Yes, a man in his 80s can still have good muscle mass

Yes, a man in his 80s can still have good muscle mass, and in fact, research shows that it's never too late to start building muscle:
Muscle loss is normal

• As people age, it's normal to lose muscle mass, strength, and function, a condition called sarcopenia. This process can start as early as a person's 30s.
  Strength training can help
• Strength training can help people maintain and rebuild muscle at any age, and older adults may see even greater improvements than younger adults.
  Research shows it's possible
• Clinical trials have shown that adults over 75 can significantly increase their muscle mass and strength through progressive resistance training.
  • Exercise machines can help
    Exercise machines like elliptical machines, recumbent exercise bikes, rowing machines, and lat pulldown machines can help build muscle mass.
    Tips for staying strong
  • Some tips for staying strong include moving mindfully, setting realistic goals, and making strength training part of your daily routine.
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  https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/how-can-strength-training-build-healthier-bodies-we-age

I certainly hope so. I am 65 and it is becoming more difficult to gain muscle mass. Hopefully I can keep some of it as I grow older.

At 65 and with a long term chronic condition, I can say I look 100% better than what my father did at my age.

Our generation has access to so much more!

I remember I was at my father’s house when he was in his mid-80s and he had his arm up behind his neck and I noticed his muscles were rockhard without hardly flexing, and I even made a comment to him about it and I asked him if he knew what his testosterone levels were.

That’s when he told me he tested it in his early 70s and it was quite low, but the doctor didn’t prescribe him anything because he didn’t have any symptoms. My father was an endurance runner all of his life as he was a marine. Later in life, his heart rate dropped low as a result of all those years of running.

All of that marine discipline and exercise routine, and he can’t change his diet.

My father is 90 now and is on Ozempic. I tried to tell him he doesn’t need it, what he needs is a better diet as he eats starchy foods, bread and pasta, and has type 2 diabetes like me.

Systemlord said:

I remember I was at my father’s house when he was in his mid-80s and he had his arm up behind his neck and I noticed his muscles were rockhard without hardly flexing, and I even made a comment to him about it and I asked him if he knew what his testosterone levels were.

That’s when he told me he tested it in his early 70s and it was quite low, but the doctor didn’t prescribe him anything because he didn’t have any symptoms. My father was an endurance runner all of his life as he was a marine. Later in life, his heart rate dropped low as a result of all those years of running.

All of that marine discipline and exercise routine, and he can’t change his diet.

My father is 90 now and is on Ozempic. I tried to tell him he doesn’t need it, what he needs is a better diet as he eats starchy foods, bread and pasta, and has type 2 diabetes like me.

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Damn, that’s sucks that he started that stuff. Can’t blame him. I know 3 people in my very immediate family circle that are on it. I’m sure there’s many other people I’m close with that are also on it that just haven’t shared that info with me

I think I’ve heard that ozempic can help with insulin sensitivity, but idk if that counteracts all the negatives. Apparently a lot of the weight loss from ozempic can come from muscle and bone, which is obv the last thing anyone wants, if optimal health is the goal, especially if ur as old as ur dad is. How much muscle mass a person has is a big predictor of longevity. Obv within reason. Too much of anything isn’t good. But it’s extremely important for elderly people to retain as much muscle as possible, as they continue to age. Ozempic is clearly doing the opposite of that, which obv can’t be good. Plus, muscle is one of the best reservoirs for glucose, which can help tremendously with keeping insulin and hgb A1C levels down. And then all the negatives that come from bone loss, especially if the person is older, are self explanatory. So overall, I can’t really imagine one drug, other than maybe a statin or stomach acid lowering med, that would be worse for his overall health/ longevity than something like ozempic. Sucks that he won’t listen to ur recommendations

Now that fitness and going to the gym and eating healthy are such popular things, it’s going to be really fascinating to see what elderly people start to look like, compared to previous generations, where in old movies a guy that’s 40 looks like he’s 65. People are gonna be shocked at what people in their 80’s, 90’s, and 100’s+ can look and feel like, if they’ve been on top of their health and fitness for years and years. Checkout this lady that started working out at 70. She’s currently 82

Gman86 said:

I think I’ve heard that ozempic can help with insulin sensitivity, but idk if that counteracts all the negatives.

