On a Clomid Protocol

[dikow]

I have low T. Just started Clomid. I am getting good results with only 6.25 mg twice a week. I have not done blood work yet, but am feeling much better than before. I split the original 50mg tablet in 6.25mg pieces. Its a bit tricky because the pieces get really small.

Another tricky thing is that I already had floaters before starting Clomid. So I cannot say for sure if there are "new floaters" from Clomid or if the ones I see are just the old familiar ones. What I should do in this situation? Any other symptoms to watch for?

Also, do you guys see any problems with this protocol I am doing of low dose twice a week? Can I continue long term? If so, for how long?

I have low T (total T @350 ng/dL - range 300-1200 ng/dL), so the purpose is for longevity and well-being. I was also diagnosed with sub-clinical hypothyroidism (TSH above normal range but free t4 and t3 and rT3 in normal midrange).

I tried using T4 25mcg ED but the low T symptoms persisted and my reverse T3 increased above normal range, so I cut down my T4 to 12mcg twice a week. FSH,LH, Free T, E2 all normal midrange. My Cortisol and Insulin are at the top of the normal range in the morning and I have Adrenal fatigue symptoms (fatigue in the morning and afternoon, and energy at night)

I am 25 years old...

I think I have good bodybuilding genetics besides having low T (18 inch arms - natural, never used gear or test), so I would hope this Clomid protocol would do some good to me.

My doctor prescribed Clomid 25mg ED for 30 days, but I did my own research and wanted to change to the protocol mentioned above to avoid the side-effects. I am very sensitive to medication so prefer to stay safe. My doctor never mentioned the side-effects, such as the floaters. I found out myself. I had the impression he is incompetent. The only exams he asked me to do were PSA and total T, what I think is not enough for a proper follow-up.

I am going to my second week on Clomid and am feeling better.

Thanks bros.

 

[CoastWatcher]

What can you provide in terms of lab results, pre-Clomid labs? How long have you been on this protocol? How old are you? What were your doctor's thoughts about your pre–existing floaters? In all honesty, it reads as if you've just been turned loose without proper guidance or support.

 

[dikow]

What can you provide in terms of lab results, pre-Clomid labs? How long have you been on this protocol? How old are you? What were your doctor's thoughts about your pre–existing floaters? In all honesty, it reads as if you've just been turned loose without proper guidance or support.

Thanks for the reply.


I have low T (total T @350 ng/dL - range 300-1200 ng/dL), so the purpose is for longevity and well-being. I was also diagnosed with sub-clinical hypothyroidism (TSH above normal range but free t4 and t3 and rT3 in normal midrange).

I tried using T4 25mcg ED but the low T symptoms persisted and my reverse T3 increased above normal range, so I cut down my T4 to 12mcg twice a week. FSH,LH, Free T, E2 all normal midrange. My Cortisol and Insulin are at the top of the normal range in the morning and I have Adrenal fatigue symptoms (fatigue in the morning and afternoon, and energy at night)

I am 25 years old...

I think I have good bodybuilding genetics besides having low T (18 inch arms - natural, never used gear or test), so I would hope this Clomid protocol would do some good to me.

My doctor prescribed Clomid 25mg ED for 30 days, but I did my own research and wanted to change to the protocol mentioned above to avoid the side-effects. I am very sensitive to medication so prefer to stay safe. My doctor never mentioned the side-effects, such as the floaters. I found out myself. I had the impression he is incompetent. The only exams he asked me to do were PSA and total T, what I think is not enough for a proper follow-up.

I am going to my second week on Clomid and am feeling better.

Cheers.

 

[dikow]

In all honesty, it reads as if you've just been turned loose without proper guidance or support.

Do you say this because it's a bad protocol?

 

[CoastWatcher]

Do you say this because it's a bad protocol?

It's not the best protocol, you weren't fully informed about side-effects, and your follow-up testing isn't what it should be. Eye problems in Clomid are, as you realize, serious, and you already are dealing with floaters prior to the start of treatment.

 

[dikow]

It's not the best protocol

Would you mind elaborating on what changes I should make to improve the protocol? Appreciate your help. Cheers.

 

[ZoomyR6]

Are you experiencing any sides? I was put on 25mg ED and by the second week, i had horrible insomnia, hot flashes, irritable, and zero libido and erection. Went through that for 6 weeks only to have my TT jump 59pts.
I eventually found a great doc and started on T along with hcg. Just had a semen analysis and I couldn't have asked for better results.
I hope the clomid works for you but if it doesn't, there are definitely other options where you can still preserve fertility.
I'm 31 btw. Just a ramble...

 

[dikow]

Are you experiencing any sides?

Fortunately, no sides so far. Finished my second week. The Clomid is definitely working because I am psychologically better, with no fatigue, and balls are fuller than I've ever seen lol.

The only thing I might have is a slight increase in floaters, but I cannot say for sure because I had floaters all my life.

I was put on 25mg ED and by the second week, i had horrible insomnia, hot flashes, irritable, and zero libido and erection. Went through that for 6 weeks only to have my TT jump 59pts.

25mg ED seems too high. Maybe that was the problem?

