective reference range. Yours is at 79% of the reference range!!

So to conclude, what would be accomplished with any thyroid treatment if your FT3 is already at the TOP of the range? Again, it's great to have an equal balance of T4 and T3, with low conversion to RT3, but ultimately the real results are with how efficient FT3 is working in the body (?). Like testosterone, the other variable is making sure there's an optimal amount of the hormone in the system .. In your case the serum level is fine. I think you may want to look deeper into areas like iron, ferritin, the adrenals, electrolytes, and variables that could impact T3 and cause it to pool. If you have a complete set of labs from CBC's to metabolic, post it up and let's talk more ...

 

[BillyJ03z]

@Vettester Chris

I'm in the process of getting together my thyroid labs from the past few years to post on here for you to review... In the meantime, I will just say majority of my Hypo symptoms started shortly after getting on TRT 9 yrs ago.... I am really in the belief that trt does cause some people to go hypo.... I did however have a 4pt saliva test done about 7 yrs ago and I remember I was low am, low noon, low evening, slightly high late night.... I will get those lab numbers up here in a few, but honestly my thyroid labs have basically remained the same for the past 9 plus years.. upper 80% ft3 range, bottom 10% ft4 range, etc... smdh

 

[Vince Carter]

Ill wait to see your RT3 numbers and those needed to be taken along with your posted numbers above, but your FT3 is near the top of the range and FT3 is the hormone that matters so unless you have a clear cut pooling issue then this "hypoThyroid" is nothing. FT4 being low I don't lend credence to that, 4 > 3 and you're obviously converting that to a good degree.

I don't buy all this "Hypo" or sluggish Thyroid fad that's going on.

 

[BillyJ03z]

@Vince Carter I hear what you are saying... but I am just going by when my symptoms and issues started (hypo symptoms started shortly after starting TRT which is also causing sleep problems). * i have been tested for Apnea, etc.. and nothing...

Although I understand that based on the labs that I posted it appears that I am converting acceptable levels of FT3 (FT3 is responsible for energy, metabolism, etc..), but from my research FT4 also plays a vital role in brain/mental energy (possibly help with dopamine production, etc.).. the fact that my FT4 is low and it coincides with my feeling of being unmotivated despite apparently having the energy to do things..

Basically I feel like I have the physical energy to do things but I don't have the mental energy/motivation to do anything. Completing simple mundane menial tasks seems hard (ie. paying bills, doing laundry, making dinner, taking a shower, etc...)

I will get my full labs up tonight...