how much protein a person should take a day

[Kenny Croxdale]

Hi here I can tell you how much protein should you take in a day;

According to the researchers, if your weight is 85 kg then you can take 65 g of protein a day.

This research information is out dated.

This would fall into the minimum daily amount need to just survive.

It amount to getting paid the Minimum Wage; you are barely getting by.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

I asked my doctor about this and his reply made much more sense. He said to shoot for 1g per pound of lean muscle. That kind of makes more sense because who would expect a 500 pound fat person to eat 500g - 1000g of protein per day?

Physicians think they are experts in all areas.

Ironically, they have had approximately 6 hour of nutrition and pharmacology in college, decades ago.

Physicians specialize in diseases not nutrition, pharmacology, physical therapy, exercise physiology, etc.

They need to stay in their lane rather where they belong.

A gram per pound of lean muscle mass sound good but is hard to determine. Very few individual have any idea of what their lean muscle mass is.

Also, as previous posted, maintaining or increasing muscle mass has to do with...

1) Leucine

The amount of Leucine, which trigger anabolic muscle maintenance or growth.

2) Refractory Phase

Research show that Muscle Protein Synthesis is maximized when the right around of protein is consumed every 4 -6 hours. Not the Bodybuilding Dogma of eating every three hours.

Think of the Refractory Eating Period as a sponge. The sponge soaks up more water when it has dried out rather than being wet, loaded with water.

The same is true with Muscle Protein Synthesis. At the 4-6 hour mark, it Muscle Protein Synthesis is optimize, the muscle soak it up; which maintain or promotes growth.

That is true with medication, as well. That is one of the reason, a prescription will state something like take once every 4 hours to be effective.

This research information can be found online.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Thank you Kenny. I think 1.76 g/kg/d was recommended as the accepted RDA for strength and power athletes by Lemon et al (1992) as well as Tarnopolsky.

Lemon, P.W.R., Tarnopolsky, M.A., MacDougal, J.D., and Atkinson, S.A. (1992). Protein requirements and muscle mass/strength changes during intensive training in novice bodybuilders. J. Apply. Physiol. 73: 767.

I rather doubt there are very many novice level bodybuilders here so those interested in fitness and wellness can certainly get by with 15.g/kg. Most nutritionist will also tell you that when you are trying to cut weight additional protein is especially import to help preserve muscle as well as increase the TEF.

Love the comments about doctors who are experts in nutrition!

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

Thank you Kenny. I think 1.76 g/kg/d was recommended as the accepted RDA for strength and power athletes by Lemon et al (1992) as well as Tarnopolsky.

Lemon, P.W.R., Tarnopolsky, M.A., MacDougal, J.D., and Atkinson, S.A. (1992). Protein requirements and muscle mass/strength changes during intensive training in novice bodybuilders. J. Apply. Physiol. 73: 767.

I rather doubt there are very many novice level bodybuilders here so those interested in fitness and wellness can certainly get by with 15.g/kg. Most nutritionist will also tell you that when you are trying to cut weight additional protein is especially import to help preserve muscle as well as increase the TEF.

Love the comments about doctors who are experts in nutrition!

The RDA

1.76 g/kg/d would work. It falls within most of the reputable research.

Lemon does some good research.

Protein Timing and Dosage

What has changed is that what most important is the Protein Timing an Dosage.

Think of it this way. If you prescribed a medication dosage of let's say three 30 mg a day of something a day.

Would it matter if you took all as once or one every hour or two hours.

The same essentially applies to Protein Intake.

Research by Dr. Layne Norton, Donald Layman and Gabe Wilson clear demonstrate that, "Timing and Dosage" are everything.

Cutting Weight

Yes, when cutting weight increasing protein intake ensure more muscle mass is kept.

TEF

Yes, to some degree it will increase the thermogenic effect.

Calories In, Calories Out

However, for weight loss, calorie intake continue to be the key.

Physicians

Most are arrogant. With nutrition the majority are ignorant. It's the same with Pharmacology Medications, Physical Therapy, Exercise Physiology, etc.

