Permanent crash of estrogen?

[swolg8r]

I also have low e2 symptoms on injections. On gel i felt better but its too much of a hassle.
I alao used aromasin in the past.

Asking online.about this is a pain in the a** as no one takes one seriously , constantly asking about bloods (bloods dont mean anything about receptor site activation or tissue levels). Trying.to steer the topic away to multiple other possible causes of that symptoms

Until these people go through what we’ve experienced, there’s nothing that we can do to convince them.

 

[swolg8r]

I suffered almost 2 years from low e2 - almost undetectable.. Long story short, methandienon always helped me shortherm.
Now I was on estradiol pills for few weeks and somehow my problem is fixed. Now I can feel high e2 symptoms even on 140mg test/week. Do not wait and help your aromatase enzymes wake up with something (bigger shot of fast test, dbal, HCG, estrogen pills, ect.)

I’ve heard that the estradiol supplementation stimulates the estrogen receptor.

 

[DonaldPump2020]

I had low e2 after lgs 4033 use (it may have recovered later but i had less bad symptoms of low t years before, but it got way worse) it was <5 pg/ml e2. Doctors laughed at me for asking to get a "womans hormone" tested.

Tldr: low e2 for me causes anxiety, paranoia, obsessive/ptsd like thoughts/flashbacks, panic attacks, PSYCHOSIS, anhedonia, the wish to die every day.

Now on trt, when i try to dial it in, choosing protocols that in theory lower e2 (like more frequent injections like eod or ed) will cause the same low e2 symptoms i had pre-trt with less than 5pg e2 again. I had a kinda mild kratom withdrawal (which is a mild opioid herb) aftwr ~2 weeks of 24/7 use. It sucked but its no match to low estradiol, especially as im mentally damaged to begin with, and low e2 def is worse than any drug withdrawal i ever experienced. But well, doctors know everything better. I mean i could get a non-sens. E2 blood test (cant get sensitive) . It could show something like 50-70 pg/ml. So what. Its still low e2 as the symptoms match low e2 symptoms 1 to 1, and i experienced low e2 confirmed by bloods and it matches symptoms 1 to 1. I mad elike 50 threads in different pages but no one takes me serious and everyone trys to dind a diff explanation like well its dhea, its dht, its this and that, almost like people try to stwwr me away from the truth. With low e2 not even 2g of quetiapine (a dangerous antipsychotic overdose) or 40mg diazepam without any benzo tolerance (a BIG overdose would turn off those obsessive ptsd thoughts. ONLY t gel did, and when it did, i also had high e2 symptoms. But well "if you dont show meaningless bloods we won't believe you"


Take the example of an antipsychotic. It binds to dopamine and serotonin receptors to prevent dopamine from binding to them as high dopamine can cause psychosis.
If you blood tested for dopamine on an antipsychotic dopamine would appear normal or even a bit higher, since it cant bind to receptors and floats through the blood.

So a serum blood test of e2 doesnt mean ANYTHING.
You could have a sensitive e2 test of 60 and feel great,.maybe its dht or progesterone blocking e2 receptors.

 

[Anonymon]

I had low e2 after lgs 4033 use (it may have recovered later but i had less bad symptoms of low t years before, but it got way worse) it was <5 pg/ml e2. Doctors laughed at me for asking to get a "womans hormone" tested.

Tldr: low e2 for me causes anxiety, paranoia, obsessive/ptsd like thoughts/flashbacks, panic attacks, PSYCHOSIS, anhedonia, the wish to die every day.

Now on trt, when i try to dial it in, choosing protocols that in theory lower e2 (like more frequent injections like eod or ed) will cause the same low e2 symptoms i had pre-trt with less than 5pg e2 again. I had a kinda mild kratom withdrawal (which is a mild opioid herb) aftwr ~2 weeks of 24/7 use. It sucked but its no match to low estradiol, especially as im mentally damaged to begin with, and low e2 def is worse than any drug withdrawal i ever experienced. But well, doctors know everything better. I mean i could get a non-sens. E2 blood test (cant get sensitive) . It could show something like 50-70 pg/ml. So what. Its still low e2 as the symptoms match low e2 symptoms 1 to 1, and i experienced low e2 confirmed by bloods and it matches symptoms 1 to 1. I mad elike 50 threads in different pages but no one takes me serious and everyone trys to dind a diff explanation like well its dhea, its dht, its this and that, almost like people try to stwwr me away from the truth. With low e2 not even 2g of quetiapine (a dangerous antipsychotic overdose) or 40mg diazepam without any benzo tolerance (a BIG overdose would turn off those obsessive ptsd thoughts. ONLY t gel did, and when it did, i also had high e2 symptoms. But well "if you dont show meaningless bloods we won't believe you"


Take the example of an antipsychotic. It binds to dopamine and serotonin receptors to prevent dopamine from binding to them as high dopamine can cause psychosis.
If you blood tested for dopamine on an antipsychotic dopamine would appear normal or even a bit higher, since it cant bind to receptors and floats through the blood.

