MY TRT STARTED! i would be very greatfull to get opinions and support :)

[eddy99]

Hi lads, i read some threads here and i hope i post this in the right place if not pls correct me , im very new and would like to learn more from u . first of all english is not my first language so i hope its not pain to read through this long post.

im 33y old , weigh around 100kg height 173cm, pretty jacked ( ppl in the gym sometimes think i use steroids) , never did any cycle just naturaly more bulky and strong. my incline bench was around 115kg when i was at 93kg 5x5 sets.
all my life i was doing all kind of sports. i also suffered from bad family situations.
as a kid i also was one of the best in sports but always kinda chubby.

so i first noticed when i went to the gym that from the much work i put in and also clean food maybe 1 cheat meal a week i should look way diffrent + the weights i lifted . ofc everyone says im a big guy but i never ever get lean . 2nd thing was my lack in libido at around 25years even . but i never knew why . i knew that from much stress and bad situations i also had to deal with crazy sleep problems. i also noticed that i dont really sweat doing sport even when i do cardio.

so at 33y i did my first lab :

as u can see everything seems in range but almost everything in lower range . my free test + test very low . my gym sessions where always ok but i lack hard with sleep + no energy after gym through the day. feels like thats the only thing i can do and which keeps me alive.

i wanted to start with test enanthate 150mg split in 2 injections per week. i didnt go to a doc because it would be too much struggle here in my country to get a good trt . yes maybe not the best idea but thats my decision rn i have to go with. my friend told me that im so big naturally i should higher so rn my starting dosage is 3 injections each 0.25 so thats around 187mg test E per week which is around 135mg real testosteron correct me if im wrong but i also think everyone converts test diffrent so only the next blood test will tell . I do IM injections with insulin needles in delt btw

does anyone know how long to wait to change the dosage without labs ? dont get me wrong i will do labs every 3month i guess but when should u rly feel improvement or indicators that u are on maybe too high or low dosage ? rn my energy is just okey nothing more than before trt im on it 3 weeks. the only thing i noticed is that the erection is weaker , sleep is not much better , gym strength kinda same.

i just dont know if i should go lower or higher and when . maybe i just still wait till 8 weeks in ?
i know a guy who takes 1ml test e every 5 days and said he sleeps like a baby . ofc that pretty much a steroid cycle but i also heard that on trt the sleep should get better. my libido is not rly better aswell. maybe i started to high or also i still have to wait and then adapt. my only concern is that i maybe should have started lower dose . i dont have any acne or other bad side effects on this rn .

i apreciate everyone who took the time to read this and maybe its also interesting for other or new ppl . i know trt wont help in every situation and i also dont expect it to change my life strenght and happiness just like that . so im pretty realistic . my hope would be to get better sleep and some libido back + get leaner with all that hard work in the gym.

 

[Systemlord]

my energy is just okey nothing more than before trt im on it 3 weeks.

Three weeks is nothing, your hormone levels won’t even be steady until 6 weeks. Things in the hormone world don’t happen over night.

Time span until maximum benefits is 12 months. and even then you get incremental improvement for years.

If anything your T dosage is above average. Wait 6-8 weeks before getting labs done.

I didn’t sweat at all in the gym when I had low vitamin D, and supplementing made my skin moist and sweat more during workouts.

Onset of effects of testosterone treatment and time span until maximum effects are achieved

Testosterone has a spectrum of effects on the male organism. This review attempts to determine, from published studies, the time-course of the effects induced by testosterone replacement therapy from their first manifestation until maximum effects are ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[eddy99]

Three weeks is nothing, your hormone levels won’t even be steady until 6 weeks. Things in the hormone world don’t happen over night.

Time span until maximum benefits is 12 months. and even then you get incremental improvement for years.

If anything your T dosage is above average. Wait 6-8 weeks before getting labs done.

I didn’t sweat at all in the gym when I had low vitamin D, and supplementing made my skin moist and sweat more during workouts.

Onset of effects of testosterone treatment and time span until maximum effects are achieved

Testosterone has a spectrum of effects on the male organism. This review attempts to determine, from published studies, the time-course of the effects induced by testosterone replacement therapy from their first manifestation until maximum effects are ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

thanks for ur answer . yes i made a mistake with too high dosage i guess. but we will see in the next blood test. so i shouldnt lower the amount during the 8 weeks right . or could it be ok to go little bit lower now ? to 150mg test e split in 3. btw do u guys take zinc ? i heard it can also kill libido if u take too much . if u on trt or not . rn im taking 25mg ed.

