HELP...TRT Results Changing Over Time - Would greatly appreciate some input

[Ardoc]

I have been on TRT for over 4 years with generally good results. It does seem that I have to keep tweaking my protocol to maintain good levels of hormones and feel good. It also seems that I feel best in the first weeks that I am adapting to a change in protocol. All the following tests were done just prior to my next injection. For reference my T3 and T4 maintain in the upper 3rd of the range and TSH maintains in the lower quarter of the range. I have not tested Reverse T3 or antibodies.

When I first started I had great results using;

Nov. 2012
120mg Test Enanthate (once per week) Deep IM into Quad
1mg Anastrozole (.5mg - E3.5D)
500iu HCG (250iu - E3.5D) SQ

TT 790 ng/dl RANGE: 242 - 829
FT 23.7 pg/ml RANGE: 7.2 - 24
E2 25.6 pg/ml RANGE: <35 (No sensitive test in Canada)
DHT >250 ng/dl RANGE: 25 - 98 (I was over the high end of the test capabilities)
SHBG 1.2 ug/dl RANGE: 1 - 3

*I was not yet aware of starting without Anastrozole and only adding if needed. This crashed my E2 over time. I now do not take any Adex.


Attempting to maintain levels of TT and FT over the next few years I bumped and split my dosage a few times. The second most recent labs were;

Aug. 2016
180mg Test Cypionate (90mg - E3.5D) Deep IM into Quad
1000iu HCG (500iu - E3.5D) SQ

TT 516 ng/dl RANGE: 242 - 829
FT 170 pg/ml RANGE: 51 - 137 (NOT SURE WHY THE FT TEST CHANGED IN CANADA??)
E2 38.5 pg/ml RANGE: <35 (No sensitive test in Canada)
DHT 94 ng/dl RANGE: 25 - 98

Due to my lack of trust in the Canadian tests I got the following done through Discounted Labs;

Mar. 2017 Shallow IM into Quad with Insulin syringe - Both combined in one syringe
154mg Test Enanthate (44mg E2D) - reduced total from previous as more frequent injs minimize troughs and increased frequency to counteract assumedly low SHBG (confirming with test in two weeks)
980iu HCG (280iu E2D)

TT 433 ng/dl RANGE: 348 - 1197
FT 16.8 pg/ml RANGE: 7.2 - 24
E2 33.3 pg/ml RANGE: 8 - 35
DHT 22 ng/dl RANGE: 30 - 85 (low)


NOTES:
I am in Canada and have converted the values to what is most familiar here.
I have a local specialist/doctor that has some experience with TRT for Men, a lot for women and who is open-minded and learns along with me. We use this forum along with Nelson's and Dr. Crisler's books to guide our efforts. She truly see's this as a team effort and I feel fortunate that she listens to my input and reads the material I provide and is willing to try most things that do not put me over-range.
Also I have switched between Cypionate and Enanthate due to availability issues but don't think that is an issue?
Could the change to shallow IM be a factor here?

I am not feeling too bad but certainly not as good as in the past. I am intending to stay at E2D injections and bump the Test a bit to see if I can get both TT and FT to good levels before moving to daily injections.

Any suggested next steps or questions?

Thank you in advance to anyone with input and to all the participants here who make this lifelong challenge easier!!!

 

[CoastWatcher]

I have been on TRT for over 4 years with generally good results. It does seem that I have to keep tweaking my protocol to maintain good levels of hormones and feel good. It also seems that I feel best in the first weeks that I am adapting to a change in protocol. All the following tests were done just prior to my next injection. For reference my T3 and T4 maintain in the upper 3rd of the range and TSH maintains in the lower quarter of the range. I have not tested Reverse T3 or antibodies.