So a serum blood test of e2 doesnt mean ANYTHING.
You could have a sensitive e2 test of 60 and feel great,.maybe its dht or progesterone blocking e2 receptors.

I had similar experiences on and after finasteride. I didn’t know much about or take seriously the post finasteride stuff and figured at worst I’d just come off and be fine. I was not, then looked more into it and wish I had listened to the warnings despite knowing many guys that do just fine on it. For that reason, I’m pretty open minded about this stuff.

Although it is always possible that the issues aren’t E2 related, I agree that blood tests don’t always get you the fullest picture of things. I can break my body with a small amount of T3 and have my E2 and free T go through the roof with all the symptoms of being low in both because neither are getting into the cells. I can make it worse in a dose dependent manner too.

Blood tests are always helpful, but are most reflective of people that aren’t having issues. You need to take things in context after that the weirder your issues are, which are always harder to deal with. In all of it, you always have to be your own advocate and not give up because nobody else is there to help you the further your issues are off the beaten path.

 

[Zibernet]

My joints crack like an elderly, my muscles are flat 24/7, I don't sweat anymore, my liver hurts, I have ungodly depression every single day, the drive to do nothing, yet I have NO reason to be depressed: I have money, friends, love, family.

Perform a full blood test, the only thing that's off is a low e2 value, and yet no one will attribute those symptoms to low e2.

It's amazing that no one spreads the word that Aromasin will PERMANENTLY unable your aromatase enzymes to be normal again.

You will depend on TRT or e2 to be normal again after Aromasin. It's a poison, and people don't realise that Post Aromasin Syndrome is just as aweful as Post Finasteride Syndrome.

 

[Gman86]

My joints crack like an elderly, my muscles are flat 24/7, I don't sweat anymore, my liver hurts, I have ungodly depression every single day, the drive to do nothing, yet I have NO reason to be depressed: I have money, friends, love, family.

Perform a full blood test, the only thing that's off is a low e2 value, and yet no one will attribute those symptoms to low e2.

It's amazing that no one spreads the word that Aromasin will PERMANENTLY unable your aromatase enzymes to be normal again.

You will depend on TRT or e2 to be normal again after Aromasin. It's a poison, and people don't realise that Post Aromasin Syndrome is just as aweful as Post Finasteride Syndrome.

Is this something that only happens with aromasin, or can it happen with another ai like anastrozole, as well?

I’ve used both aromasin and anastrozole in the past quite a few times. Been off both for a while now, and E2 came back at 62.7 last time I checked it in January, which seemed pretty consistent for me considering where my testosterone levels were at on the same set of labs

 

[Anonymon]

My joints crack like an elderly, my muscles are flat 24/7, I don't sweat anymore, my liver hurts, I have ungodly depression every single day, the drive to do nothing, yet I have NO reason to be depressed: I have money, friends, love, family.

Perform a full blood test, the only thing that's off is a low e2 value, and yet no one will attribute those symptoms to low e2.

It's amazing that no one spreads the word that Aromasin will PERMANENTLY unable your aromatase enzymes to be normal again.

You will depend on TRT or e2 to be normal again after Aromasin. It's a poison, and people don't realise that Post Aromasin Syndrome is just as aweful as Post Finasteride Syndrome.

Have you had your cortisol tested before? The flat muscles and lack of sweat is something typically unique to low cortisol, which I’ve had to deal with before. It was an odd thing talking to doctors for years telling them I’d lost my ability to sweat and having them act like I was lying, even as I sat there in the hot room on a hot day not sweating as they were drenched. I could even hop in a sauna and not sweat, though I’d feel like shit. I’d have sex and there wouldn’t be a drop.

I used to hate the feeling of sweat. Now I monitor it daily as a sign of how I’m doing. I sweat this morning while running and smiled. Estrogen and cortisol interact quite a bit.

 

[Zibernet]

Is this something that only happens with aromasin, or can it happen with another ai like anastrozole, as well?

I’ve used both aromasin and anastrozole in the past quite a few times. Been off both for a while now, and E2 came back at 62.7 last time I checked it in January, which seemed pretty consistent for me considering where my testosterone levels were at on the same set of labs

I would have thought it's unique to Aromasin, being a suicidal inhibitor.

 

[Zibernet]

Have you had your cortisol tested before? The flat muscles and lack of sweat is something typically unique to low cortisol, which I’ve had to deal with before. It was an odd thing talking to doctors for years telling them I’d lost my ability to sweat and having them act like I was lying, even as I sat there in the hot room on a hot day not sweating as they were drenched. I could even hop in a sauna and not sweat, though I’d feel like shit. I’d have sex and there wouldn’t be a drop.

I used to hate the feeling of sweat. Now I monitor it daily as a sign of how I’m doing. I sweat this morning while running and smiled. Estrogen and cortisol interact quite a bit.

I haven't in a long time. Thanks for the tip.
The regular morning cortisol test while fasted ?

