Question about E2 and Testosterone Percentage in the Body

[Cataceous]

Not many on this site are taking TRT to sit at 500 ng/dL. Most are trying to get into that 1% range of 1200 ng/dL. If any % of the population is observed to possess 1200 ng/dL then pushing TT while on TRT to those levels would still be considered physiological levels.

If your overall function would be better at lower levels then maybe it's not appropriate to say that 1,200 ng/dL is physiological just because some very small segment of the population has those levels. And almost all guys who naturally have such high levels tend to have rather high SHBG, so chances are we're still talking about supraphysiological free testosterone. It's that "more is better" philosophy, which probably only works if you're limiting the criteria. That is, if you want to maximize athleticism at the expense of all else, for example.

 

[DS3]

If your overall function would be better at lower levels then maybe it's not appropriate to say that 1,200 ng/dL is physiological just because some very small segment of the population has those levels. And almost all guys who naturally have such high levels tend to have rather high SHBG, so chances are we're still talking about supraphysiological free testosterone. It's that "more is better" philosophy, which probably only works if you're limiting the criteria. That is, if you want to maximize athleticism at the expense of all else, for example.

I can agree with you on your logic. For me, I feel better regarding cognitive function, emotionally, and overall drive/energy when I stay at 1000-1200 ng/dL. When I fall back to 500-700 ng/dL (which I stayed at for 2 years, not a short time period) I do not feel nearly as well in terms of cognitive performance, emotions, and drive/energy.

So the solution can’t be that all males on TRT should sit around 500-600 ng/dL to feel their best. Nor am I suggesting that all/most all males on TRT should shoot for the top of the physiological range. Simply, I am providing some anecdotal evidence that sitting at the top of that range isn’t inherently misguided and full of side effects.

 

[bbex2014]

its based on TRT clinics observing a pattern where most men tend to feel best between 20-30. This is also the spot where the most libido is reported and general health.

And no, its not silly, and no, one should never to idiots claiming "systemic levels not mean much at all" cause he heard it on youtube, lol.

You must open your mind up my friend, you have much to learn

 

[Bryan_K77]

its based on TRT clinics observing a pattern where most men tend to feel best between 20-30. This is also the spot where the most libido is reported and general health.

And no, its not silly, and no, one should never to idiots claiming "systemic levels not mean much at all" cause he heard it on youtube, lol.

The serum levels of estradiol don’t reflect what is happening at the tissue level, hence paracrine hormone. You gotta do your research before spewing bs on here man

 

[Cataceous]

...
So the solution can’t be that all males on TRT should sit around 500-600 ng/dL to feel their best. Nor am I suggesting that all/most all males on TRT should shoot for the top of the physiological range. Simply, I am providing some anecdotal evidence that sitting at the top of that range isn’t inherently misguided and full of side effects.

I won't disagree, but I'd like to see a much greater emphasis on the low-and-slow approach to TRT. Starting out with supraphysiological dosing is a byproduct of ancient protocols where injections were every two weeks; you had to go too high to avoid going too low. In actuality, a trough serum testosterone of 500 ng/dL is very reasonable on an E3.5D protocol given that average levels on this protocol are close to typical peak levels for normal young men, and the post-injection peaks could be around 800 ng/dL, well above the average of natural peaks. I might take it a step further and convert everything to free testosterone, given that this is more directly regulated in our natural states.

 

[DS3]

I won't disagree, but I'd like to see a much greater emphasis on the low-and-slow approach to TRT. Starting out with supraphysiological dosing is a byproduct of ancient protocols where injections were every two weeks; you had to go too high to avoid going too low. In actuality, a trough serum testosterone of 500 ng/dL is very reasonable on an E3.5D protocol given that average levels on this protocol are close to typical peak levels for normal young men, and the post-injection peaks could be around 800 ng/dL, well above the average of natural peaks. I might take it a step further and convert everything to free testosterone, given that this is more directly regulated in our natural states.

I agree that starting off with high end dosing protocols such as 200 mg/week is not a good practice. As someone who’s been on TRT for 10 years and practicing EOD micro doses of Test Cyp, it’s safe to say that my steady state is ~1000 to 1200 ng/dL as my blood results 4 hours post shot (3 different assays) show ~1150 ng/dL (not considered supraphysiological). So as I tip the end of the physiological scale in steady state, I feel better than when I’ve been at lower steady states years ago. What we cling to so desperately, certainly in our thought-processes, sometimes keeps us from seeing things clearly.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

https://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2010/5/why-estrogen-balance-is-critical-to-aging-men

https://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2008/11/dangers-of-excess-estrogen-in-the-aging-male

These two articles are responsible for the misunderstanding of the importance of estradiol in men.

Please read my extensive material I have been posting for 10 years. It seems that every time I walk away from my own site for a few days due to other obligations, new people start this estradiol conversation again. PLEASE read!!

Estradiol in Men Facts versus Myths

Download my free ebook and read the section about estradiol.