TESTOSTERONE ONLY, NOTHING ELSE.

[DragonBits]

I am a huge supporter of testoserone only and perhaps small doses of hcg every few months and thats it. Usually if T dosages are not high ( over 120 mgs per week) and you miantain low body fat, estrogen is not a problem. To me, and its only my opinion, too many men are looking to feel perfect all the time. They want a high sex drive 24/7, always have energy, always be in a good mood ect..
Unfortunately, thats very unrealistic and leads many men to start searching for problems that arent truly an issue.
Testosterone is supposed to be used just to replace what you should normally have. Is it normal for a 60 year old to walk around with a T level of 900 ??

I always think it's twisted logic to attempt to discuss what normal is?

Is it normal to wear clothes, drive around at 60 mph, take jets to other countries, swallow antibiotics, live with central heating and air conditioning, swap out your heart? Etc, etc. It seems to me all of human existence is about an attempt to get away from the restrictions of what is "natural". Then we make a token effort like take a hike in the park as a symbolic return to nature.

Regardless, labcorp hardly a bastion of aggressive TRT, they define average T levels for men of 60 as a range of 264 - 916 ng/dl. So they think 900 ng/dl is within the averages.

IMO it's always a danger to exceed any norms, most often it isn't a good thing, but sometimes it makes life much better and sometime it just doesn't have a positive or negative effect.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Remember LabCorp recently lowered their T range.

 

[DragonBits]

Remember LabCorp recently lowered their T range.

BTW, that was the lower labcorp range.

 

[madman]

I dont mean a 65 year old should walk around with a T level of 200-300, thats not what i meant. In fact there are plenty of healthy, in shape 65 year olds with T levels in the 500’s. Even President Trump had a total T level of 471 and he isnt even in shape.
Lets say you are 65 and have low T and low corresponding free T. Getting your levels to 900 simply isnt normal for a healthy 35 year old never mind a 65 year old. I just think you are walking a tight rope with your health if you do that at your age. Of course you are going to feel good, why wouldnt you?? However, you can feel very good and perform very well in the 500’s and not have all the issues that go with unnaturally high T levels.

Lets say you are 65 and have low T and low corresponding free T. Getting your levels to 900 simply isnt normal for a healthy 35 year old never mind a 65 year old.

-Says who?


However, you can feel very good and perform very well in the 500’s and not have all the issues that go with unnaturally high T levels.[/QUOTE]

- try telling that to men with high SHBG.....as you should know and understand by know that not only does SHBG levels dictate dose/injection frequency but it will play a critical role in what TT level one needs to achieve in order to have a healthy FT

 

[Raaj]

Little make me more simple. I am planning to start TRT.
Please let me know the dosages for starting TRT
I am 41, weight 75kg and body fat 20% mainly on abdonimal, love handled and buttocks
Should I start with 100mg and then settle down to 130 to 140 depending upon my blood work.
I do not want to use AI or Hcg. HCG can be planned later but not as of now

 

[lowe2sucks]

Little make me more simple. I am planning to start TRT.
Please let me know the dosages for starting TRT
I am 41, weight 75kg and body fat 20% mainly on abdonimal, love handled and buttocks
Should I start with 100mg and then settle down to 130 to 140 depending upon my blood work.
I do not want to use AI or Hcg. HCG can be planned later but not as of now

100mg weekly
you can always go up

 

[Raaj]

Can anyone please help as T Cypionate half life is 5 days. Before I inject my first injection of my life I do not want to use AI in my entire life. I just want the start interval of dosage and frequency my SHSB is 50.
Should it be EOD or E3D or Daily of every 5 days. Little bit confused. Kind help needed and advice before first jab.

 

[Airborne Warrior]

E3.5D should be good for an SHBG of 50.

 

[Vince]

E3.5D should be good for an SHBG of 50.

I agree, I would start with 50 mg every three and a half days, along with 500 IU of HCG.
I'm a big fan of HCG, I know other members can't use it. My starting protocol was 70 mg of testosterone cypionate along with 500 IU of HCG. I injected both same day every three and a half days.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Remember that “normal” for my age is to be in the 200-300 range, have no muscle tone, saggy gut, skinny arms, etc. Virtually all my peers are in a state of decline, along with their spouses.

Never confuse normal with healthy.

Let’s be honest here....how many of your peers worked out regularly and/or lived healthy lifestyles even in their younger years?

Based on my observations and my peers, out of say 20-30 of my buddies and their spouses, non ever worked out, ate clean, or seemed to care about their physical appearance in their 30’s to present.

