How bad of an idea would it be to give my wife some T-cyp?

[Deleted member 43589]

Might try the gels. Some women get very freaked out about injections.

 

[tareload]

test cream on the labia. Much more palatable than injections or pellets for some. Pellets are a crock in my mind (minor surgery each time). You can bail out on the cream very fast (elimination half life under a hour based on my methodical analysis).

Obligatory disclaimer to work with Provider you trust. Start low and go slow.

Oral progesterone also may be helpful. Virtus makes an authorized generic for Prometrium that is a better deal than retail Prometrium. Same brand name pill in generic bottle and price.

 

[ed031561]

Is it testosterone monotherapy, or does she also take progesterone? Does she monitor endometrial thickness?

No and no. it was a trial to she how she felt. She is supposed to go to an endo as she is also on T3 and T4 due to no thyroid function. Getting her there is problematic to say the least.

 

[jobshopper]

My wife's libido is even worse than mine. It's been like that ever since our daughter was born 4 years ago. She had a healthy libido before pregnancy and even throughout pregnancy, but giving birth was like flipping a switch that shut off the libido. She's 43 now and probably has low T, although we haven't tested yet.

How bad of an idea would it be for me to give her something like 4 mg of test cypionate twice a week as a trial to see if it does anything beneficial for her? From what I've read this should be a relatively conservative dose. I'm not opposed to getting her set up with a proper HRT clinic but I am reluctant to waste the time and money if she isn't going to respond well. Are there significant risks of virilization with a dose like this?

My wife is 69 years old (post-menopausal). She has been on Testosterone and Progesterone cream for over 4 years. She uses Testosterone cream 5 days a week with two days off. She uses progesterone on the 1st day of the month through the 25th day of the month. The past 4 years she has had a healthy libido and I often have a tough time keeping up with her. I have on rare occasions consented to her having a 5mg injection of T Cyp when she runs out of cream.

Medicare covers her labs. The trick for us was finding a PCP who accepts Medicare and was not opposed to HRT. They are very rare and hard to find. After our other PCP retired it took me 2 weeks of daily phone calls and researching before I found a PCP who accepted Medicare and would manage our TRT/HRT protocols.

I hope this helps.

 

[jobshopper]

test cream on the labia. Much more palatable than injections or pellets for some. Pellets are a crock in my mind (minor surgery each time). You can bail out on the cream very fast (elimination half life under a hour based on my methodical analysis).

Obligatory disclaimer to work with Provider you trust. Start low and go slow.

Oral progesterone also may be helpful. Virtus makes an authorized generic for Prometrium that is a better deal than retail Prometrium. Same brand name pill in generic bottle and price.

I agree that test cream on the labia has been my wife's best experience since absorption is much better.

I would caution anyone using a Progesterone supplement to make sure that it is bio-identical and not equine progesterone.

Animal progesterone and bio-identical progesterone are not the same.

... just my two cents...

 

[tareload]

I agree that test cream on the labia has been my wife's best experience since absorption is much better.

I would caution anyone using a Progesterone supplement to make sure that it is bio-identical and not equine progesterone.

Animal progesterone and bio-identical progesterone are not the same.

... just my two cents...

Agreed. Prometrium is top notch bio identical progesterone.

PROMETRIUM® (progesterone, USP)

 

[jobshopper]

Bio-identical Progesterone is also commonly available at compounding pharmacies. That's where my wife gets hers.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

How is she doing on this protocol? Have you made any adjustments? How do you administer 5mg? Hard to measure that small of an amount isn’t it?

I started with 3 mg every 4 days which was about 5 mg a week, then increased to 3 mg every 3 days for 7 mg a week, and then 4.5 mg every 3 days for 10.5 mg a week. She briefly experienced some increased sex drive when we first started but then reverted to baseline. The subsequent increases had no effect. I ran labs at each dose and her testosterone was rising proportionately as expected. The small doses were not difficult to measure with .3 ml syringes and I happened to have 150 mg/ml T cyp which made multiples of 1.5 mg easiest for me.