When I first started I had great results using;

Nov. 2012
120mg Test Enanthate (once per week) Deep IM into Quad
1mg Anastrozole (.5mg - E3.5D)
500iu HCG (250iu - E3.5D) SQ

TT 790 ng/dl RANGE: 242 - 829
FT 23.7 pg/ml RANGE: 7.2 - 24
E2 25.6 pg/ml RANGE: <35 (No sensitive test in Canada)
DHT >250 ng/dl RANGE: 25 - 98 (I was over the high end of the test capabilities)
Prolactin 7 ng/ml RANGE: 2 - 18

*I was not yet aware of starting without Anastrozole and only adding if needed. This crashed my E2 over time. I now do not take any Adex.


Attempting to maintain levels of TT and FT over the next few years I bumped and split my dosage a few times. The second most recent labs were;

Aug. 2016
180mg Test Cypionate (90mg - E3.5D) Deep IM into Quad
1000iu HCG (500iu - E3.5D) SQ

TT 516 ng/dl RANGE: 242 - 829
FT 170 pg/ml RANGE: 51 - 137 (NOT SURE WHY THE FT TEST CHANGED IN CANADA??)
E2 38.5 pg/ml RANGE: <35 (No sensitive test in Canada)
DHT 94 ng/dl RANGE: 25 - 98
Prolactin 6 ng/ml RANGE: 2 - 18


Due to my lack of trust in the Canadian tests I got the following done through Discounted Labs;

Mar. 2017 Shallow IM into Quad with Insulin syringe - Both combined in one syringe
154mg Test Enanthate (44mg E2D) - reduced total from previous as more frequent injs minimize troughs
980iu HCG (280iu E2D)

TT 433 ng/dl RANGE: 348 - 1197
FT 16.8 pg/ml RANGE: 7.2 - 24
E2 33.3 pg/ml RANGE: 8 - 35
DHT 22 ng/dl RANGE: 30 - 85 (low)
Prolactin - Not tested but my previous lower values were the reason I moved to E2D injections

NOTES:
I am in Canada and have converted the values to what is most familiar here.
I have a local specialist/doctor that has some experience with TRT for Men, a lot for women and who is open-minded and learns along with me. We use this forum along with Nelson's and Dr. Crisler's books to guide our efforts. She truly see's this as a team effort and I feel fortunate that she listens to my input and reads the material I provide and is willing to try most things that do not put me over-range.
Also I have switched between Cypionate and Enanthate due to availability issues but don't think that is an issue?
Could the change to shallow IM be a factor here?

I am not feeling too bad but certainly not as good as in the past. I am intending to stay at E2D injections and bump the Test a bit to see if I can get both TT and FT to good levels before moving to daily injections.

Any suggested next steps or questions?

Thank you in advance to anyone with input and to all the participants here who make this lifelong challenge easier!!!

I, too, am Canadian and empathize with the challenges faced in obtaining quality care with regard to androgen managment. Like you, I regularly test on my frequent visits to the US...it's the cost we pay. Which leads me to a question about your tests - have you measured your SHBG, either in Canada or through Discounted Labs? And a question about something you wrote: your doctor doesn't want to put you "over-range." Canadian commercial labs have some of the lowest ranges for total testosterone in the world. Are you and your doctor relying on those ranges or the Lab Corp ranges that results from Discounted Labs report?

 

[Ardoc]

Thank you CW. It has a been a long day.... I stated my Prolactin levels instead of my SHBG results. (I had the two mixed up in the past and apparently old habits die hard) How can I edit my post?
I did test my SHBG in Nov. 2012 and it was;
11.6 nmol/L RANGE: 10 - 30 (I believe that equates to; 1.2ug/dl RANGE: 1 - 3)
I kind of assume it has gotten lower?
I will be getting redundant bloodwork in Canada in two weeks before changing my protocol so I can compare the results to the US labs and will be getting SHBG then so i will see if it has gotten lower.

 

[Ardoc]

Post edited...

 

[Gianluca Bonetti]

I have the same feeling, if I stay on same protocol, number change and when I had switched protocol or increased dosage I felt better for first week or so