I started working out in my early 30’s and have stuck with it. I lift weights 5 days a week.
I am also a competitive shooter that requires running and speed. As well as an active hunter who hikes miles in pursuit of game.
I have not drank alcohol in over 25 years. Don’t take drugs. Don’t drink coffee...ever...have never drank sodas. And try to eat healthy and exercise portion control.

I think many...based on this forum and many others about TRT...think that being on TRT is a “magic pill” that will give them their youth back.
As we know...this is not the case.

 

[Ronnny]

is there any difference between being on Clomid and Being on TRT same thing? I mean if I have the same level of TT with both.

 

[Airborne Warrior]

In simple terms, many feel sh1t on Clomid whilst many feel good on TRT.

Obviously once dialed in.

 

[Ronnny]

Fortunately Clomid did not give me any side effects.For sure I do not feel sh1t anymore with Clomid but Anastrozole gives me mild nausia for some reason. Doc prescribed me 1mg Anastrozole/day. I think the dose is too high. how much should I take and how many days...anybody any idea?

 

[Vince]

Fortunately Clomid did not give me any side effects.For sure I do not feel sh1t anymore with Clomid but Anastrozole gives me mild nausia for some reason. Doc prescribed me 1mg Anastrozole/day. I think the dose is too high. how much should I take and how many days...anybody any idea?

I wouldn't start with more than .125 mg twice a week, that's pretty much standard.

 

[DragonBits]

I agree, I would start with 50 mg every three and a half days, along with 500 IU of HCG.
I'm a big fan of HCG, I know other members can't use it. My starting protocol was 70 mg of testosterone cypionate along with 500 IU of HCG. I injected both same day every three and a half days.

Vince, I alway enjoy reading your posts.

However ...

My comment is since you started off with HCG and never did without, you have no idea if it does anything for you. If I am not mistaken about this, you could just at well be injecting bacteriostatic water. Maybe all the benefits is from testosterone cypionate and dhea.

I had been on TRT (testosterone alone) for 5 years, no dhea, no hcg, I felt about the same as I did with HCG with or without DHEA. After 5 years I quit for 18 months solely to increase my fertility, with 3 months of clomid my sperm counts came back to normal.

And since you are primary, you don't produce (much?) testosterone on your own either.

You would have to quit HCG for at least a couple of months (I would think) to really see if quitting had any negative effects.

 

[Vince Carter]

Pretty fair point @DragonBits

 

[Vince]

Vince, I alway enjoy reading your posts.

However ...

My comment is since you started off with HCG and never did without, you have no idea if it does anything for you. If I am not mistaken about this, you could just at well be injecting bacteriostatic water. Maybe all the benefits is from testosterone cypionate and dhea.

I had been on TRT (testosterone alone) for 5 years, no dhea, no hcg, I felt about the same as I did with HCG with or without DHEA. After 5 years I quit for 18 months solely to increase my fertility, with 3 months of clomid my sperm counts came back to normal.

And since you are primary, you don't produce (much?) testosterone on your own either.

You would have to quit HCG for at least a couple of months (I would think) to really see if quitting had any negative effects.

Yes that's something I wonder about every so often, is HCG doing nothing for me. I guess the reason I continue doing it, I like the way my testicles feel. I should probably stop HCG for 3 months and see what results I would have. For now though I will continue using it.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I have notice ZERO effect of stopping HCG as far as nut size. In fact, they seemed to be firmer and fuller on just T.

What did change is my E dropped in half and I lost 10+ lbs of water weight and bloat.

As with everything TRT...your results may be different.

 

[Gman86]

I have notice ZERO effect of stopping HCG as far as nut size. In fact, they seemed to be firmer and fuller on just T.

What did change is my E dropped in half and I lost 10+ lbs of water weight and bloat.

As with everything TRT...your results may be different.

I honestly believe it with the whole testicles feeling firmer and fuller thing. High estrogen can cause testicular atrophy, so makes sense that lowering E2 can have the opposite effect.

I mean just think about it, when a man transitions into becoming a woman, he goes on estrogen I’m pretty sure. This would start to elimate male features overtime, so I would assume that would include some type of an effect on testicles.

How long have you been off HCG?

 

[lemonflavor]

How do SHBG levels and frequency of injection correlate? I've been on TRT for the second time for about 7 weeks. My SHBG was 52 a few years ago on the first time around. I'm injecting EOD now and wondering what less frequency might do, if anything. Otherwise, I'm just curious about this or anything else related to middle of the road SHGB.