Bloods back...E2 down....but....

[madman]

How do you get your T ratio to 2-3% when your shbg is high?

Some doctors have been known to prescribe danazol or mesterolone (Proviron) and I think Dr. Rand McClain mentioned in an older thread that some patients are treated with low dose oxandrolone (Anavar) or stanozolol (Winstrol) which are both 17 alpha alkylated orals which can stress the liver but only in high doses.

 

[madman]

Danazol

 

[Nashtide]

Not really. The only thing that has improved is my mood seems more linear.

Other than that, it has made my sexual experience decline. Kinda the opposite of what is touted as one of the benefits of TRT.

Well, that’s not good. You haven’t had significant body recomposition results? More confidence? Better sleep? More energy? Clearer mind? Overall sense of well-being?

 

[fifty]

Some doctors have been known to prescribe danazol or mesterolone (Proviron) and I think Dr. Rand McClain mentioned in an older thread that some patients are treated with low dose oxandrolone (Anavar) or stanozolol (Winstrol) which are both 17 alpha alkylated orals which can stress the liver but only in high doses.

I think proviron use is restricted in the US as I don’t know any doctors that prescribe it.

It seems danazol is rarely used either. I know Crisler and Shippen used to prescribe it but seem not to anymore.

 

[Vince]

Overall did you feel better before you started trt? What was the main reason that caused you to start using testosterone. I do know men with low levels of testosterone, feel great and would not consider going on trt.

 

[madman]

I think proviron use is restricted in the US as I don’t know any doctors that prescribe it.

It seems danazol is rarely used either. I know Crisler and Shippen used to prescribe it but seem not to anymore.

It is only prescribed in Europe and regarding Danazol I think Dr. Saya has prescribed it before!

 

[Nashtide]

It is only prescribed in Europe and regarding Danazol I think Dr. Saya has prescribed it before!

I’m not following the logic of adding these ancillary substances. What is the benefit over just increasing T dose?

 

[madman]

I’m not following the logic of adding these ancillary substances. What is the benefit over just increasing T dose?

Ofcourse one can increase testosterone dose to try and overcome the SHBG but there is a point of diminishing returns as one can only increase t dose so high before negative issues may manifest themselves.

Higher doses do not always work in bringing down a mans SHBG enough if it is really high.

 

[Nashtide]

Ofcourse one can increase testosterone dose to try and overcome the SHBG but there is a point of diminishing returns as one can only increase t dose so high before negative issues may manifest themselves.

Higher doses do not always work in bringing down a mans SHBG enough if it is really high.

Okay I get that, so do these other meds actually increase free T or do they just act like T?

 

[madman]

Okay I get that, so do these other meds actually increase free T or do they just act like T?

Danazol has been show to displace T from SHBG.....hence increased FT.

Proviron (mesterolone) also has a high affinity for SHBG and will bind to SHBG resulting in more FT.

 

[madman]

Okay I get that, so do these other meds actually increase free T or do they just act like T?

Scroll to the top of page 22 than read through to the end page 24.

Free vs Bound Testosterone


Anabolics

 

[Nashtide]

Scroll to the top of page 22 than read through to the end page 24.

Free vs Bound Testosterone


Anabolics

Thanks

 

[BigBamBoo]

Well, that’s not good. You haven’t had significant body recomposition results? More confidence? Better sleep? More energy? Clearer mind? Overall sense of well-being?

No on body comp...but I workout 5 days a week and am in pretty good shape. I am 6’2” and 210 lbs.
When I was taking the HCG I gained 10+ lbs. lost that within 2 weeks of stopping the HCG.

Maybe a bit more energy, but nothing to write home about. Sleep...I have always had problems sleeping since the Army.
When I started TRT I started snoring...which seems like a common or at least a noted side effect from what I have read.
That went away after awhile, and I seemed to sleep sounder. But the last few months I am back to not sleeping well again.

Clearer mind...hmm...not sure...so probably not.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Overall did you feel better before you started trt? What was the main reason that caused you to start using testosterone. I do know men with low levels of testosterone, feel great and would not consider going on trt.

I started TRT because I was feeling blah. Just did not feel motivated much.

But....at that time my mother was failing and died. I am self employed and have lots of daily stress.

So it could be just a spot in life that a combination of issues overwhelmed me for a time.

 

[Vince]

I started TRT because I was feeling blah. Just did not feel motivated much.

But....at that time my mother was failing and died. I am self employed and have lots of daily stress.

So it could be just a spot in life that a combination of issues overwhelmed me for a time.

Yes, stress can cause a lot of issues and of course lack of sleep. Both can contribute to low testosterone. Did you post your pre labs, if you did can you show me the thread.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Yes, stress can cause a lot of issues and of course lack of sleep. Both can contribute to low testosterone. Did you post your pre labs, if you did can you show me the thread.

Here are labs just prior to starting TRT:

 

[Nashtide]

No on body comp...but I workout 5 days a week and am in pretty good shape. I am 6’2” and 210 lbs.
When I was taking the HCG I gained 10+ lbs. lost that within 2 weeks of stopping the HCG.

Maybe a bit more energy, but nothing to write home about. Sleep...I have always had problems sleeping since the Army.
When I started TRT I started snoring...which seems like a common or at least a noted side effect from what I have read.
That went away after awhile, and I seemed to sleep sounder. But the last few months I am back to not sleeping well again.

Clearer mind...hmm...not sure...so probably not.

Sounds like TRT was not good for you. I would seriously consider quitting and doing a good pct. I wish you good luck.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I agree. That will be the topic of discussion when I have my consult this week.

 

[stx359]

You got screwed. If I could run a TT of 594 on my own and didn't have any symptoms of low T I can't imagine starting TRT. Six hundred is an average TT for a guy in his 40's. I had a TT of 400 but I had multiple symptoms.

I'd start the PCT restart right away - but not with the doctor that prescribed you TRT with the levels you had. That high SHBG may present a bit of a challenge though.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Defy is who I started with and am with. Have a consult this week. Will decide what to do next.

And I am 50.