Benefits and drawbacks of daily testosterone dosing protocol, and what's your sweet spot?

[Deleted member 16042]

I wish there was a sticky!

I am trying to search on this topic and finding a few things, but no comprehensive discussion of trade offs between Daily vs less frequent dosing protocols, and some conflicting info. I am potentially interested based on my own needs.


A brief summary of the basics as I understand them. Please correct me if I am wrong on any of these counts and add pertinent info!

-Daily dosing could provide the most stable state of T blood levels

-There is potential to reduce total weekly dose since daily dosing provides a cumulatively higher steadier state and prevents low troughs. (Some anecdotes however contradict this.)

-Daily dosing is particularly useful for those with low SHBG. Refreshing or topping off the tank daily helps to keep free T levels up since low SHBG guys tend to pee out the free T rapidly

-For those with high SHBG, less frequent dosing can be useful, -it is theorized that a lower trough can be useful to keep HCT lower.

-However, longer intervals between doses can create more of a roller coaster effect for both T and E2. (Therefore, longer dosing intervals should be limited to 1 dose/week for high SHBG guys. )

-Vince believes that daily dosing has helped bring his HCT down and he no longer need phlebotomy/to donate blood. There seems to be conflicting info over this though with the theory that having lower troughs brings HCT down accordingly

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

Another benefit of daily dosing is that in my experience it makes it much easier to find your sweet spot through trial and error since if you overshoot it will clear out of your system faster, especially if you use T-prop (perhaps only if you use T-prop.)


A potential disadvantage which I am currently experimenting with is that HCG seems, based on very preliminary experience, to be more effective if it is dosed during the trough period so having a trough period may be beneficial in that regard. Without having dosed daily however, I wouldn't have as good a feel for how to dose at different intervals , so IMO it is best for many to start daily and then experiment with longer intervals.

 

[ratbag]

Dr. Crisler is now claiming that daily dosing of HCG is the best without question for everyone.

 

[Vince]

The main drawback of daily injections is the disciplined to stick to the protocol. I still wonder if the daily cause my HCT to stabilize. The last time I donated was the beginning of February 2017 and I started daily February 20th 2017. My HCT may have stabilized because of long-term TRT, I guess I never know for sure.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Edit: The question is about daily dosing of T, not HCG.

 

[FeelingLost]

I wish there was a sticky!

snip...

Not sure why there would be a sticky.
In the year I have frequented this site only 2 members have posted advantages/improvement to their other numbers switching to daily that would be worth the cost.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Not sure why there would be a sticky.
In the year I have frequented this site only 2 members have posted advantages/improvement to their other numbers switching to daily that would be worth the cost.

It is a recurrent topic that apparently has not been comprehensively covered in one place. At least I have not found such a reference.

And, it's possible we could find more by asking.

 

[ratbag]

Dr. Crisler advocates daily HCG shots for anyone using HCG... I was not referring to Testosterone shots. There are several posts of his on the various forums he visits supporting this.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Got it, thanks ratbag.

 

[FeelingLost]

It is a recurrent topic that apparently has not been comprehensively covered in one place. At least I have not found such a reference.

And, it's possible we could find more by asking.

Well yeah lots of people keep trying it because two senior members here say it works. That is why it keeps coming up.
But most post back it did not help them. So who knows.

I think you just have to try it and hope you don't send your TT thru the roof (>1500) like some have.
I don't believe there is a trough on daily, since it take 24-48 hour to adsorb T cyp, you just keep going up until you hit steady state in 40 days then TT would fluxuate based on how much your body used that day.
So there would be small fluxuations but nothing like a true trough you get from 1-2 times a week.

If I tried it to be safe I would divide my weekly dose by 7 and subtract 20% then do bloods in 40 days.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Well yeah lots of people keep trying it because two senior members here say it works. That is why it keeps coming up.
But most post back it did not help them. So who knows.

I think you just have to try it and hope you don't send your TT thru the roof (>1500) like some have.
I don't believe there is a trough on daily, since it take 24-48 hour to adsorb T cyp, you just keep going up until you hit steady state in 40 days then TT would fluxuate based on how much your body used that day.
So there would be small fluxuations but nothing like a true trough you get from 1-2 times a week.

If I tried it to be safe I would divide my weekly dose by 7 and subtract 20% then do bloods in 40 days.

Thanks for the thoughts.

My particular desire going to daily would be to potentially reduce total weekly dosage and also decrease overall stable level. I am wondering whether having TT in the 600-700 range on daily could drop HCT compared to troughs @ 900 on E3D. I've read that lower troughs can bring down HCT, but will lower totals also bring it down? And how would lower but more consistent levels affect Free T? For myself, SHBG is not low, so I wonder about lowering Free T too far with daily dosing and lower TT.

 

[FeelingLost]

Thanks for the thoughts.

My particular desire going to daily would be to potentially reduce total weekly dosage and also decrease overall stable level. I am wondering whether having TT in the 600-700 range on daily could drop HCT compared to troughs @ 900 on E3D. I've read that lower troughs can bring down HCT, but will lower totals also bring it down? And how would lower but more consistent levels affect Free T? For myself, SHBG is not low, so I wonder about lowering Free T too far with daily dosing and lower TT.

I see where you are coming from I think its a great test. One thing we have learn here is what works for one can do the opposite for another. You know what too much T feels like and you could monitor your blood pressure for out of control HCT.

You being a high SHBG guy does raise small flags. The consensus around here is those guys need large doses less frequent. But you are doing this for a different reason. I'd say start with the lowest dose you think might work and work up from there. It's only going to cost you a few extra syringes and time for the steady state thing.

 

[Vince Carter]

Tying a daily shot in to HCT and E contro, et al.., is rather disingenuous every time one of us says it. It's just not true, it's anecdotal and only in an extreme sense of the word.

There's something to be said for why guys have E problems and HCT problems from having TT >11 or even 1200, and how a lower trough could alleviate the more common sides like those two; excess T. But fact is daily shots are only appropriate for a tiny tiny number of guys whereas EOD or E3.5D would be just as effective for most.

Daily's and these goals aren't necessary or appropriate to tie together.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Well just shut me down Vince. LOL!

I remain agnostic.

 

[madman]

Thanks for the thoughts.

My particular desire going to daily would be to potentially reduce total weekly dosage and also decrease overall stable level. I am wondering whether having TT in the 600-700 range on daily could drop HCT compared to troughs @ 900 on E3D. I've read that lower troughs can bring down HCT, but will lower totals also bring it down? And how would lower but more consistent levels affect Free T? For myself, SHBG is not low, so I wonder about lowering Free T too far with daily dosing and lower TT.

Minimizing supra-physiological peaks and overall t levels is only 1 piece of the puzzle regarding effects on ones HCT as there are other factors involved.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Minimizing supra-physiological peaks and overall t levels is only 1 piece of the puzzle regarding effects on ones HCT as there are other factors involved.

I am interested in the other pieces. I'm taking note of your reply to my other thread in this regard. I have a lot of homework to do.

 

[franksepe]

I just started doing 30mg every 2 days. I rotate between IM and sub q injections. I am hoping this drops my e2 slighly so I do not need an AI. At 120mg split into 2 shots a week I need an AI.

 

[TheDude]

Tying a daily shot in to HCT and E contro, et al.., is rather disingenuous every time one of us says it. It's just not true, it's anecdotal and only in an extreme sense of the word.

There's something to be said for why guys have E problems and HCT problems from having TT >11 or even 1200, and how a lower trough could alleviate the more common sides like those two; excess T. But fact is daily shots are only appropriate for a tiny tiny number of guys whereas EOD or E3.5D would be just as effective for most.

Daily's and these goals aren't necessary or appropriate to tie together.

So in your opinion, one wouldn't really notice a big difference going from EOD to Every day injections?

 

[KSPhD]

A recent study reports that daily subq injections do not appear to result in increased Hct or Hgb... https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/c425/5344938573281d74dec4a8a0ed674ad4f0c7.pdf

 

[Deleted member 16042]

A recent study reports that daily subq injections do not appear to result in increased Hct or Hgb... https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/c425/5344938573281d74dec4a8a0ed674ad4f0c7.pdf

Wow. I'll read this tonight.

I'm on E3D and HCT is too high.