Thyroid help

[Gman86]

I was on NatureThroid, then WP Thyroid, then NP Thyroid and finally Armour Thyroid. All the changes were due to recalls and shortages. Of all the ND thyroid treatments, Armour did me the most good. It definitely helped in the FT4 and TSH departments, but spiked my FT3 too high and I felt "jittery". The thing about the ND thyroid treatments is that you cannot control individual doses of T4/T3 and customize to fit your specific needs. You get what you get...and that's what you get.

I'm doing better on Levothyroxine (generic Synthroid) and Liothyronine (generic Cytomel). #Hashimotos

What’s ur dosages of T4 and T3 now that u can control each individually?

 

[rafapark]

I just did my blood work and my numbers are similar to yours. I've been thinking on taking armour thyroid to optimize my thyroid but after reading the experiences of some people here and in other places I rather not. I also have low Iodine so I will focus on increasing that. I don't have any of the symptoms so what would the point be? Is there any other test I should take other that the Thyroid tests to see if my not optimal thyroid is messing with something else? Somebody mentioned Cortisol saliva test. Anything else?

 

[sh1973]

No way in hell would I advise it. It has been almost 9 days and I’m still not back to normal due to the long half life of T4. That will be a one time shot for me. Never again will I ever try any thyroid medication. Honestly I should have known better because I don’t have hardly anything resembling hypothyroidism.

 

[sh1973]

Also are you on trt?

 

[fifty]

I haven’t heard many stories of thyroid treatment actually helping.

 

[rafapark]

Jay Campell swears by Armour Thyroid. He even reccomends that in his book.

 

[dell500]

My numbers are the same as the OPs. High rT3, mid-range T3, T4, mid (high) TSH. I have a family history of hypo in my family and I've been dealing with crazy lethargy after dialing in my TRT protocol (32mg EOD, 110mg/wk avg). First few weeks are fine then it feels like my body can't keep up. Caffeine helps, but pushes me over the edge and it's an endless cycle. I'm also with Defy and will be speaking about what's going on with Dr. Caleb Calkins here soon. Not sure what to do as the consensus is to not take on more medicine to relieve sides Hope you're feeling better OP.

 

[VacationMan]

Jay Campell swears by Armour Thyroid. He even reccomends that in his book.

Having been on NatureThroid, then WP Thyroid and then Armour, I can say that they did help. However, you're pretty much stuck with an inability to adjust doses of both T4 and T3 meds to fine tune dosage of both - you get what you get.

In my case (Hashimotos), I never could bring TSH down to an acceptable level with any of the desiccated thyroid meds. I could get close to having FT4 and TSH in range, but in doing so the necessary dosage would seriously spike FT3 and make me nine kinds of jittery.

Synthetic T4 meds alone could get FT4 in range but wouldn't bring TSH down to a reasonable range. The more T4 I took, the higher my RT3 would go - so my body isn't converting enough T4 to T3. Added a tiny dose of liothyronine (generic Cytomel, 5 mcg) to my T4 med solved it. My FT4 and FT3 are in the upper part of the range and TSH is down below 2.5...for the first time in over 3 years. Plenty of energy now - I feel great!

If Armour (or any of the desiccated thyroid meds for that matter) work for you - stick to it. They didn't work for me though.

 

[Gman86]

Having been on NatureThroid, then WP Thyroid and then Armour, I can say that they did help. However, you're pretty much stuck with an inability to adjust doses of both T4 and T3 meds to fine tune dosage of both - you get what you get.

In my case (Hashimotos), I never could bring TSH down to an acceptable level with any of the desiccated thyroid meds. I could get close to having FT4 and TSH in range, but in doing so the necessary dosage would seriously spike FT3 and make me nine kinds of jittery.

Synthetic T4 meds alone could get FT4 in range but wouldn't bring TSH down to a reasonable range. The more T4 I took, the higher my RT3 would go - so my body isn't converting enough T4 to T3. Added a tiny dose of liothyronine (generic Cytomel, 5 mcg) to my T4 med solved it. My FT4 and FT3 are in the upper part of the range and TSH is down below 2.5...for the first time in over 3 years. Plenty of energy now - I feel great!

If Armour (or any of the desiccated thyroid meds for that matter) work for you - stick to it. They didn't work for me though.