 

[Anonymon]

I haven't in a long time. Thanks for the tip.
The regular morning cortisol test while fasted ?

There are two tests you can try. One’s that one, and one’s the 24 hour saliva cortisol test. Although neither test are perfect, if you wanted to be comprehensive, I’d do both and see where you’re at.

 

[Systemlord]

I don't sweat anymore

When I had iron deficiency without anemia I didn't sweat while working out in 80 degree sunlight for over an hour.

 

[Gman86]

Not sweating is also a hallmark sign of iodine deficiency, just fyi

 

[Zibernet]

Not sweating is also a hallmark sign of iodine deficiency, just fyi

Thanks. I've been supplementing with high dose Lugol's iodine for 6 months now, and it really needs to be hot for me to sweat.

Unless I'm on high dose testosterone cream, which I am right now, I sweat easily.

 

[Gman86]

Thanks. I've been supplementing with high dose Lugol's iodine for 6 months now, and it really needs to be hot for me to sweat.

Unless I'm on high dose testosterone cream, which I am right now, I sweat easily.

Oh wow, so ya clearly iodine isn’t the issue. What’s ur dose? I’ve been taking 50mg/ day for a bit now

 

[JA Battle]

I haven't in a long time. Thanks for the tip.
The regular morning cortisol test while fasted ?

Also consider the 24 hour urinary. They all are flawed but I’d say 24 hour urinary is just as valuable as the saliva. Serum cortisol is mostly a waste.

 

[eli]

Same. Animal studies show that, if you deprive your estrogen long enough , you also permanently destroy your dopamine neurons. Thats very scary.

BS, I took an AI for two years destroying my E2. Now E2 is normal again, took a couple of months after coming off the AI (letrozole)

 

[Zibernet]

BS, I took an AI for two years destroying my E2. Now E2 is normal again, took a couple of months after coming off the AI (letrozole)

He didn't say your e2 wouln't bounce back up. He said you would permanently destroy dopamine neurons.
Do you have any proof it's not the case?

By the way you took a competitive AI, very different from a suicidal AI.

 

[Bmac]

Just to add,I too suffered long term issues when I played around with aromasin before I was on TRT in my early 20s. Joint pain, sexual dysfunction, feeling old, but mostly my mobility and ability to workout. I can only describe it as my muscles felt like they never had glycogen in them especially my legs. I’m reluctant to say because it’s only been about a 2 weeks but I’ve been supplementing 1 mg of estradiol valerate a day and haven’t felt this good in my roughly 5 years on trt. To add I’ve tried many protocols involving dosage adjustments( ED, EOD, hcg,) before I went with taking estradiol, which is why my trt journey has been 5 years and counting. The feeling of my muscles actually being “full” is great and I’m having great workouts again. I’ll continue this experiment with caution but I am just happy I actually am feeling physically functional on trt for once.

 

[JA Battle]

Just to add,I too suffered long term issues when I played around with aromasin before I was on TRT in my early 20s. Joint pain, sexual dysfunction, feeling old, but mostly my mobility and ability to workout. I can only describe it as my muscles felt like they never had glycogen in them especially my legs. I’m reluctant to say because it’s only been about a 2 weeks but I’ve been supplementing 1 mg of estradiol valerate a day and haven’t felt this good in my roughly 5 years on trt. To add I’ve tried many protocols involving dosage adjustments( ED, EOD, hcg,) before I went with taking estradiol, which is why my trt journey has been 5 years and counting. The feeling of my muscles actually being “full” is great and I’m having great workouts again. I’ll continue this experiment with caution but I am just happy I actually am feeling physically functional on trt for once.

Wow I tried this too. I increased my e2 number by around 20 pg/ml but felt nothing. I was using around 40mcg. This is like 1/25 of what you are taking!!! Amazing you feel well. Please get a sensitive e2 test done and share with us! How has sexual function been impacted? Was this one of the reasons you tried this?

 

[Zibernet]

Just to add,I too suffered long term issues when I played around with aromasin before I was on TRT in my early 20s. Joint pain, sexual dysfunction, feeling old, but mostly my mobility and ability to workout. I can only describe it as my muscles felt like they never had glycogen in them especially my legs. I’m reluctant to say because it’s only been about a 2 weeks but I’ve been supplementing 1 mg of estradiol valerate a day and haven’t felt this good in my roughly 5 years on trt. To add I’ve tried many protocols involving dosage adjustments( ED, EOD, hcg,) before I went with taking estradiol, which is why my trt journey has been 5 years and counting. The feeling of my muscles actually being “full” is great and I’m having great workouts again. I’ll continue this experiment with caution but I am just happy I actually am feeling physically functional on trt for once.

This is an incredibly valuable comment and experience summary.
I feel exactly like you, and the worst is that glycogen depletion in the muscle.
People with normal e2 can't understand the feeling.

I've only ever felt full again with testosterone cream and HGH, but I will definitely try the estradiol valeriate.