 

[Systemlord]

so i shouldnt lower the amount during the 8 weeks right

So about 4-6 weeks blood levels will be steady, waiting longer is up to you. Odds are your current dosage will be too much, but if you lower the dosage now, you reset everything and steady state on the new protocol will occur in 4-6 weeks.

I’m a little more conservative in dosing recommendations, so I would do 120 mg weekly split up however you prefer. I would just keep it simple, 60 mg twice weekly and retest in 6 weeks.

i heard it can also kill libido if u take too much .

Yes, overstimulating the central nervous system from too many androgens, overloading, the hormonal signaling pathways can have consequences.

Also, libido is multifaceted, having healthy hormones is one component to having a strong libido. Being chubby may be more about genetics, than hormones as not everyone can be ripped or lean.

I was a very lean skinny kid, a toothpick in my teenage years. My metabolism and energy pre-diabetes was very high, way above average!

 

[eddy99]

So about 4-6 weeks blood levels will be steady, waiting longer is up to you. Odds are your current dosage will be too much, but if you lower the dosage now, you reset everything and steady state on the new protocol will occur in 4-6 weeks.

I’m a little more conservative in dosing recommendations, so I would do 120 mg weekly split up however you prefer. I would just keep it simple, 60 mg twice weekly and retest in 6 weeks.

Yes, overstimulating the central nervous system from too many androgens, overloading, the hormonal signaling pathways can have consequences.

Also, libido is multifaceted, having healthy hormones is one component to having a strong libido. Being chubby may be more about genetics, than hormones as not everyone can be ripped or lean.

I was a very lean skinny kid, a toothpick in my teenage years. My metabolism and energy pre-diabetes was very high, way above average!

thanks alot. so 120mg test E like u said would be around 86mg real test ( depending how the person converts aswell) that should be around natural max. at least i dont feel any sideeffects rn .i wanted to start with 125mg a week split in 2 till my friend said its not enough cause im too big. how much zinc do u take btw ? i should have listen to myself starting with 125mg test e ^^ but who knows how much my body is absorbing. i apreciate ur time mate . lets see. i just work with this now next 3 weeks get some blood work and then lower to 150 or 125 . at least i felt some libido this monday and better errection. maybe cause my body is getting more used to or more likely cause the injections was longer time ago cause i inject. monday morning , wednesday morning and friday evening

 

[eddy99]

So about 4-6 weeks blood levels will be steady, waiting longer is up to you. Odds are your current dosage will be too much, but if you lower the dosage now, you reset everything and steady state on the new protocol will occur in 4-6 weeks.

I’m a little more conservative in dosing recommendations, so I would do 120 mg weekly split up however you prefer. I would just keep it simple, 60 mg twice weekly and retest in 6 weeks.

Yes, overstimulating the central nervous system from too many androgens, overloading, the hormonal signaling pathways can have consequences.

Also, libido is multifaceted, having healthy hormones is one component to having a strong libido. Being chubby may be more about genetics, than hormones as not everyone can be ripped or lean.

I was a very lean skinny kid, a toothpick in my teenage years. My metabolism and energy pre-diabetes was very high, way above average!

what do u think about my ft3 and ft4 btw ? would lower ft3 cause simular problems ? cause that was the first i thought about . if its maybe too low and my metabolism isnt rly good. apreciate ur answer. its says im in range but also low range. do u think all the other numbers are normal ?

 

[Systemlord]

if its maybe too low and my metabolism isnt rly good.

Not everyone is born with a high metabolism, also the genes are like programming code, it tells your body how much fat to store, which means you have to work harder to get lean. Take an obese child for example, they may never be ripped or lean.

what do u think about my ft3 and ft4 btw ?

do u think all the other numbers are normal ?

Yes I do, because people with hypothyroidism have horrible lipids and high triglycerides. Your TSH is lower which indicates your thyroid doesn’t need a lot of stimulation to get the job done.

I think those fT3 and fT4 are normal for you, because everyone has their own normal ranges.

 

[eddy99]

Not everyone is born with a high metabolism, also the genes are like programming code, it tells your body how much fat to store, which means you have to work harder to get lean. Take an obese child for example, they may never be ripped or lean.


Yes I do, because people with hypothyroidism have horrible lipids and high triglycerides. Your TSH is lower which indicates your thyroid doesn’t need a lot of stimulation to get the job done.