I really don't get why most doctors won't start the lowest possible dose/frequency based on the half-life, and then titrate upwards if necessary. Isn't this common sense, specially when dealing with a toxic drug like Clomid lol?

I think I will stay for the 6 weeks like you did. Will keep posting updates

 

[ZoomyR6]

Fortunately, no sides so far. Finished my second week. The Clomid is definitely working because I am psychologically better, with no fatigue, and balls are fuller than I've ever seen lol.

The only thing I might have is a slight increase in floaters, but I cannot say for sure because I had floaters all my life.
25mg is considered a low dose. Most doctors start patients off with 50mg/ed.
I felt great the first week then it was all down hill.
25mg too high? Possibly, but if it only raised my TT 59pts, going lower certainly wouldn't have helped. Unfortunately, thats all the T my boys were able to produce which would suggest primary hypo if i'm not mistaken. Only other option for me was injections.



25mg ED seems too high. Maybe that was the problem?

I really don't get why most doctors won't start the lowest possible dose/frequency based on the half-life, and then titrate upwards if necessary. Isn't this common sense, specially when dealing with a toxic drug like Clomid lol?

I think I will stay for the 6 weeks like you did. Will keep posting updates

I felt great the first week, then it was all down hill.
25mg is a low dose. A lot of doctors start people off at 50mg/ed.
25mg too high? Perhaps. However, if 25mg/ed only raised my TT 59pts, anything less certainly wouldn't have helped.
I believe this means my issue is in the testes and that's all my the T my boys were able to produce.

 

[dikow]

I felt great the first week, then it was all down hill.
25mg is a low dose. A lot of doctors start people off at 50mg/ed.
25mg too high? Perhaps. However, if 25mg/ed only raised my TT 59pts, anything less certainly wouldn't have helped.
I believe this means my issue is in the testes and that's all my the T my boys were able to produce.

In my view your testis seem fine, but you had a combination of increased aromatization + Clomid side-effects that ruined the treatment. Otherwise you would not have felt good in the first week...

Do you have any info on Clomid cycling? I am thinking of cycling Clomid instead of continuing with this drug regularly in my system.

 

[dikow]

Due to what appears a slight increase in my floaters, I did not take Clomid in the third week. Not in the mood of having sides... Unfortunately, I'm feeling the fatigue is coming back due to this.

Please can anybody enlighten me when can I restart using Clomid?

Is it safe to do something like 2 weeks on + 2 weeks off on Clomid? Any known protocols for Clomid cycling?

Appreciate any help.

 

[Forty2]

I'm surprised you're feeling those side effects on just 6.25mg eod for 2 weeks!

 

[dikow]

I'm surprised you're feeling those side effects on just 6.25mg eod for 2 weeks!

Actually it was 6.25mg twice a week, not eod. At least I felt very good during the whole 2 weeks of the experiment. Side effects were only the increase floaters and very mild. But I just am concerned of risking permanent damage.

Fatigue was better today. Hope that I am restarted for good but I don't have high hopes.

 

[dikow]

FWIW I have a buddy who has experimented with different doses of clomid for varying lengths of time. After much trial and error, he said that he feels best cycling clomid for 3 weeks at 12.5mg eod, following by taking 2 weeks off and then repeating. After the 2 week off period, his T levels are still higher than they were at baseline. I guess if he was taking enclomiphene there would be no need to cycle it.

Thanks for the tip man, will try this interval. Do you know for how long he's been doing that? Does your friend have a thread in the forum or somewhere else so I can have a look in the details of his cycling protocol? Otherwise see if he can share more details with us here! Cheers.

 

[Forty2]

No he doesn't post here, but I can tell you that's he's been doing this protocol for most of this year. As I mentioned, what he does is 3 weeks of clomid 12.5mg eod then takes 2 weeks off and repeats. He said when he takes clomid for 1 month or longer, he starts getting the emotional side effects. In a perfect world, he would be using enclomiphene and would therefore not need to take 2 weeks off.

 

[OMI100]

"I was also diagnosed with sub-clinical hypothyroidism (TSH above normal range but free t4 and t3 and rT3 in normal midrange)."
Normal range is meaningless. It is WHERE you are within the range that matters.
If you are one point above the LOW or one point under the HIGH you are WITHIN RANGE, but that is not where you want to be at.
I would recommend you go here and do some reading on thyroid ranges and correct lab panels.
This is a GREAT site and provides accurate info.
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/what-labs.html
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/optimal-labs.html

 

[dikow]

"I was also diagnosed with sub-clinical hypothyroidism (TSH above normal range but free t4 and t3 and rT3 in normal midrange)."
Normal range is meaningless. It is WHERE you are within the range that matters.
If you are one point above the LOW or one point under the HIGH you are WITHIN RANGE, but that is not where you want to be at.
I would recommend you go here and do some reading on thyroid ranges and correct lab panels.
This is a GREAT site and provides accurate info.
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/what-labs.html
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/optimal-labs.html

But I am exactly in the middle of the "normal" range for T3 and T4. Isn't that optimal?

 

[OMI100]

If you are in the middle of the RANGE you are at the low end of OPTIMAL.
Look again here:
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/optimal-labs.html
Here is a BLOG post that does a better explanation.
One more site for you to look around:
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values/