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You know what also helps with insulin sensitivity, dietary and lifestyle changes. The moment you stop Ozempic, the diabetes make a resurgence. It's best to cure the problem, remove carbs and sugar from your diet.

Systemlord said:

It's best to cure the problem, remove carbs and sugar from your diet.

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IMHO that's more like avoiding the problem and not a cure. I get what you meant though.

Systemlord said:

You know what also helps with insulin sensitivity, dietary and lifestyle changes. The moment you stop Ozempic, the diabetes make a resurgence. It's best to cure the problem, remove carbs and sugar from your diet.

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Well obv preaching to the choir. I’m probably the biggest proponent of the importance of diet on this whole forum lol

But ya I’ve heard that u basically have to take it for life. And if u stop taking it, after losing all that muscle, ur ability to use/ dispose of glucose is going to be greatly compromised, and ur risk for being diabetic definitely goes up. And ur insulin sensitivity is going to be worse than before u starting taking it. So ya, once u stop taking it ur definitely gonna be way worse off than before u started, from my understanding. Hopefully muscle memory kicks in a bit once u discontinue it, because if not, we all know how hard it is to put on muscle tissue. Super easy to lose it, pretty difficult to put on. And hopefully bone density returns to baseline as well, once u discontinue it. If the muscle and bone doesn’t naturally come back after discontinuing, that obv adds to the list of difficulties people are gonna have once they discontinue it.

Seagal said:

IMHO that's more like avoiding the problem and not a cure. I get what you meant though.

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Jc, how is resolving the root cause of the diabetes “avoiding the problem” and not curing it? From my understanding, if u remove the foods that are causing the diabetes, and u no longer have it, that’s basically “curing it” and the opposite of avoiding the problem

Gman86 said:

Jc, how is resolving the root cause of the diabetes “avoiding the problem” and not curing it? From my understanding, if u remove the foods that are causing the diabetes, and u no longer have it, that’s basically “curing it” and the opposite of avoiding the problem

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The normal situation is that the body can deal with carbs!

My car can no longer make right turns without braking apart. I cured the problem by only making left turns.

Ok, if the car had some self-healing properties, like e.g. the gut microbiome by avoiding currently insulting foods, then I guess you 'meathead' guys are right. Maybe one can cure diabetes by only avoiding carbs... Oftentimes this goes along with reducing obesity and increasing physical activity. Chicken egg problem, genetics. I believe it's more complex than just eating carnivore.

True Type II Diabetes is more complicated than just diet. That being said, eating a low carb diet when you are prediabetic can certainly help stave it off. It can also reduce the insulin needed once you are full blown.

Seagal said:

The normal situation is that the body can deal with carbs!

My car can no longer make right turns without braking apart. I cured the problem by only making left turns.

Ok, if the car had some self-healing properties, like e.g. the gut microbiome by avoiding currently insulting foods, then I guess you 'meathead' guys are right. Maybe one can cure diabetes by only avoiding carbs... Oftentimes this goes along with reducing obesity and increasing physical activity. Chicken egg problem, genetics. I believe it's more complex than just eating carnivore.

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Oh my bad, I didn’t realize that’s what u were referring to in ur reply. I absolutely agree tho. Carbs, as a general micronutrient, are definitely not the main issue, when it comes to diabetes. That’s not even debatable, imo. There’s plenty of fruitarians out there that don’t have diabetes. And Paul Saladino went from doing strict carnivore, to now doing a carnivore base, with I think about 300-400 grams of carbs each day, coming from fruit, raw honey, and fermented raw dairy, and I’d pretty much put out every penny I have on him not ever getting diabetes in his lifetime

Diabetes stems from insulin resistance, and insulin resistance stems mainly from chronic inflammation. Being too overweight, and having too much visceral fat specifically, can also contribute to a person becoming insulin resistant. So processed seed oils, and any other crap oils, are the main contributors to the chronic inflammation that eventually leads to insulin resistance. But in general, processed foods are going to have a much greater contribution to someone ultimately becoming insulin resistant, than carbs in general will.

