Hypopituitary, testosterone and estradiol.

[HarryCat]

See here ang here. 3.7 pmol/L = 1.007 pg/mL.

My point is that Arimidex is extremely effective at reducing estrogen levels, ecpecially if you have low BMI, see here. It is really easy to over do it and drive your estrogen levels into the mud.

In addition with a half life of 47 hours and the fact that men tend to dose every 2-3 days it would seem you can end up with some pretty big swings in estrogen.

 

[ratbag]

The trend in this thread is obvious. The lab results are all over the place and whatever assay you choose may be incorrect. So you were feeling the best ever and suddenly your sensitive assay shows you being too low... your MD adjusts dosage and you now feel like crap? This is exactly the problem all hormone lab assays face. They are not 100% reliable, as any hormone specialist will tell you. So why put such emphasis on lab assays?

Obviously how you feel has some merit. I bet if you went and had other E2 labs done you'd find one that says your in range.... and your MD would be content with that. What does this tell us? The lab assay isn't perfect medicine when it comes to hormone levels and we must also gauge how we feel. Nelson swears by the sensitive assays but my experience is same as Phils, I've seen dozens of sensitive assays that do not co-relate to how the person is feeling.

The sensitive assays have had problems since their inception. Maybe they'll get it sorted out but in the interim I wouldn't be waiting for the perfect lab result because your probably going to suffer. At this point in time I believe the regular E2 assay is your best choice. Heck run both if you can afford it. But don't depend on the sensitive assay and don't depend on the result. More importantly your MD should know this. Yet your going to suffer because he's depending upon what's printed on that paper. Peter

 

[pmgamer18]

Your right about the math 3.7 pmol/l is 1.007 pg/ml and I am sorry about the mistake after having a stroke I have days like today it's been one thing after the other.
Here is a copy of what I have been telling men for a long time about using Arimidex or Aromasin and not going to low.
========================================
How To Take Arimdex or Aromasin and not go down on your Estradiol to Low.

What I found is if you go to low taking arimidex, it's the length of time your to low, if your too low say for 8 weeks it can take your body a longer time to make more Estradiol. Bottom line is to know how not to go to low. Keep a log on your dose and how you feel men going to low can't get it up taking Viagra. I went to low when I first tried Arimidex and did not know about going to low or how one feels to low, so I was low a good 8 weeks. I did not know I was low until my next labs.

The best gage I have found to control your Estradiol levels is to gage your night time and morning wood. At good levels or what I call the sweet spot you get your night time and morning wood back so strong it will wake you up and you can hang a coat on it.

Most men do good taking .25 mgs or 1/4 of a 1mg. pill, I use a pill cutter to cut the small pill in half then I stand it on the cut end and use a single edge razor to cut this in half. A good way to take arimidex is by how high your levels are. I tested over 90 pg/ml so we tried doing .5 mgs every other day after 8 weeks my next set of labs showed it did not move below 90, test said >90. So we did .5 mgs. every day in about 2 weeks I got some strong night time and morning wood back after not having them for many yrs.

I kept doing this dose and in 8 weeks my next set of labs said <20 back in the day labs were like this they did not have to good labs we have today they could not read lower the 20. My Dr. told me this looks to low to stop taking the Arimidex. The one thing I noticed was my wood stopped and stopping the Arimidex my wood came back in about 7 weeks my next test at 8 weeks was 24 pg/ml. So we went back on the Arimidex but the Dr. told me to take .5 mgs every 3 days I was on this dose not a week and lost wood. This is when I figured out going to low you lose wood. And the longer your too low the longer it takes to get levels back up.

I stopped the arimidex right away and got my wood back in 4 days. I then after playing with the dose for a time found the best dose is .25mgs every 2 to 3 days.

So lets say your labs are less the 50 pg/ml if your take .5 mgs you can go down so dam fast your miss the sweet spot of your wood and go to low. It's best with lower levels 50 and under to do less Arimidex .25mgs every 2 days if later your lose wood when it comes back go to every 3 days.

I have found estradiol is the hardest hormone to control, it goes up or down from month to month some times I need .25mgs every 2 days other times I need .25mgs everyday most of the time I do well on every 3 days.

So between wood and labs I do great and so do most of the men I have told this to. I keep a log on how much I am taking and how I feel. Doing this and reading back in my log I was able to tell when I was going to high or to low my Dr. lets me dose my arimidex by how I feel.

See here ang here. 3.7 pmol/L = 1.007 pg/mL.

My point is that Arimidex is extremely effective at reducing estrogen levels, ecpecially if you have low BMI, see here. It is really easy to over do it and drive your estrogen levels into the mud.

In addition with a half life of 47 hours and the fact that men tend to dose every 2-3 days it would seem you can end up with some pretty big swings in estrogen.

 

[HarryCat]

@pmgamer18 I certainly like your approach to dosing for E2 symptoms, well done! Sometimes I do tend to lose sight that in the end what we are all trying to do is feel better. I think @ratbag summed it up nicely, 1. we can't always depend on the lab tests and 2. any doctor that would treat based on one lab result with no accompanying symptoms doesn't know what he is doing.
I recently had some out of range blood test results (not related to TRT) and my doctor recommended waiting 3 months and checking again. This is good advice for a lot of bloodwork.

 

[pmgamer18]

Peter,

That is what my Dr. does he runs both my health care plain covers it the sensitive test a ways shows me much lower then what the reg. test shows and I don't feel low like <3 pg/ml and its funny all most every test says <3 pg/ml when the reg. test would be between 20 to 30 higher because I don't take my E2 meds that morning.

At Dr. John's forum Quest labs had most of his men all messed up telling them they were low and when I posted about the test not being anygood I got a lot of post more or less saying I was full of it. But in time Dr. John seen this and stopped using the Sensitive test from Quest he went to Labcorp and after a short time same thing this time he had a rep. come into his office so he could show the rep. how the test was in error not every man that sees him can be the same < 3 or < 7.

The only reasion my Dr. runs E2 labs is to cover his giving me E2 loweing meds. I worked with numbers was a Quietly Control Engineer working with SPC to check parts for errors. So we tried a lot of measuring machines and there computer programs to crunch numbers most of them would not hold up with use. So from what I know about this if it's not working right by now it will never work right.

The trend in this thread is obvious. The lab results are all over the place and whatever assay you choose may be incorrect. So you were feeling the best ever and suddenly your sensitive assay shows you being too low... your MD adjusts dosage and you now feel like crap? This is exactly the problem all hormone lab assays face. They are not 100% reliable, as any hormone specialist will tell you. So why put such emphasis on lab assays?

Obviously how you feel has some merit. I bet if you went and had other E2 labs done you'd find one that says your in range.... and your MD would be content with that. What does this tell us? The lab assay isn't perfect medicine when it comes to hormone levels and we must also gauge how we feel. Nelson swears by the sensitive assays but my experience is same as Phils, I've seen dozens of sensitive assays that do not co-relate to how the person is feeling.

The sensitive assays have had problems since their inception. Maybe they'll get it sorted out but in the interim I wouldn't be waiting for the perfect lab result because your probably going to suffer. At this point in time I believe the regular E2 assay is your best choice. Heck run both if you can afford it. But don't depend on the sensitive assay and don't depend on the result. More importantly your MD should know this. Yet your going to suffer because he's depending upon what's printed on that paper. Peter