DIM + Calcium D-Glucarate VS AI

[Will Brink]

My BF is around 11-12% TT 575 FT 11

Then get the sensitive test done and see what you see there. If it's still that elevated, an AI may be warranted in your situation, assuming the DIM/Cal does not help enough.

 

[Philthethrill]

Dim alone for 4 days in a row I started getting sore joints which for me when taking an AI is to much . So I stopped dim & 3 days later pain went away. Have no blood work to prove anything but I think it must lower estradiol . As far as libido increase nothing . Just bro science & 2 cents

 

[WhatSayYou89]

I've tried the DIM and C-D-G, and it caused an unreal amount of depression and anxiety for me. This was after about a week daily usage. As soon as I went off, things felt better a few days later.

I didn't have any bloodwork happening, so I can't say for sure what it was doing to me...but boy did I feel terrible.

I started dim and cdg last week and noticed my depression was bad. Do you thinks its the DIM or the CDG?

 

[HR_Watson]

I’m not sure which it was, I suspect the DIM. My experience with it was so bad, I’ve never tried either again. I’m just taking a very low dose of an AI instead, plus watching my diet and exercise.

 

[WhatSayYou89]

I’m not sure which it was, I suspect the DIM. My experience with it was so bad, I’ve never tried either again. I’m just taking a very low dose of an AI instead, plus watching my diet and exercise.

The depression I got with this was very similar to how I felt when taking an Ai.

Stopping the DIM and going to see how I feel with just CDG

 

[trt reznor]

The depression I got with this was very similar to how I felt when taking an Ai.

Stopping the DIM and going to see how I feel with just CDG

I felt awful on DIM. Something akin to depression but extremely “blah”. I have tried CDG before but before I was on TRT. I highly recommend Zinc as an AI before going the pharmaceutical route.

 

[WhatSayYou89]

I felt awful on DIM. Something akin to depression but extremely “blah”. I have tried CDG before but before I was on TRT. I highly recommend Zinc as an AI before going the pharmaceutical route.

Felt better off the DIM but still not myself, def still some mild depression. Stopped the CDG and back to normal mentally.

It sucks because I could tell a difference in my workouts and my sex drive was improving a bit. Even through the depression.

Seems like everything that helps regulate estrogen affects depression in a negative way.

After posting this I realized there are more supplements that might be able to help.

Any thoughts on the herbs and vitamins mentioned in this article?

12 Herbs to Balance Estrogen Dominance - The Chalkboard

 

[trt reznor]

Felt better off the DIM but still not myself, def still some mild depression. Stopped the CDG and back to normal mentally.

It sucks because I could tell a difference in my workouts and my sex drive was improving a bit. Even through the depression.

Seems like everything that helps regulate estrogen affects depression in a negative way.

After posting this I realized there are more supplements that might be able to help.

Any thoughts on the herbs and vitamins mentioned in this article?

12 Herbs to Balance Estrogen Dominance - The Chalkboard

Yeah try Zinc. If you take it often you may have to add in a copper supplement as well, but I never took it regularly. I can get low E symptoms (sore joints, ED) if I take it every day.

 

[WhatSayYou89]

Yeah try Zinc. If you take it often you may have to add in a copper supplement as well, but I never took it regularly. I can get low E symptoms (sore joints, ED) if I take it every day.

how much were you taking per day?

Just trying to get a baseline where to start.

Also, what does the copper do?

Disregard, found my answers to this.

 

[Gman86]

I recently lowered my testosterone dosage and stopped taking Anastrozole. I have added DIM + Calcium D Glucarate + Zinc. DIM really boosts my libido. I believe if your estradiol is just marginally elevated these supplements can really help you avoid an AI. DIM in theory can change the ratio of estrogen metabolites to more beneficial level. Calcium D Glucarate is suppose to diminish reabsorption of estradiol. And Zinc seems to act as a weak aromatase inhibitor.
Also a lot of users (including myself) had luck lowering estradiol levels by increasing injection frequency (however for me this negatively impacted my HCT levels).
So I believe that a combination of all these should be enough for most people to avoid an AI. However a lot of TRT users chase numbers and aim for high FT and TT levels which makes impossible TRT without an AI. A lot of them would be surprised how well they might feel on lower dosages.