She's already at very supraphysiological levels at 10.5 mg weekly so I am scared to have her increase further and cause possible virilization effects. I found a study which suggests you need to inject 25 mg weekly to see significant effects on sexuality -- even 12.5 mg was insufficient:

Testosterone Dose-Response Relationships in Hysterectomized Women with and without Oophorectomy: Effects on Sexual Function, Body Composition, Muscle Performance and Physical Function in a Randomized Trial - PMC

To determine dose-dependent effects of testosterone on sexual function, body composition, muscle performance, and physical function in hysterectomized women with and without oophorectomy. 71 menopausal women who previously underwent hysterectomy ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I think we are probably going to throw in the towel and try something else.

 

[jobshopper]

I started with 3 mg every 4 days which was about 5 mg a week, then increased to 3 mg every 3 days for 7 mg a week, and then 4.5 mg every 3 days for 10.5 mg a week. She briefly experienced some increased sex drive when we first started but then reverted to baseline. The subsequent increases had no effect. I ran labs at each dose and her testosterone was rising proportionately as expected. The small doses were not difficult to measure with .3 ml syringes and I happened to have 150 mg/ml T cyp which made multiples of 1.5 mg easiest for me.

She's already at very supraphysiological levels at 10.5 mg weekly so I am scared to have her increase further and cause possible virilization effects. I found a study which suggests you need to inject 25 mg weekly to see significant effects on sexuality -- even 12.5 mg was insufficient:

Testosterone Dose-Response Relationships in Hysterectomized Women with and without Oophorectomy: Effects on Sexual Function, Body Composition, Muscle Performance and Physical Function in a Randomized Trial - PMC

To determine dose-dependent effects of testosterone on sexual function, body composition, muscle performance, and physical function in hysterectomized women with and without oophorectomy. 71 menopausal women who previously underwent hysterectomy ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I think we are probably going to throw in the towel and try something else.

The cream progesterone and cream testosterone combination that she gets from the compounding pharmacy works well for my wife. It took awhile to get the dose dialed in but after that... let the good times roll. She also takes a PDE-5 inhibitor an hour prior to sex and it works well for her.

 

[tareload]

I started with 3 mg every 4 days which was about 5 mg a week, then increased to 3 mg every 3 days for 7 mg a week, and then 4.5 mg every 3 days for 10.5 mg a week. She briefly experienced some increased sex drive when we first started but then reverted to baseline. The subsequent increases had no effect. I ran labs at each dose and her testosterone was rising proportionately as expected. The small doses were not difficult to measure with .3 ml syringes and I happened to have 150 mg/ml T cyp which made multiples of 1.5 mg easiest for me.

She's already at very supraphysiological levels at 10.5 mg weekly so I am scared to have her increase further and cause possible virilization effects. I found a study which suggests you need to inject 25 mg weekly to see significant effects on sexuality -- even 12.5 mg was insufficient:

Testosterone Dose-Response Relationships in Hysterectomized Women with and without Oophorectomy: Effects on Sexual Function, Body Composition, Muscle Performance and Physical Function in a Randomized Trial - PMC

To determine dose-dependent effects of testosterone on sexual function, body composition, muscle performance, and physical function in hysterectomized women with and without oophorectomy. 71 menopausal women who previously underwent hysterectomy ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I think we are probably going to throw in the towel and try something else.

Cream.

Pulse a couple of times a day. Let me know of you want an example.

 

[Cataceous]

Interestingly it appears that testosterone monotherapy is relatively safe with respect to endometrial thickening.

Endometrial thickness was significantly increased by treatment with estrogen alone or in combination with testosterone but was unaltered by testosterone alone. Among the women receiving estrogen alone, the proportion exhibiting histopathology indicative of proliferation increased significantly to 50% (P < 0.05), there was a nonsignificant increase to 28% with the combined treatment, whereas testosterone alone had no effect at all.​

[R]

... I found a study which suggests you need to inject 25 mg weekly to see significant effects on sexuality -- even 12.5 mg was insufficient:
...

This makes me wonder if better results are possible by also supplementing estradiol and progesterone—and keeping everything physiological.

 

[jobshopper]

Interestingly it appears that testosterone monotherapy is relatively safe with respect to endometrial thickening.

Endometrial thickness was significantly increased by treatment with estrogen alone or in combination with testosterone but was unaltered by testosterone alone. Among the women receiving estrogen alone, the proportion exhibiting histopathology indicative of proliferation increased significantly to 50% (P < 0.05), there was a nonsignificant increase to 28% with the combined treatment, whereas testosterone alone had no effect at all.​

[R]


This makes me wonder if better results are possible by also supplementing estradiol and progesterone—and keeping everything physiological.

