Deca for TRT - effects on e2 and hematocrit vs Test?

[Nixter]

Next, let's work on this crude Deca D*** term. Surely we can come up with an acronym or abbreviation that accurately describes what's going on here...

For example, Nandrolone Induced Neurotransmitter Perturbation leading to Erectile Dysfunction and Mood Dysregulation.

NINPED / NINPMD

Doesn't exactly roll off the tongue lol.

I'm running 150 test, 300 deca at the moment. Erections are good but definitely experiencing delayed orgasm. I've tried a little caber here and there and I think it helps more with the erections than the anorgasmia

 

[ERO]

I am going to see if Defy will let me try Deca along with a lower dose of T-Cyp at my next consult. Testosterone and HCG have never made me feel any different from how I felt having Low-T, (My SHBG ranges from 7 - 11) so perhaps this could at least help with some joint pain and allow me to recover from exercise a bit better. No T dose of any level has helped with that. I recover like a guy with very Low T and adding any muscle at all is impossible. I know how to calculate my macros so its not that. I have given up on every having a strong libido or more energy from TRT, but less joint pain and the ability to recover from exercise a bit better would be a positive.

 

[madman]

Doesn't exactly roll off the tongue lol.

I'm running 150 test, 300 deca at the moment. Erections are good but definitely experiencing delayed orgasm. I've tried a little caber here and there and I think it helps more with the erections than the anorgasmia

This dose of ND combined with a trt protocol has absolutely nothing to do with hrt.

Your on the wrong forum!

 

[KatyTX]

my urologist in Houston Dr. Larry Lipshultz

I’m in Houston too. I’ve read about your doctor. Seems very progressive. Just curious, what does your insurance pay for? Lab tests, Deca and Test, dr visits...? Thanks.

 

[tareload]

nandrolone- atrophy in quads? Also, legalities and terminology

I’ve been on 25mg Anavar daily for 2 weeks, and it’s awesome. Strength is going up during each workout. I started BPC today for a nagging back injury. I am turned off by Deca’s reported side effects What’s the rest of ur protocol look like?

www.excelmale.com

Just wanted to link this here in case other folks have run into this. To @madman 's comment, the higher you run nandrolone the higher you may risk potential beta receptor issues with the heart. From my linked post above:

Concern I have is medium/long term use of nandrolone and its effect on beta-receptors / beta adrenoreceptor action in the heart. I can post the rodent models (easy to look up on google) but obviously no human data. I posted my experience over on another forum but I can tell you experiencing afib in the middle of the night is no fun and it came out of nowhere. Can I prove it was the ND? Nope. There may have been synergistic effect of TRT + T3 + T4 + prior ND + prior oxandrolone usage + HIIT + getting to the age where high intensity exercise may lead to afib. Just a word of caution if you work out hard, take testosterone, also use combination Thyroid therapy, and introduce ND, which is shown to upregulate beta receptor activity in the heart of mammals. Do you have pre-existing arrhythmia?

 

[Another Great Day]

I did stop for two weeks. After having a good cholesterol panel, with nandrolone. I decided to start back on nandrolone. I do enjoy using it and hopefully I’ll get good results from it. When I get Labs I will post them.

Hi, may I ask why you enjoy using nandrolone and what are the good results that you expecting from it?

 

[Vince]

Hi, may I ask why you enjoy using nandrolone and what are the good results that you expecting from it?

I started using it for tendinitis in my right shoulder. It seems for some reason it’s helping me sleep?