I think those fT3 and fT4 are normal for you, because everyone has their own normal ranges.

thank u for ur opinion. i will update the lab after 8 weeks and stay with the dosage. apreciate ur time meanwhile i will update if i can feel some changes if anyone is interested.

 

[Drug350]

First really important question: where are you buying, or getting your testosterone enanthate ??? Is is "pharma grade" testosterone or UGL from some website online ??? This is REALLY important because I used to buy testosterone online from half a dozen UGL's. I just started TRT from my doctor getting 100 MG's Pharma grade Testosterone Cypionate. This 100 MG's pharma grade testosterone has raised my testosterone numbers higher, and "shrunk my balls" significantly (sucks) compared to ANY UGL's testosterone that I took, and I was taking 500 MG's +, meaning most of that UGL is under dosed or completely "bunk". If you're NOT using pharma grade testosterone that you actually get prescribed from a doctor and pick up at a pharmacy, I'd go get bloods drawn within a few weeks of starting to see if your testosterone is legit or bunk and doing nothing or very little.

 

[eddy99]

First really important question: where are you buying, or getting your testosterone enanthate ??? Is is "pharma grade" testosterone or UGL from some website online ??? This is REALLY important because I used to buy testosterone online from half a dozen UGL's. I just started TRT from my doctor getting 100 MG's Pharma grade Testosterone Cypionate. This 100 MG's pharma grade testosterone has raised my testosterone numbers higher, and "shrunk my balls" significantly (sucks) compared to ANY UGL's testosterone that I took, and I was taking 500 MG's +, meaning most of that UGL is under dosed or completely "bunk". If you're NOT using pharma grade testosterone that you actually get prescribed from a doctor and pick up at a pharmacy, I'd go get bloods drawn within a few weeks of starting to see if your testosterone is legit or bunk and doing nothing or very little.

thanks mate no worries i get it from pharmacy and as the other mate said. it really takes up to 8 weeks + every body converts hormones diffrent. i dont stress myself i just wait and see. i did almost 3 years research the only mistake i might have done was taking 180mg test e as beginning , when my plan was act. only 125mg. afte 8 weeks i get my labs. rn i feel ok no side effects.

 

[Drug350]

OK. Good. Because most of that UGL is bunk or under dosed. Heck, might not even be testosterone at all. Yea. 180 MG's is definitely high, but everyone is different. My numbers went from 150 - 160 NGDL to well over 1000 NGDL on 100 MG's per week with my lowest numbers 7 days post shot dropping to over 600 NGDL. I just switched to every 3rd day dosing. Going back for more bloods in 6 weeks. Best of luck. I'm surprised you haven't noticed any major changes. Kinda tells me maybe your testosterone before going on this exogenous testosterone, was actually working pretty well. In my case, being really low for year's, I noticed significant changes, even in 24 hours. My sleep went from horrendous to fantastic the 2nd day. Been that way ever since. My libido went from non existent to having sex 3 - 5 times a day, and wanting more. My erections went from rare and weak to numerous and rigid.. My personal experience, it's been a night & day difference. My body has since gotten used to these new androgens and my libido isn't like it was that first 3 weeks (I wish), but everything else is about the same, including my incredible sleep. My sleep is AMAZING now on TRT. Biggest difference for me. Anyways, get your bloods done again in 6 - 8 weeks and see where you are at. Everyone is different and responds differently. 180 MG's a week would have me at probably close to 2000 NGDL but you may be half that. Won't know until you get those bloods. Best wishes.

 

[eddy99]

OK. Good. Because most of that UGL is bunk or under dosed. Heck, might not even be testosterone at all. Yea. 180 MG's is definitely high, but everyone is different. My numbers went from 150 - 160 NGDL to well over 1000 NGDL on 100 MG's per week with my lowest numbers 7 days post shot dropping to over 600 NGDL. I just switched to every 3rd day dosing. Going back for more bloods in 6 weeks. Best of luck. I'm surprised you haven't noticed any major changes. Kinda tells me maybe your testosterone before going on this exogenous testosterone, was actually working pretty well. In my case, being really low for year's, I noticed significant changes, even in 24 hours. My sleep went from horrendous to fantastic the 2nd day. Been that way ever since. My libido went from non existent to having sex 3 - 5 times a day, and wanting more. My erections went from rare and weak to numerous and rigid.. My personal experience, it's been a night & day difference. My body has since gotten used to these new androgens and my libido isn't like it was that first 3 weeks (I wish), but everything else is about the same, including my incredible sleep. My sleep is AMAZING now on TRT. Biggest difference for me. Anyways, get your bloods done again in 6 - 8 weeks and see where you are at. Everyone is different and responds differently. 180 MG's a week would have me at probably close to 2000 NGDL but you may be half that. Won't know until you get those bloods. Best wishes.