However, the fastest way to improve insulin sensitivity, and make a person go from being diabetic, to not having diabetes at all anymore, is to go on a diet that’s high in healthy fats and animal protein, and low in carbs. It can absolutely be done without having to go low carb tho, there’s no debate about that. Again, the most important thing is for the person to cut out processed foods, and lower their overall chronic inflammation as much as possible. Those are the two main things that will resolve a person’s diabetes, and improve their insulin sensitivity

Sorry again for misunderstanding ur point in ur reply. I get what ur saying now

Gman86 said:

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Me at 25: Oh God, my eyes! <Limp>
at 73: <woody>

Time is relative: Einstein.

DorianGray said:

Me at 25: Oh God, my eyes! <Limp>
at 73: <woody>

Time is relative: Einstein.

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Was actually just watching a comedy special where the comedian talks about this. He was basically saying how it’s wild that he’s fckn a 57 year old. Referring to his wife haha. But like u, and Einstein said, it’s all relative lol. Go to 6 mins and 30 seconds to see the part that I’m referring to

Gman86 said:

Was actually just watching a comedy special where the comedian talks about this. He was basically saying how it’s wild that he’s fckn a 57 year old. Referring to his wife haha. But like u, and Einstein said, it’s all relative lol. Go to 6 mins and 30 seconds to see the part that I’m referring to

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This is an interesting phenomenon with aging that comes as a relief to me. When I was in my 20's, I found older women (let's say 45+) gross, even if they were in relatively good shape. I wondered and worried how I was ever going to be able to remain attracted to a woman as we aged together.

It turns out that something shifts in your brain as you age, that makes women your own age appear more attractive than that same age would have been when you were young. It's like your brain discounts the signs of aging that used to be gross, and sees past them to what is still appealing about the person. It's almost a selective blindness or something.

FunkOdyssey said:

This is an interesting phenomenon with aging that comes as a relief to me. When I was in my 20's, I found older women (let's say 45+) gross, even if they were in relatively good shape. I wondered and worried how I was ever going to be able to remain attracted to a woman as we aged together.

It turns out that something shifts in your brain as you age, that makes women your own age appear more attractive than that same age would have been when you were young. It's like your brain discounts the signs of aging that used to be gross, and sees past them to what is still appealing about the person. It's almost a selective blindness or something.

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In fairly healthy countries (e.g. Italy, Spain, until recently Brazil, Argentina and others) it is common for women in their 50s and sometimes 60s to have the body of what we in the US would consider to be a super-hot 20 year old. That has probably been the case for much of human existence.

FunkOdyssey said:

This is an interesting phenomenon with aging that comes as a relief to me. When I was in my 20's, I found older women (let's say 45+) gross, even if they were in relatively good shape. I wondered and worried how I was ever going to be able to remain attracted to a woman as we aged together.

It turns out that something shifts in your brain as you age, that makes women your own age appear more attractive than that same age would have been when you were young. It's like your brain discounts the signs of aging that used to be gross, and sees past them to what is still appealing about the person. It's almost a selective blindness or something.

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It is a very interesting process, I agree. I can definitely relate. When I was younger, I don’t think I ever thought older women were unattractive, but just wasn’t my thing. But as I got a bit older, specifically around maybe 28-30, for some reason I became very attracted to older women. I just loved the maturity that came with them, and the very womanly/ curvy bodies they tended to have. Then I had an experience with a 50 year old woman, when I was 30, and it was one of the most amazing experiences of my entire life! Just the way it came about was really hot, and then she just knew things that I’ve never seen younger women know. In regards to what she liked/ needed, and in regards to what to do with the opposite sex. She rocked my world lol. And since then I’ve not been into younger women much, and very much into older women. Her being 50 was nothing to me. So after that, I always wondered how high in age I could go, and I’m pretty sure if the right opportunity ever had come about, I would have gone pretty shockingly high lol. But after that, younger women’s less womanly/ mature bodies didn’t attract me as much, and then them probably not knowing themselves as much wasn’t as attractive to me as an older women that probably knows her body better. Oh, and I’ve found that older women are able to voice what they want/ need better, which I love! And younger women seem more hesitant to do that, or maybe just don’t know their bodies as much, which isn’t as attractive/ fun, imo. Anyways, u got me going on a tangent here lol. Just for the record, I’m very happy with my wife, and she’s like 15 months younger than me.