 

[Wilson7]

my doc has put me on a 100 test/100 deca regime instead of my usual 200mg of test, his thinking is that this will lower my e2 a little as well as possibly help my hematocrit which has been creeping up

Are there any studies or anecdotes that compare the hematocrit raising effects of nandrolone vs the same amount of test? I understand that deca can also raise RBC levels but my doc says its not as pronounced as test. He's a very smart guy but any confirmation would be appreciated

As an aside, it seems AIs also increased RBC so not taking one seems even more beneficial to me now. My plan is to drop some adipose to hopefully lower aromataze activity which should put my e2 down to ideal normal with the 50% lower dose of test

Aromatase Inhibitor-Induced Erythrocytosis in a Patient Undergoing Hormonal Treatment for Breast Cancer

Aromatase inhibitors (AIs) are most commonly used for breast cancer patients with hormone receptor positive disease. Although the side effect profile of aromatase inhibitors is well known, including common side effects like arthralgia, bone pain, arthritis, hot flashes, and more serious problems...

www.hindawi.com

Both Test and Deca were used for anemia years ago, I've always found as have others I've known that have used it (male and female) that Deca is a more potent mg/mg than T relative to erythrocytosis. Keep an eye on it and see how it works for you.

 

[Another Great Day]

I started using it for tendinitis in my right shoulder. It seems for some reason it’s helping me sleep?

Hi Vince, what dose per week please? Thanks!

 

[Vince]

Hi Vince, what dose per week please? Thanks!

I am injecting 20 MG every other day so a total of 70 MG weekly.

 

[Jason Sypolt]

I am going to see if Defy will let me try Deca along with a lower dose of T-Cyp at my next consult. Testosterone and HCG have never made me feel any different from how I felt having Low-T, (My SHBG ranges from 7 - 11) so perhaps this could at least help with some joint pain and allow me to recover from exercise a bit better. No T dose of any level has helped with that. I recover like a guy with very Low T and adding any muscle at all is impossible. I know how to calculate my macros so its not that. I have given up on every having a strong libido or more energy from TRT, but less joint pain and the ability to recover from exercise a bit better would be a positive.

Testosterone has always done very little for me relatively speaking compared to what I have seen and heard from others. Nandrolone helped with building muscle. Oxandrolone and Stanozolol have helped with losing fat and libido. Not all at the same time of course. Defy can prescribe them. It’s worth trying if other treatments aren’t doing as much for you as you had hoped. Highly recommend the Nandrolone. Just know that you will need to take it for several weeks to start to see changes.

 

[Jason Sypolt]

Nandrolone will lower your Estradiol. It will increase HCT. One of its first uses was to treat anemia.

You can however divide your ND into smaller doses and it should not affect HCT as much or possibly not at all. I have seen it in others and in myself. I divide and take it every weekday, so 5 days a week instead of the typical 2. And my HCT twice now has been lower than when I started the ND. It was suggested by one of our PA’s Mike, and it works.

 

[ERO]

Testosterone has always done very little for me relatively speaking compared to what I have seen and heard from others. Nandrolone helped with building muscle. Oxandrolone and Stanozolol have helped with losing fat and libido. Not all at the same time of course. Defy can prescribe them. It’s worth trying if other treatments aren’t doing as much for you as you had hoped. Highly recommend the Nandrolone. Just know that you will need to take it for several weeks to start to see changes.

That is good news, thank you! I will definitely ask Defy about Stanozolol and Deca ASAP. I have tried Oxandrolone from Defy and it was like taking water, in fact worse than that - all it did was lower my already way too low SHBG level down to low single digits.

 

[madman]

That is good news, thank you! I will definitely ask Defy about Stanozolol and Deca ASAP. I have tried Oxandrolone from Defy and it was like taking water, in fact worse than that - all it did was lower my already way too low SHBG level down to low single digits.

Stanozolol will do the same and even then these are compounds you do not want to use indefinitely as they are both c-17 alpha-alkylated compounds that can stress the liver and they are notorious for hammering down HDL/increasing LDL.

Mind you the dose/duration will play the biggest role on such effects and as long as you are using therapeutic doses short-term there should be no concern.

Although oxandrolone has a good safety profile with long-term use using therapeutic doses I still would not want to be taking c-17 alpha-alkylated compounds as a regular addition to your trt protocol.