i apreciate ur message. but do u think when i did my first ever test injection too high i kinda fucked up cause now i always need more than ever needed ? im honest i didnt really understand what u ment with the exogenous testosterone. i dont feel difrence rn but i heard i rly should feel diffrent after at least 8 weeks. crazy that 100mg put u in top range. i also heard numbers are one thing but it also has to match with the persons symtoms / better feeling. some ppl might even feel better with lower numbers in lab and lower dosages. im still disapointed in myself cause i wanted to start with 125mg but maybe im lucky and i rly need more cause im also a bigger guy . lets see. and best wishes from me too. really happy for u that u feel much better. like i said i went through a lot in my life. and i know trt is not just there to solve every problem . but a good sleep would really help my life . do u take zinc btw ? and how much . i heard if u take too much it can also kill libido

 

[Drug350]

Everyone is different. You could give the same dose to 10 different guys and all 10 would have different blood work numbers / response. I truly didn't expect my numbers to be where they were. I was stunned. As far as starting at a higher dose and "fucking you up if you want to, or need to, reduce, you should be just fine. Happens all the time. 100 MG's a week is a normal starting dose and lots of doctors will start a patient at this dose, than have blood work drawn 6 - 8 weeks later, adjust as needed. For many, they need to reduce to fall inline with healthy guidelines. For others, they need more, and doctors will have them go to 125 or 150 MG's a week, than go another 6 - 8 weeks, get blood work, repeat if necessary, until numbers fall in line and you are receiving the positive effects from TRT. When I said "exogenous testosterone" I meant testosterone that you take (inject, pills, pellets, cream, lotion, gel, etc....) not your natural testosterone produced by your testicles. That's all.
Obviously if you are really low, like 150 NGDL and having many issues, than getting on TRT, one will generally "feel" more than an individual that is at, say 400 NGDL and gets on TRT, assuming all other numbers are similar (Free, Bioavailable, Estradiol, Prolactin, etc....). These other numbers all very important. One could have a total testosterone of 400 with a free ratio of 4% which equals 16 NGDL and another individual could have a total testosterone of 800 NGDL with a free of 1% which equals8 NGDL. In all reality, I'd rather be the first guy because while his total is half the other guys, his free, or the testosterone available to be used by his body, is double the guy with an 800 total. I know. Very confusing. Than add in the effects of estrogen, SHBG, Prolactin, just to name three, and the numbers become even more complex. That's why a good doctor who truly understands TRT, will not strictly go by any one number, be it total or free, and will base testosterone amount, dose frequency, and ancillaries (arimedex, HCG, etc..) on how you are feeling. Just remember, "more" is NOT necessarily better. If your testosterone is too high, you can suffer from a whole host of issues, including blood thickening, stroke, high / bad cholesterol, heart disease, high blood pressure, ED, libido issue's, estrogen problems, and many, many more. Honestly, like most things, there's a "sweet spot" and that's what most of us are chasing.

 

[eddy99]

yes i understand. time will tell. the ppl i know in they gym who take 1ml e5d feel better very soon as i talked to them ofc they not on trt .after 8 weeks i get bloodwork and will let u know. i also heard it could be better for some ppl to inject daily i really dont mind btw. only thing is to backload so often ^^ and yes i think its pretty interesting that even some ppl on 1ml e5d might not even convert so much into test. cause lower dosages would be more effective right. or at least split more often. its all individual but from my understanding it would makes sense overall to have higher free test with daily injections cause its easier for the body to convert and not so much converts to estrogen .

 

[Drug350]

yes i understand. time will tell. the ppl i know in they gym who take 1ml e5d feel better very soon as i talked to them ofc they not on trt .after 8 weeks i get bloodwork and will let u know. i also heard it could be better for some ppl to inject daily i really dont mind btw. only thing is to backload so often ^^ and yes i think its pretty interesting that even some ppl on 1ml e5d might not even convert so much into test. cause lower dosages would be more effective right. or at least split more often. its all individual but from my understanding it would makes sense overall to have higher free test with daily injections cause its easier for the body to convert and not so much converts to estrogen .

