Pharmacokinetics of testosterone cream applied to scrotal skin

[madman]

Conclusion

*we concluded that the scrotal administration of testosterone in a cream formulation provides high bioavailability, dose-dependant peak serum testosterone concentration, and tolerability with a much lower dose relative to the non-scrotal transdermal route

*further studies of extended duration will be required to fully evaluate the clinical application of this new scrotal testosterone formulation

 

[skycop00]

Conclusion:

- we concluded that the scrotal administration of testosterone in a cream formulation provides high bioavailability, dose-dependant peak serum testosterone concentration, and tolerability with a much lower dose relative to the non-scrotal transdermal route

- further studies of extended duration will be required to fully evaluate the clinical application of this new scrotal testosterone formulation

I use scrotal application and imo it is far superior to injections! FAR superior.

 

[MarkM]

I use scrotal application and imo it is far superior to injections! FAR superior.

My first thought would be that a scrotal cream would raise E2 with higher aromatase in the testes but I have heard the scrotal application for TRT helps keep E2 in check and hematocrit within normal ranges.

Can you share your personal experience in regard to those two items?

Thanks

 

[skycop00]

I will post my labs from last week to clarify!

 

[Vince Carter]

As I try to reflect on my E problems cream to the scrotum didn't help or hurt in that regard when it was an addition to my injections, absolutely works for DHT though. That was something that I systematically eliminated as I tried to determine what was so easily converting to E, no impact on my HCT that I can remember either but this is all just what I can recall

 

[MarkM]

Great, I appreciate that.

 

[MarkM]

As I try to reflect on my E problems cream to the scrotum didn't help or hurt in that regard when it was an addition to my injections, absolutely works for DHT though. That was something that I systematically eliminated as I tried to determine what was so easily converting to E, no impact on my HCT that I can remember either but this is all just what I can recall

So if someone already had high DHT over the top f the range it is only going to push it much higher?

 

[skycop00]

Here ya go

 

[Vince Carter]

I would assume so, yes. My DHT typically lands ~40 on a 16-79 scale. When I would apply 25mg, 2 hours later I could be at 100-110 on that scale. I return to baseline 24hrs (verified)

 

[MarkM]

I would assume so, yes. My DHT typically lands ~40 on a 16-79 scale. When I would apply 25mg, 2 hours later I could be at 100-110 on that scale. I return to baseline 24hrs (verified)

I don't believe high DHT to be a bad thing but I am already normally high and sitting at 92, just over the top of the range.

 

[MarkM]

Cannot load .docx for some reason. What formats are acceptable?

Word doc's seem to be a problem. PDF's seem to be okay.

 

[Vince Carter]

I don't believe high DHT to be a bad thing but I am already normally high and istting at 92, just over the top of the range.

Most things like MPB and/or Prostate are demonized thru DHT when they're most closely tied to genetics, or Estrogen, in men.

 

[fifty]

How is mpb related to estrogen? Low estrogen = mpb???

 

[DragonBits]

I don't believe high DHT to be a bad thing but I am already normally high and istting at 92, just over the top of the range.

There is a lot of speculation that DHT causes benign prostatic hyperplasia, growth in the prostate. I see studies both for and against this, though I don't think it's definitive. However, reducing DHT is a treatment for BHP.

Also, high levels of DHT may cause reduced bone mass in your spine.

NOTE: I don't suggest dutasteride and finasteride, they seem to cause a lot of problems, BUT they are used to reduce DHT.

So I am not sure why high DHT is a good thing, I would't go out of my way to increase it. What benefits does anyone expect from increasing DHT?

BTW, what is your PSA level? Is it higher than expected?

=================================================

5α-reductase inhibitors such as dutasteride and finasteride have been shown to modify the underlying pathology of symptomatic BPH, resulting in significant reductions in prostate volume and in the risks of AUR- and BPH-related surgery. They have also demonstrated improvements in urinary symptoms and flow.

The Clinical Benefits of Dutasteride Treatment for LUTS and BPH
============================================

Dihydrotestosterone May Not Affect Prostate Growth But May Reduce BMD

Compared with placebo, DHT reduced lumbar spine BMD (1.4%; 95% CI, 0.6% - 2.3%; P < .001) at 24 months but not hip BMD (P > .2) and increased serum aminoterminal propeptide of type I procollagen in the second year of the study. In the DHT group, levels of serum DHT and its metabolites were increased, whereas serum testosterone, estradiol, luteinizing hormone, and follicle-stimulating hormone levels were suppressed. DHT increased hemoglobin levels (7%; 95% CI, 5% - 9%), serum creatinine levels (9%; 95% CI, 5% - 11%), and lean mass (2.4%; 95% CI, 1.6% - 3.1%) but reduced fat mass (5.2%; 95% CI, 2.6% - 7.7%; P < .001 for all).

We conclude that DHT acts as a hormone in tissues without high concentrations of 5α-reductase enzymes but mainly in an autocrine–paracrine manner in tissues like the prostate, in which 5α-reductase is abundant."

===========================================
The role of dihydrotestosterone in benign prostatic hyperplasia.

The role of dihydrotestosterone in benign prostatic hyperplasia. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[MarkM]

There is a lot of speculation that DHT causes benign prostatic hyperplasia, growth in the prostate. I see studies both for and against this, though I don't think it's definitive. However, reducing DHT is a treatment for BHP.

