Hi, new guy (40) on TRT from the Netherlands

[madman]

Thank you. To be fair though, after your message I put some pressure on getting a relevant blood test here in the netherlands to see my values, before just altering my protocol. Without data it doesn't make sense to hastily change the protocol that already seems to work wonders. I was in the wrong to start off without having that extensive data, I know that now. But after that I think I did what I could, looking at the fact that it's quite a bit harder to get guidance here in the Netherlands, I had to do everything myself.

After what time adjusting my protocol do you guys think it is relevant to retest h/h?

Snapshot at 3-4 months and >6 months in many cases to see the true impact!

Key point here!

*the lifespan of a erythrocyte is 120 days.

Management of erythrocytosis during TRT

Dear Editor, Testosterone is the primary sex hormone and anabolic steroid in men. It is a widely used drug which is used by males as an anabolic–androgenic steroid but it is also the cornerstone in treatment of both hypogonadal men and transgender people. This letter will focus on the use of...

www.excelmale.com

This needs to be stressed!

Patience is key when tweaking a protocol (decreasing/increasing T dose).


*It has to be noted that the largest increase in hematocrit levels is seen in the first year after initiation of testosterone therapy. On the other hand it is expected that a decrease can take a similar amount of time. Especially when taking into account that the lifespan of a erythrocyte is 120 days. Hence, interventions to lower hematocrit levels should be evaluated after 6 months and a decrease can be expected until 1 year after the intervention.

 

[mrblonde01]

New blood work is in, and it is...puzzling.

I've lowered my dose to 125mg, divided over 3 injections. Hcg also stays the same at 500iu, but is also divided over 3 days. My hematocrit is higher than last time, and alarmingly so. I think I was a bit dehydrated when taking the blood though, so that didn't help. But still, 64% is alarming (it was 59%, also alarming). Also, I've done a blood donation approximately 2 weeks before this.

And another strange thing is; my testosterone level is about the same as last time? Only thing that improved is my estradiol. I feel pretty good, stable, but could be better. I've been working out in the gym as well.

I guess next thing is lowering my dose even more to 100mg a week and see how that turns out, and in the mean time drink a lot more. I've also been drinking elektrolytes every morning for about a month or 2 now, which should help to keep me better hydrated. Also added ferritin in the blood work, and it seems fine, despite donating.

Anyone got ideas on why my HCT increased and my testosterone stayed the same, despite the lowered dose and increased frequency? Could it be the dehydration...? How much can it influence? I took blood at the trough (injected Friday, and then got blood work done Monday morning).

 

[Systemlord]

Anyone got ideas on why my HCT increased and my testosterone stayed the same, despite the lowered dose and increased frequency?

It takes approximately a year for your body to adapt and for the hematocrit to find a new level on TRT.

Onset of effects of testosterone treatment and time span until maximum effects are achieved

AbstractObjective. Testosterone has a spectrum of effects on the male organism. This review attempts to determine, from published studies, the time-course

academic.oup.com

Effects on erythropoiesis (red blood cells) are evident at 3 months, peaking at 9–12 months.

 

[mrblonde01]

It takes approximately a year for your body to adapt and for the hematocrit to find a new level on TRT.

Onset of effects of testosterone treatment and time span until maximum effects are achieved

AbstractObjective. Testosterone has a spectrum of effects on the male organism. This review attempts to determine, from published studies, the time-course

academic.oup.com

Thank you. Does that mean it might stabilize back down eventually?

 

[Systemlord]

Thank you. Does that mean it might stabilize back down eventually?

No, this is your new baseline on TRT. The only way to bring it down is to lower your dose and possibly increase your shot frequency.

 

[mrblonde01]

No, this is your new baseline on TRT. The only way to bring it down is to lower your dose and possibly increase your shot frequency.

Thanks. I'm just trying to figure out what is going on here; wouldn't you say it's at least atypical to see my testosterone level stay the same, and my HCT even increase on a lower dose and a higher frequency?

 

[Seagal]

Thanks. I'm just trying to figure out what is going on here; wouldn't you say it's at least atypical to see my testosterone level stay the same, and my HCT even increase on a lower dose and a higher frequency?

You changed the dosis from 175mg to 125mg and kept HCG constant? I would be surprised too if there was no change in TT and i have no explanation.
Did you switch from SC to IM, or any other changes?

 

[mrblonde01]

Thanks for taking the time to reply. It's a mystery, so I appreciate any help in thinking this through.

HCG is the same indeed, 500iu per week, only this time divided over 3.

The only thing changed that I haven't mentioned yet is my tool for injecting - I've went from a normal injection needle to a Lilly Ergo II Humapen injector, using the same size needle. This makes injecting a lot easier, however I can not imagine this has any effect on TT levels. I've always done a shallow IM injection, using a 12mm 29G needle.

The Lilly Humapen is loaded with 3 mL Insulin Cartridges (100 IU/mL), in which I put the 250mg/ml testosteron enanthate. If I'm correct, every click (unit) on the pen equals 0.01ml.

Dose per injection: 125mg / 3 ≈ 41.67mg
Volume per injection:250mg : 1ml = 41.67mg : x mlx = (41.67 * 1) / 250 ≈ 0.1667 ml

If the HumaPen injector operates with 0.01ml per click, this would equate to approximately 17 clicks (0.1667 / 0.01 ≈ 16.67, rounded to 17)

So I've given myself 3x 17 clicks using the injector per week.

 

[Seagal]

Thanks for taking the time to reply. It's a mystery, so I appreciate any help in thinking this through.

HCG is the same indeed, 500iu per week, only this time divided over 3.

The only thing changed that I haven't mentioned yet is my tool for injecting - I've went from a normal injection needle to a Lilly Ergo II Humapen injector, using the same size needle. This makes injecting a lot easier, however I can not imagine this has any effect on TT levels. I've always done a shallow IM injection, using a 12mm 29G needle.

The Lilly Humapen is loaded with 3 mL Insulin Cartridges (100 IU/mL), in which I put the 250mg/ml testosteron enanthate. If I'm correct, every click (unit) on the pen equals 0.01ml.

Dose per injection: 125mg / 3 ≈ 41.67mg
Volume per injection:250mg : 1ml = 41.67mg : x mlx = (41.67 * 1) / 250 ≈ 0.1667 ml

If the HumaPen injector operates with 0.01ml per click, this would equate to approximately 17 clicks (0.1667 / 0.01 ≈ 16.67, rounded to 17)

So I've given myself 3x 17 clicks using the injector per week.

Interesting, the use of the insulin injector.
You lost me there with your calculations.
125mg T is 0.5ml that would be 50 units(3x17)
I would try to validate that by injecting 50 units into a insulin syringe, if that's doable.

 

[Seagal]

I did read the pen manual. If it works for oil, it actually seems perfect for accurate microdosing.