My wife's (she is post-menopausal) labs show that some of the testosterone is aromatized into estradiol.
She is unable to use a supplementation of estrogen or estradiol because she suffers from migraine headaches and the PCP says that an estrogen/estradiol supplementation would exacerbate her headaches.

She does use progesterone along with her testosterone however.

 

[jobshopper]

I found a study which suggests you need to inject 25 mg weekly to see significant effects on sexuality -- even 12.5 mg was insufficient:

Apparently that is not the case for my wife. Just like men, all women are different. I know that when were tweaking her protocol that too much testosterone tended to make her moody. The same was also true when it wasn't enough. I think women have to be dialed in just like men.

 

[jobshopper]

My wife currently uses 5mg of testosterone cream 5 days in a row and then takes 2 days off (25mg/wk). The absorption rate of testosterone cream is about 10%. So, she is getting about 2.5mg of testosterone weekly if my math is correct.

Her last labs show that her Total T was 302 ng/dL (range 2-45 ng/dL).

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Cream.

Pulse a couple of times a day. Let me know of you want an example.

Yes, I would appreciate an example. I wouldn't be surprised if cream works better for libido.

Can anyone recommend a good telemedicine provider for her?

 

[jayt]

My wife's libido is even worse than mine. It's been like that ever since our daughter was born 4 years ago. She had a healthy libido before pregnancy and even throughout pregnancy, but giving birth was like flipping a switch that shut off the libido. She's 43 now and probably has low T, although we haven't tested yet.

How bad of an idea would it be for me to give her something like 4 mg of test cypionate twice a week as a trial to see if it does anything beneficial for her? From what I've read this should be a relatively conservative dose. I'm not opposed to getting her set up with a proper HRT clinic but I am reluctant to waste the time and money if she isn't going to respond well. Are there significant risks of virilization with a dose like this?

no no no.... there are supplements available to boost a woman's desires and available at most nutrition stores. Also there is the "pink" pill for women.... google it, I think you may need a prescription. I also know that Cialis will increase a woman's desire but would recommend talking to a doctor before exploring .... i have a female friend who takes it daily, like men do, and she is hot as hell and ready to rock and roll...

 

[tareload]

Yes, I would appreciate an example. I wouldn't be surprised if cream works better for libido.

Can anyone recommend a good telemedicine provider for her?

Justin Saya. Defy Medical. Her progesterone looked pretty good. And no I am no tout. 5 years great experience with him. Very smart dude. Lots of experience and great clinical judgement. Conservative.

2.5 mg Test in versabase cream. 1 click (0.25 g) from 10 mg T per g cream (topiclick dispenser). Apply twice daily (labia). Morning and afternoon to start. Good experience with this route. Excellent starting application method. Night and day improvement.

Remember...you never want to be smarter than your provider.

 

[Willyt]

Justin Saya. Defy Medical. Her progesterone looked pretty good. And no I am no tout. 5 years great experience with him. Very smart dude. Lots of experience and great clinical judgement. Conservative.

2.5 mg Test in versabase cream. 1 click (0.25 g) from 10 mg T per g cream (topiclick dispenser). Apply twice daily. Morning and afternoon to start. Good experience with this route. Excellent starting application method. Night and day.

Remember...you never want to be smarter than your provider.

Applied to labia? Or anywhere?

 

[tareload]

Applied to labia? Or anywhere?

Labia. See above.

Thanks for checking. I edited above post to be clear there.

Post in thread 'How bad of an idea would it be to give my wife some T-cyp?' How bad of an idea would it be to give my wife some T-cyp?

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Update: my wife started on 15 mg/ml cream at one click per day, prescribed by Defy. She tried the labial application and found it felt gross or something so she applies to inner thigh. One click per day for several weeks didn't do much of anything.

After increasing to two clicks per day, we are back in business. Sex drive is back to pre-pregnancy levels, lubrication is improved, pain during intercourse is gone. These improvements have been maintained for a couple months now.

No side effects to report. Mood and energy seem pretty good. At this point, I would highly recommend it.

As I've said elsewhere, I think ironically, TRT actually works better for women than for men because it doesn't shut them down. The libido benefits seem more sustainable and consistent in women.