Also, high levels of DHT may cause reduced bone mass in your spine.

NOTE: I don't suggest dutasteride and finasteride, they seem to cause a lot of problems, BUT they are used to reduce DHT.

So I am not sure why high DHT is a good thing, I would't go out of my way to increase it. What benefits does anyone expect from increasing DHT?

BTW, what is your PSA level? Is it higher than expected?

=================================================

5α-reductase inhibitors such as dutasteride and finasteride have been shown to modify the underlying pathology of symptomatic BPH, resulting in significant reductions in prostate volume and in the risks of AUR- and BPH-related surgery. They have also demonstrated improvements in urinary symptoms and flow.

The Clinical Benefits of Dutasteride Treatment for LUTS and BPH
============================================

Dihydrotestosterone May Not Affect Prostate Growth But May Reduce BMD

Compared with placebo, DHT reduced lumbar spine BMD (1.4%; 95% CI, 0.6% - 2.3%; P < .001) at 24 months but not hip BMD (P > .2) and increased serum aminoterminal propeptide of type I procollagen in the second year of the study. In the DHT group, levels of serum DHT and its metabolites were increased, whereas serum testosterone, estradiol, luteinizing hormone, and follicle-stimulating hormone levels were suppressed. DHT increased hemoglobin levels (7%; 95% CI, 5% - 9%), serum creatinine levels (9%; 95% CI, 5% - 11%), and lean mass (2.4%; 95% CI, 1.6% - 3.1%) but reduced fat mass (5.2%; 95% CI, 2.6% - 7.7%; P < .001 for all).

We conclude that DHT acts as a hormone in tissues without high concentrations of 5α-reductase enzymes but mainly in an autocrine–paracrine manner in tissues like the prostate, in which 5α-reductase is abundant."

===========================================
The role of dihydrotestosterone in benign prostatic hyperplasia.

The role of dihydrotestosterone in benign prostatic hyperplasia. - PubMed - NCBI

Well, ranges are just that, ranges. I am above the range for DHT but I also have much more body hair than the average person. I just recently had a digital exam and doc said prostate felt perfect. PSA reading came back as 1.0, which is where it has been for about 15 years.I really am not interested in lowering my DHT. It is what makes men, men.

 

[Vince]

Well, ranges are just that, ranges. I am above the range for DHT but I also have much more body hair than the average person. I just recently had a digital exam and doc said prostate felt perfect. PSA reading came back as 1.0, which is where it has been for about 15 years.I really an not interested in lowering my DHT. It is what makes men, men.

I don't think he was mentioning your level of the DHT. But it does make me wonder what level Skycop PSA is at.

 

[MarkM]

Here ya go

So your total testosterone, free testosterone, and E2 are extremely supra-physiological with mid range SHBG. Your RBC, Hemoglobin, and Hematocrit are not elevated at all and look real good. Your DHT is about 5 times the top of the range.

With DHT so high, do you experience any negative side effects; acne, aggressive behavior, thinning hair, higher blood pressure, excessive sweating, etc.....?

Have you noticed an increase in PSA at all?

Thanks for sharing your labs!

 

[skycop00]

I do not rely on PSA at all for many reasons. I have no bloat ZERO acne and just all around feel great I have done trt in one fashion or another for over 20 years and this by far is the best delivery systems. I am telling you that many here have it wrong. When I was on injections they had me chasing E2, SHBG and thyroid. Now I am not worrying about that at all. On Doctor supervised Cypionate I was as high as this 1 or 2 times in my life and NEVER felt this good because they all had me in arimidex and crap seed oils. I can show you labs over the years and you would assume I felt OPTIMIZED on those protocols but that was as far from the truth as one could get. I always had issues and never felt great! I prefer to dose to symptoms elimination. I will lower my dose and see how I feel there, but for now I feel 100%. Hope that helps.

 

[DragonBits]

Well, ranges are just that, ranges. I am above the range for DHT but I also have much more body hair than the average person. I just recently had a digital exam and doc said prostate felt perfect. PSA reading came back as 1.0, which is where it has been for about 15 years.I really am not interested in lowering my DHT. It is what makes men, men.

So does that mean you are bald? Like me.

I have a fair amount of body hair, just recently did a DHT blood test and waiting on results. From everything I have read, DHT does not affect body hair.

I didn't suggest lowering DHT, but why go to an effort to raise it? And in children DHT is what makes them men, in adults I am not sure what it does. I assume one will get a small rise in DHT from normal TRT, I wouldn't be concerned about that.

Most of the positive effects of TRT seem to be from testosterone, any studies on the positive aspects of DHT?

 

[MarkM]

So does that mean you are bald? Like me.

I have a fair amount of body hair, just recently did a DHT blood test and waiting on results. From everything I have read, DHT does not affect body hair.

I didn't suggest lowering DHT, but why go to an effort to raise it? And in children DHT is what makes them men, in adults I am not sure what it does. I assume one will get a small rise in DHT from normal TRT, I wouldn't be concerned about that.

Most of the positive effects of TRT seem to be from testosterone, any studies on the positive aspects of DHT?

Nope not bald. I am not going to any effort to increase it. I was just asking a question about scrotal cream and its effects on raising DHT. While I am okay with having somewhat high levels I am not really interested in having supra-physiological levels of DHT.