Hey are u still using these supplements? How did u know the DIM specifically increased ur libido?

 

[HealthMan]

Hey are u still using these supplements? How did u know the DIM specifically increased ur libido?

I am no longer using these. I lowered my testosterone a bit more and added nandrolone so i no longer have any issues with estradiol. At the time when i added DIM (keeping everything else the same) i had a libido boost that slowly faded away. I have to say that my libido has always been great on TRT on multiple protocols.

 

[Gman86]

I am no longer using these. I lowered my testosterone a bit more and added nandrolone so i no longer have any issues with estradiol. At the time when i added DIM (keeping everything else the same) i had a libido boost that slowly faded away. I have to say that my libido has always been great on TRT on multiple protocols.

Nice, thanks for the reply. I’m currently taking zinc, and thinking about adding some CDG. Idk about DIM, seems hit or miss with that one. Any advice on any of these supplements, good or bad?

 

[HealthMan]

Nice, thanks for the reply. I’m currently taking zinc, and thinking about adding some CDG. Idk about DIM, seems hit or miss with that one. Any advice on any of these supplements, good or bad?

I take zinc daily for overall health. It helps specially with my iron levels. CDG and DIM are not cheap and indeed reviews are all over the place. Why are you planning to add these? Estradiol issues? Trying to avoid AI?

 

[Gman86]

I take zinc daily for overall health. It helps specially with my iron levels. CDG and DIM are not cheap and indeed reviews are all over the place. Why are you planning to add these? Estradiol issues? Trying to avoid AI?

Ya the more research I do on zinc the more I like it just for overall health. I also eat about 7oz of beef liver, and I think I may be getting too much copper compared to zinc in my diet, so it might be beneficial for me to take zinc to balance out my zinc to copper ratio

How much zinc do u take per day, and what form do u take? What time of day do u take it? Do u split up ur dose? I’ve heard u can only absorb less than 10mg at a time, and I also heard that it may be beneficial for sleep to take at least one dose before going to bed.

Ya I’m looking to try and avoid taking an ai basically. Rn I’m gonna try and keep E2 in check with zinc and injectable progesterone, but really considering CDG. I’ve heard pretty good things. Only thing that concerns me is that it supposedly flushes out all sex hormones, not just E2. Have u read or heard anything about it’s effects on other sex hormones?

 

[Gman86]

@HealthMan how does zinc help with iron levels?

 

[HealthMan]

Ya the more research I do on zinc the more I like it just for overall health. I also eat about 7oz of beef liver, and I think I may be getting too much copper compared to zinc in my diet, so it might be beneficial for me to take zinc to balance out my zinc to copper ratio

How much zinc do u take per day, and what form do u take? What time of day do u take it? Do u split up ur dose? I’ve heard u can only absorb less than 10mg at a time, and I also heard that it may be beneficial for sleep to take at least one dose before going to bed.

Ya I’m looking to try and avoid taking an ai basically. Rn I’m gonna try and keep E2 in check with zinc and injectable progesterone, but really considering CDG. I’ve heard pretty good things. Only thing that concerns me is that it supposedly flushes out all sex hormones, not just E2. Have u read or heard anything about it’s effects on other sex hormones?

I take 15mg before bed (Zinc L-Methionine Sulfate). These things probably wont have a big impact on estradiol levels if any specially when compared to an AI. They might help a little but not a lot in my experience. I end up lowering my testosterone cypionate even further from 100mg to 80mg a week but added a small dose of nandrolone that way i was able to completely drop anastrozole. My problem with estradiol is only related to gynecomastia. If it goes above low 20s i develop gyno. But didnt have any other negative side effects (although i had only experienced levels up to 35 using Labcorp Ultra-sensitive test).