Js that it is really interesting how ur views can change as u get older, in regards to age and the opposite sex. I’m sure it’s something similar to how as we age, most people wouldn’t ever choose to be younger, and would want to stay the age they’re at. Within reason obv. I’m sure many 100 year olds would choose to be like 50 or 60, if they could. But I know that I wouldn’t want to ever go back to being say a teenager again. I see teenagers now, and they seem awkward and uncomfortable/ nervous, and don’t have a lot of confidence, and just have no idea who they are yet, and are just doing what they think is cool, and trying to be what they think is cool. I would absolutely hate to go back to that! Lol. Would much rather be my current age. I know myself and who I am, and who I want to be way better, way more self confidence, don’t feel nervous or awkward in any situations, just understand life and myself way more, etc. Anyways, another tangent lol.

It is very interesting how the brain works tho. I assume it developed these ways of thinking due to having evolutionary benefits. I assume that as we age, we tend to be attracted to people in our own age group (obv everyone is different, and I’m sure some people prefer much younger people sexually, no matter how old they get) due to it benefiting the specifies for young people to be attracted to people their own age, and give themselves the best chance of having healthy/ viable offspring. Opposed to say older men taking the younger women from the younger men, and their older sperm/ dna that they’re contributing, possibly causing more issues with the child. Same with older women stealing the younger men. The younger man’s sperm/ dna is going to be ideal, but impregnating an older woman comes with more risks than impregnating a younger woman. Obv this is all speculation, and just me brainstorming, but it kind of makes sense lol. And evolutionarily it makes sense for our brains to enjoy the process of aging, opposed to being depressed the entire time about it lol

Guided_by_Voices said:

In fairly healthy countries (e.g. Italy, Spain, until recently Brazil, Argentina and others) it is common for women in their 50s and sometimes 60s to have the body of what we in the US would consider to be a super-hot 20 year old. That has probably been the case for much of human existence.

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It’s a very interesting phenomenon, imo, where if people see certain things become common, they think of it as “the norm”. Even if throughout our entire existence, it’s absolutely the opposite of “the norm”. So many examples I could refer to, but one that’s relevant here, is that we’re used to seeing people become frail and health compromised around around 70 years old+. And that’s being generous. Even tho the human body, on average, is meant to live close to 120 years, and be sturdy and healthy and self sufficient for the great majority of those years.

Luckily, more and more people everyday are coming to realize that a carnivore diet is about as close to an optimal diet as it gets, if health/ longevity are the goal, and more and more people everyday are getting into working out/ staying physically fit. This combo is going to result in some astonishing examples of what the human body is capable of, in the upcoming years. We’re going to see an endless amount of people physically in great shape, with zero/ minimal health issues, well into their 80’s, 90’s and even 100’s. It’s gonna be really cool and inspiring to see. Currently, a good example of what we’re going to be seeing more and more of as time goes on, is Maggie White. She’s been carnivore since around 16, and is currently around 82. She runs and works on her ranch full time, is in great shape, zero health issues, feels great, and looks damn good for 82

Nelson Vergel said:

I certainly hope so. I am 65 and it is becoming more difficult to gain muscle mass. Hopefully I can keep some of it as I grow older.

At 65 and with a long term chronic condition, I can say I look 100% better than what my father did at my age.

Our generation has access to so much more!

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So, are there any supplement's that truly help build muscle in a 69 year old male?

dmbexcel said:

So, are there any supplement's that truly help build muscle in a 69 year old male?

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One of the main substances that a carnivore diet provides is protein in a balanced, complete form. Many seniors do not get enough protein on a daily, per meal basis. I think the current thinking is that 80-90 grams per day, divided by number of meals or snacks, is necessary to provide fuel for maintaining and building muscle fitness. A hard core work out program will require an appropriate increase above that. I use a whey protein powder mixed with juice or milk on a daily basis for protein intake insurance. One scoop provides 25 grams or so of a complete balance of amino acids. They all need to be present in the right proportions to be effective. The "grams of protein" on a nutrition label in the supermarket can be misleading. Muscle growth and maintenance requires adequate high quality fuel.