Yes. Correct. Injecting smaller doses daily, ala "micro-dosing", can help with symptoms like high Estradiol because you're not having those super high testosterone spikes like you do injecting your entire dose once a week. I'm sorry to say I've done plenty of gear in my time, starting in the late 80's when virtually everything available was pharma grade gear. So I've experienced quite a lot of different drugs/compounds, cycles, estrogen issues, prolactin issues, "Deca Dick" or "Tren Dick", you name it. I stopped all gear several years ago and just started TRT in late November. I originally was on 100 MG's, once a week, however, I just went to see my doctor and I told her that I felt freaking amazing for the first 3 days, than normal for 2 days, than shitty the last 2 days. I believe my spikes must be huge because at 7 days, my numbers are all high normal, with free and Bioavailable at the very top range. In fact, she said I can't go higher so she doesn't want to put me on 125 - 150 MG's once a week, but is having me try twice weekly 50 MG's injections instead. Honestly, I'm going to do every 3rd day because 3.5 days is too difficult to track and put alerts on my smartphone calendar. So I'll go back and have bloods run in 8 weeks. I must confess, it's difficult to "not overdue it or take more", after doing many cycles over the past 25 years. My 1 ML 200 MG testosterone cypionate from the pharmacy is a "single use only vial", meaning there's no preservatives added, should only be used once and discarded. So now I'm prescribed double the testosterone, so 16 x 1 ML 200 MG's (16 CC total) Testosterone Cypionate every 56 days/8 weeks because I'm supposed to inject 1/4 CC and throw the rest, 3/4 CC in the garbage twice a week. That's extremely tempting, and I'm certain, you may cross that bridge one day too. I hope you don't, but it's very difficult not to do it once, at least, "just to see how a cycle might transform you" . Best wishes. Please keep posting your experience.

 

[eddy99]

Yes. Correct. Injecting smaller doses daily, ala "micro-dosing", can help with symptoms like high Estradiol because you're not having those super high testosterone spikes like you do injecting your entire dose once a week. I'm sorry to say I've done plenty of gear in my time, starting in the late 80's when virtually everything available was pharma grade gear. So I've experienced quite a lot of different drugs/compounds, cycles, estrogen issues, prolactin issues, "Deca Dick" or "Tren Dick", you name it. I stopped all gear several years ago and just started TRT in late November. I originally was on 100 MG's, once a week, however, I just went to see my doctor and I told her that I felt freaking amazing for the first 3 days, than normal for 2 days, than shitty the last 2 days. I believe my spikes must be huge because at 7 days, my numbers are all high normal, with free and Bioavailable at the very top range. In fact, she said I can't go higher so she doesn't want to put me on 125 - 150 MG's once a week, but is having me try twice weekly 50 MG's injections instead. Honestly, I'm going to do every 3rd day because 3.5 days is too difficult to track and put alerts on my smartphone calendar. So I'll go back and have bloods run in 8 weeks. I must confess, it's difficult to "not overdue it or take more", after doing many cycles over the past 25 years. My 1 ML 200 MG testosterone cypionate from the pharmacy is a "single use only vial", meaning there's no preservatives added, should only be used once and discarded. So now I'm prescribed double the testosterone, so 16 x 1 ML 200 MG's (16 CC total) Testosterone Cypionate every 56 days/8 weeks because I'm supposed to inject 1/4 CC and throw the rest, 3/4 CC in the garbage twice a week. That's extremely tempting, and I'm certain, you may cross that bridge one day too. I hope you don't, but it's very difficult not to do it once, at least, "just to see how a cycle might transform you" . Best wishes. Please keep posting your experience.

thx for ur input . nono i know myself very good i have no kinda charakter or behaviour sorry my english isnt that good . for any addiction or to force something im pretty chilled and the only mistake was that i listened to a friend who told me 125 is not enough as u can see . im alrdy willing to lower rn even i feel ok . for me always less is more . also in the gym. i dont like to push crazy weights cause i know from the looks only u can safe ur joints with low weight but nice pump for the muscle ^^ i inject 60mg monday morning , thuesday morning and friday evening. but i have a strong feeling . that 65mg twice a week could do the job but its my first time ever taking something and im pretty happy that i research like 2 years or so . and im not doin it for gainz i have enough ^^