 

[Spali81]

my doc has put me on a 100 test/100 deca regime instead of my usual 200mg of test, his thinking is that this will lower my e2 a little as well as possibly help my hematocrit which has been creeping up

Are there any studies or anecdotes that compare the hematocrit raising effects of nandrolone vs the same amount of test? I understand that deca can also raise RBC levels but my doc says its not as pronounced as test. He's a very smart guy but any confirmation would be appreciated

As an aside, it seems AIs also increased RBC so not taking one seems even more beneficial to me now. My plan is to drop some adipose to hopefully lower aromataze activity which should put my e2 down to ideal normal with the 50% lower dose of test

Aromatase Inhibitor-Induced Erythrocytosis in a Patient Undergoing Hormonal Treatment for Breast Cancer

Aromatase inhibitors (AIs) are most commonly used for breast cancer patients with hormone receptor positive disease. Although the side effect profile of aromatase inhibitors is well known, including common side effects like arthralgia, bone pain, arthritis, hot flashes, and more serious problems...

www.hindawi.com

When adding deca, do half of the test dosage. If test 100mg deca at 50mg weekly

 

[Vince]

When adding deca, do half of the test dosage. If test 100mg deca at 50mg weekly

Most use testosterone and deca 1to 1 or more T then dhea

So I would say yes

 

[Jason Sypolt]

Stanozolol will do the same and even then these are compounds you do not want to use indefinitely as they are both c-17 alpha-alkylated compounds that can stress the liver and they are notorious for hammering down HDL/increasing LDL.

Mind you the dose/duration will play the biggest role on such effects and as long as you are using therapeutic doses short-term there should be no concern.

Although oxandrolone has a good safety profile with long-term use using therapeutic doses I still would not want to be taking c-17 alpha-alkylated compounds as a regular addition to your trt protocol.

madman is right. The c-17’s won’t be prescribed as to be taken indefinitely. Even a very safe low dose Oxandrolone is normally prescribed for longer periods if you have wasting - recovering from surgery or illness/disease or have HIV. And with Stanozolol in particular, it drastically helps if you supplement to protect your HDL and liver. My liver has never had a problem but I still take NAC, IR Niacin, and a good Omega 3 fish oil. My HDL is in the mid-40’s and liver is fine.

I have tried both c-17’s this year and they both lower my fasting insulin and triglycerides. And I subjectively feel better. Some guys don’t like them for various reasons. But it is something to discuss with a practitioner and try, because used correctly these are powerful drugs that can lead to positive changes even in low doses.

 

[bochinit]

madman is right. The c-17’s won’t be prescribed as to be taken indefinitely. Even a very safe low dose Oxandrolone is normally prescribed for longer periods if you have wasting - recovering from surgery or illness/disease or have HIV. And with Stanozolol in particular, it drastically helps if you supplement to protect your HDL and liver. My liver has never had a problem but I still take NAC, IR Niacin, and a good Omega 3 fish oil. My HDL is in the mid-40’s and liver is fine.

I have tried both c-17’s this year and they both lower my fasting insulin and triglycerides. And I subjectively feel better. Some guys don’t like them for various reasons. But it is something to discuss with a practitioner and try, because used correctly these are powerful drugs that can lead to positive changes even in low doses.

Oxandrolone, Stanozolol and Nandrole are funcional for recovery post-surgeryes, traumas and wasting deseases, right?

 

[Sly]

Nandrolone will lower your Estradiol. It will increase HCT. One of its first uses was to treat anemia.

You can however divide your ND into smaller doses and it should not affect HCT as much or possibly not at all. I have seen it in others and in myself. I divide and take it every weekday, so 5 days a week instead of the typical 2. And my HCT twice now has been lower than when I started the ND. It was suggested by one of our PA’s Mike, and it works.

I’ve been on 60mg/wk divided into 2 -30mg doses of nandrolone since February and it has not raised my HCT one bit.

 

[Jason Sypolt]

Oxandrolone, Stanozolol and Nandrole are funcional for recovery post-surgeryes, traumas and wasting deseases, right?

That is one use, yes. Much of the data comes from use with trauma / burn victims. Oxandrolone has a well-established safety profile, even with children.