So what’s ur current thyroid protocol?

 

[VacationMan]

So what’s ur current thyroid protocol?

I was on the 1 1/2 grain (90 mg) NDT meds. Had enough T4 to get that in range, but way too much T3.

Now? 88 mcg of levothyroxine (generic Synthroid - T4) and 5 mcg of liothyronine (generic Cytomel - T3).

 

[Gman86]

I was on the 1 1/2 grain (90 mg) NDT meds. Had enough T4 to get that in range, but way too much T3.

Now? 88 mcg of levothyroxine (generic Synthroid - T4) and 5 mcg of liothyronine (generic Cytomel - T3).

So the answer for u was basically increasing ur T4 dose from 57mcg to 88mcg, and lowering ur T3 dose from 13.5mcg to 5mcg. Interesting. Glad ur feeling much better. The thyroid is by far the hardest hormone system to dial in. U ever check ur morning temps? How about RT3, ever check that?

U take both pills first thing in the morning on an empty stomach?

Do u mind posting ur latest thyroid lab work? I’d love to see where everything sits exactly while ur feeling so good.

 

[VacationMan]

So the answer for u was basically increasing ur T4 dose from 57mcg to 88mcg, and lowering ur T3 dose from 13.5mcg to 5mcg. Interesting. Glad ur feeling much better. The thyroid is by far the hardest hormone system to dial in. U ever check ur morning temps? How about RT3, ever check that?

U take both pills first thing in the morning on an empty stomach?

Do u mind posting ur latest thyroid lab work? I’d love to see where everything sits exactly while ur feeling so good.

That's it! Doc started me at 50 mcg of T4 only. We gradually titrated up to 75 mcg and then to 88 mcg (8 weeks between blood work). When T4 was good but T3 low/RT3 high/TSH still high, we figured out I'm not converting enough T4 to T3...or...what T3 I had was "pooling" due to the excess of RT3. Added 5 mcg of liothyronine to the meds. Voila! That did the trick.

This has been a 3-year quest for me. Now to just keep an eye on things and fine tune as needed. I'm destined for a lifetime of blood work every 6 months...

Yup - take both pills with a glass of water upon waking every morning. I wait at least 30 minutes before having anything but water (coffee included). That wasn't an easy adjustment.

Morning temperature is a little low - like 97.6-ish. No biggie though.

Thyroid labs from June 2020:

T3 Total: 147 (76 - 181 ng/dL scale)

T3 Free: 4.4 (2.3 - 4.2 pg/mL scale) - yeah, a wee bit high - but nowhere near what it was on NDT meds. Kinda hard to split 5 mcg of liothyronine. I can live with it as-is.

TPO Antibody: 464 (should be < 9 IU/mL) - This was upwards of 1100 less than 6 months ago, so trending in the right direction. Attribute this to eliminating gluten and dairy from my diet. Boy do I miss ice cream...(shhhh! I still cheat a little bit).

Thyroglobulin Antibody: 10 (should be <= 1 IU/mL). Again, down from what it was 6 months ago.

T3 uptake: 33 (22 - 35% scale)

T4 total: 9.4 (4.9 - 10.5 mcg/dL scale)

Free Thyroxine Index (T7): 3.1 (1.4 - 3.8 scale)

TSH: 1.95 (0.40 - 4.50 mIU/L scale) - down from the upper 6-ish range.

T4 Free: 1.5 (0.8 - 1.8 ng/dL scale)

Reverse T3: 17 (8 - 25 ng/dL scale) - this came down once we added the T3 drug. Was way above 25 ng/dL.

Interesting observation, and a pleasant side-effect: I'm gradually dropping excess weight. Down 15 lbs since getting all this straightened out. Only 20 lbs left to go <sigh>

BTW, I'm also on HRT + HCG and AI. I'm finding that I need less of the AI as the weight melts off. All good!

 

[Vince]

I thought this was an interesting article. I recently read it, even though it doesn’t pertain to most of us.

Armour® Thyroid Rage - A Dangerous Mixture - PubMed

Armour® Thyroid (Forest Pharmaceuticals, LLC; affiliate of Allergan, Dublin, Ireland) is a natural porcine derivative thyroid supplement that is frequently used without physician monitoring by health enthusiasts as a weight loss supplement. Although there are no publications associating Armour...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov