25 New TRT+Armidex+HCG questions.

[smashed25]

Skip to last paragraph if you don't want to read my story. Ever since puberty I have felt awful. I always had anti-depressants thrown at me since I was 15. After none of those worked I did my own research and had a suspicion it could be low t since symptoms all correlated with depression. I had one done at around 18 along with a thyroid test. I think the result for total t came back in the 350's If I remember right he told me that was normal I took his word for it.

5 months ago I decided to do it again. I was feeling awful it came back 320's. Doc said It was kind of low but didn't deal with hormones and referred me to endo. He said I was normal and to exercise which I had already been doing lifting 3x week on a diet and dismissed me right off the bat, without hearing me out. Same thing happened with second endo...except! this time with Vitamin D. Finally found someone who will take me seriously after months of searching and actually did a full health panel.

They did a ton of blood work and my T was 327. He said it was low normal range. He said what really concerned him was my Free T. was 6.8 Now I think range started at 15 for long end? E2 was 23 which he said was good. He lets patients do self administered if they can show the nurse they can handle it The first week I injected myself with nurses guidance in office and took the 1 mg Armidex. I'm heading into week two with self injection. Here is where my concern is 130 mg per week test Cypionate and 1 mg Armidex per week on injection day with hcg 500iu twice a week 3-4 days apart. From everything I've read online the 130 is probably too high to start off with and the 1mg armidex is odd or too high for someone with normal e2. I don't want to blow it with the only person helping me but I would love your guys opinion and am glad I found this forum. I will try and get copies of labs asap to upload.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Welcome to Excelmale. Your instincts are good. Doctors who know androgen replacement don't prescribe an AI if your current estradiol sits at a comfortable level. One hundred and thirty milligrams of testosterone a week isn't necessarily too high - administered in divided doses it's reasonable. But...let's back up a moment. Can you post up your lab results including the reference ranges? We can have a more systematic discussion if everything is laid out. Finally, there are other doctors - you have struggled to find good care, through no fault of your own. We can give you some names.

 

[johndoesmith]

Skip to last paragraph if you don't want to read my story. Ever since puberty I have felt awful. I always had anti-depressants thrown at me since I was 15. After none of those worked I did my own research and had a suspicion it could be low t since symptoms all correlated with depression. I had one done at around 18 along with a thyroid test. I think the result for total t came back in the 350's If I remember right he told me that was normal I took his word for it.

5 months ago I decided to do it again. I was feeling awful it came back 320's. Doc said It was kind of low but didn't deal with hormones and referred me to endo. He said I was normal and to exercise which I had already been doing lifting 3x week on a diet and dismissed me right off the bat, without hearing me out. Same thing happened with second endo...except! this time with Vitamin D. Finally found someone who will take me seriously after months of searching and actually did a full health panel.

They did a ton of blood work and my T was 327. He said it was low normal range. He said what really concerned him was my Free T. was 6.8 Now I think range started at 15 for long end? E2 was 23 which he said was good. He lets patients do self administered if they can show the nurse they can handle it The first week I injected myself with nurses guidance in office and took the 1 mg Armidex. I'm heading into week two with self injection. Here is where my concern is 130 mg per week test Cypionate and 1 mg Armidex per week on injection day with hcg 500iu twice a week 3-4 days apart. From everything I've read online the 130 is probably too high to start off with and the 1mg armidex is odd or too high for someone with normal e2. I don't want to blow it with the only person helping me but I would love your guys opinion and am glad I found this forum. I will try and get copies of labs asap to upload.

Welcome man, you're going to do just fine here. Plenty of intelligent and knowledgeable members here.

130mg per week is absolutely NOT a high dose, even for starting. 100mg per week is the usual internet recommendation but 130 IMO is better.

Your doc is prescribing test and hCG, I think you've gotten an okay doctor, although his AI is a bit too infrequent, too high, and probably unneeded.

99% chance he ordered the wrong E2 test.

I'd probably not take the AI if it were me. I do hope you had LH/FSH ran at minimum. SHBG is essential for a proper protocol to be chosen, but it seems like your doc gave you a cookie cutter protocol.

 

[Vince]

My starting dose was 70mg of testosterone and 500iu of HCG every 3 1/2 days, no AI. I still never used an AI.

 

[smashed25]

Welcome man, you're going to do just fine here. Plenty of intelligent and knowledgeable members here.

130mg per week is absolutely NOT a high dose, even for starting. 100mg per week is the usual internet recommendation but 130 IMO is better.

Your doc is prescribing test and hCG, I think you've gotten an okay doctor, although his AI is a bit too infrequent, too high, and probably unneeded.

99% chance he ordered the wrong E2 test.

I'd probably not take the AI if it were me. I do hope you had LH/FSH ran at minimum. SHBG is essential for a proper protocol to be chosen, but it seems like your doc gave you a cookie cutter protocol.

Hey, thanks for the response appreciate it. I'm glad to hear that about the 130 mg. I have the 1 mg Armidex pills so, if I got a pill cutter I guess I could divide it into .25. I think I remember reading it on the sheet as Estradiol and it said 23. I had no idea there was more than one test for it. Learned something already.

 

[smashed25]

Welcome to Excelmale. Your instincts are good. Doctors who know androgen replacement don't prescribe an AI if your current estradiol sits at a comfortable level. One hundred and thirty milligrams of testosterone a week isn't necessarily too high - administered in divided doses it's reasonable. But...let's back up a moment. Can you post up your lab results including the reference ranges? We can have a more systematic discussion if everything is laid out. Finally, there are other doctors - you have struggled to find good care, through no fault of your own. We can give you some names.

I'm not getting it in divided doses is that better? I've heard about the every 3.5 days thing. Would that raise my test higher than the 130 once a week, or would it be the same on the blood test since it's same total dosage? I will request a copy of the labs and upload them as soon as I can. Thank you for the post! If this doesn't work out I would gladly see someone else.

 

[smashed25]

My starting dose was 70mg of testosterone and 500iu of HCG every 3 1/2 days, no AI. I still never used an AI.

Hi, Vince. I'm starting to notice from reading online not a lot of guys on trt do take ai's. Now I have to decide if I want to I guess. I could split the dose into .25's I guess? Or stop altogether. I get more labs in 5 weeks. Thanks.

 

[Vince]

Yeah .25 sounds a lot better.

 

[smashed25]

Yeah .25 sounds a lot better.

I'm on 1 mg once a week on injection day now. If you had to guess how would you do a .25 protocol? not that I will start the .25 I might not use one at all.

 

[Vince]

Others will chime but I would use AI 24 hours after injecting T.

 

[James]

Smashed - Yes, taking 65 mg of cypionate twice a week should result in both higher TT & FT numbers when compared to 130 mg per week in a single injection. Agree with Vince the best time to take the AI would be 24 hours after injection, but for convenience, I take my .25 mg of AI with my twice weekly (Monday am & Thursday pm) injections.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Smashed - Yes, taking 65 mg of cypionate twice a week should result in both higher TT & FT numbers when compared to 130 mg per week in a single injection. Agree with Vince the best time to take the AI would be 24 hours after injection, but for convenience, I take my .25 mg of AI with my twice weekly (Monday am & Thursday pm) injections.

Excellent points made by James. Smaller,more frequent doses provide greater stability and contribute to lower estradiol levels. It will take at least four to six weeks on a new protocol before you can assess progress. Patience is the key to success with TRT.