 

[Gman86]

I take 15mg before bed (Zinc L-Methionine Sulfate). These things probably wont have a big impact on estradiol levels if any specially when compared to an AI. They might help a little but not a lot in my experience. I end up lowering my testosterone cypionate even further from 100mg to 80mg a week but added a small dose of nandrolone that way i was able to completely drop anastrozole. My problem with estradiol is only related to gynecomastia. If it goes above low 20s i develop gyno. But didnt have any other negative side effects (although i had only experienced levels up to 35 using Labcorp Ultra-sensitive test).

Wow, that’s crazy u start to develop gyno at such low E2 levels! What’s ur SHBG, is it really low?

I’m honestly not really scared of long term low dose ai use. Would just like to avoid it if possible. Was just doing more research and turns out DIM lowers Mtor and messes with androgen receptors, so that’s out. And CDG seems to also mess with androgen receptors, and can also decrease the efficacy of AAS that u take, like testosterone and nandrolone. Was listening to a vigorous Steve video about it, he obv explains it better. So probably gonna stay away from CDG as well. I’ll definitely stick to taking around 30mg of zinc, and dial in my injectable progesterone dose, and then see how I feel after I stabilize on those, and get labs done, and then if I need to, I have np adding in a very low dose of aromasin

 

[MarcoFL]

Wow, that’s crazy u start to develop gyno at such low E2 levels! What’s ur SHBG, is it really low?

I’m honestly not really scared of long term low dose ai use. Would just like to avoid it if possible. Was just doing more research and turns out DIM lowers Mtor and messes with androgen receptors, so that’s out. And CDG seems to also mess with androgen receptors, and can also decrease the efficacy of AAS that u take, like testosterone and nandrolone. Was listening to a vigorous Steve video about it, he obv explains it better. So probably gonna stay away from CDG as well. I’ll definitely stick to taking around 30mg of zinc, and dial in my injectable progesterone dose, and then see how I feel after I stabilize on those, and get labs done, and then if I need to, I have np adding in a very low dose of aromasin

Interesting on CDG! I have been taking 1500mg 3X per day. I am not feeling that great with it. Have been trying to get my estrogen down from around 50. I feel it hits my libido that high.

 

[Gman86]

Interesting on CDG! I have been taking 1500mg 3X per day. I am not feeling that great with it. Have been trying to get my estrogen down from around 50. I feel it hits my libido that high.

So ur taking 4,500mg/ day of CDG total? That’s definitely a huge dose. I also came across a guy that said CDG seemed to not only lower his test level, but also his IGF-1 level as well. Here it is

I Suspect that Calcium D-Glucarate lowers testosterone and IGF-1 Levels

I Suspect that Calcium D-Glucarate lowers testosterone and IGF-1 Levels

www.peaktestosterone.com

Have u tried using zinc? Seems to be the most beneficial mild natural ai that I’ve come across.

Also, have u looked into progesterone supplementation at all? Progesterone inhibits the conversion of test into E2 and DHT, which I would assume would also increase T levels a bit, which theoretically should improve one’s T:E ratio. The problem with prog is that the range is very tight. It’s basically 0.5-1.2. So finding the sweetspot might be a little tough. But it might be something to look into if u haven’t yet

 

[MarcoFL]

So ur taking 4,500mg/ day of CDG total? That’s definitely a huge dose. I also came across a guy that said CDG seemed to not only lower his test level, but also his IGF-1 level as well. Here it is

I Suspect that Calcium D-Glucarate lowers testosterone and IGF-1 Levels

I Suspect that Calcium D-Glucarate lowers testosterone and IGF-1 Levels

www.peaktestosterone.com

Have u tried using zinc? Seems to be the most beneficial mild natural ai that I’ve come across.

Also, have u looked into progesterone supplementation at all? Progesterone inhibits the conversion of test into E2 and DHT, which I would assume would also increase T levels a bit, which theoretically should improve one’s T:E ratio. The problem with prog is that the range is very tight. It’s basically 0.5-1.2. So finding the sweetspot might be a little tough. But it might be something to look into if u haven’t yet

I do take 60mg of zinc nightly and might consider small dose of 5mg of oral progesterone to see what I get for results. My current level is about .4 so bottom end.