They are the "Candy Men" when it come to stations. They prescribe them to individual who often don't need.

Physicians may listen to you but they Are NOT Hearing YOU.

Kenny Croxdale
Kenny Croxdale

 

[Deleted member 43589]

We basically agree on all. Here is some data on TEF

Protein has a TEF of approximately 19–23 % in both obese and lean individuals whereas carbohydrate is approximately 12–14 % [1]. In fact, a high protein meal (45 % total kcal) elicits a 30 % greater TEF than an isocaloric low protein meal (15 % total kcal) in active females [2]. It should be noted that the TEF of fat is substantially less in the obese than in lean subjects [1].

1. Swaminathan R, King RF, Holmfield J, Siwek RA, Baker M, Wales JK. Thermic effect of feeding carbohydrate, fat, protein and mixed meal in lean and obese subjects. Am J Clin Nutr. 1985;42:177–81.
2. Binns A, Gray M, Di Brezzo R. Thermic effect of food, exercise, and total energy expenditure in active females. J Sci Med Sport. 2015;18:204–8.

So some one who is lean and has more than average lean mass will get the higher end of the TEF for protein (23%). This is one of the reasons so many pro BB'ers have told me extremely high protein diets are so important to keeping the fat levels to a minimum. Like I said, the down side can be taking in too many calories especially with dietary fat. But protein supplements sure alleviate that issue and are in most occasions less expensive than meat,

Jose Antonio, Anya Ellerbroek, Tobin Silver, Steve Orris, Max Scheiner, Adriana Gonzalez and Corey A Peacock. A high protein diet (3.4 g/kg/d) combined with a heavy resistance training program improves body composition in healthy trained men and women – a follow-up investigation. Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition (2015) 12:39.

Protein for the HP group about 1.55g/lb. They concluded that consuming a high protein diet (3.4 g/kg/d) in conjunction with a heavy resistance-training program may confer benefits with regards to body composition. The study also suggested the extra protein caused possible changes in resting and sleep energy expenditure. A recent study examined 25 participants who ate approximately 40 % excess energy for 56 days from 5 %, 15 %, or 25 % protein diets. If the extra calories consumed were from protein, both sleep and resting 24-h energy expenditure increased in relation to protein intake. Very important to keeping fat levels in check.

Yes I definitely agree that calories in calories out are the key to weight loss and weight gain, however, it does appear that calories out can be affected to a degree by our macronutrient intake. The question might be, how important is this to the average Joe trying to lose weight.

Kenny, my physicians actually listen to me. They know now what a pain the tail end I will be if they don't. I will schedule an appointment and walk in with stacks of research papers. The problem is most patients don't take an active roll in their own health. The internet can be a wonderful resource.

Appreciate your discussion!

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

We basically agree on all. Here is some data on TEF

TEF

Good information on TEF. I am quite familiar with it.

it does appear that calories out can be affected to a degree by our macronutrient intake.

Yes, as I noted in my post, to some degree.

my physicians actually listen to me.

I am impressed.

I am on the Ketogenic Diet due to a Metabolic Condition; seeing a specialist.

There some research on how the Ketogenic Diet and Intermittent Fast may control my condition. However, the specialist was not willing to speak with me about it and was clueless.

He stated that diet didn't make a difference. Nice guy who know his specialty but had not clue about the research in the are of diet.

My General Practitioner Physician hammers on putting me on a statin.

I have tried to go over with him that my Blood Lipid Panel is fine based on the fact that my Remnant Cholesterol Number is in the excellent column. He wasn't familiar with what Remnant Cholesterol is or how to read it. He certainly was going to let a low life patient educate him.

I went into how my good Particle A was higher than my bad Particle B LDL; based on the Triglyceride:HDL Ratio. That didn't interest him or previous physician that I had.
That did not appear to know what I was talking about.

As per my present Physician, he state that he only look at LDL, nothing else. It not that simple.

I visited a MD for Men in Albuquerque about Testosterone Replacement. They supposedly specialized in the area.

The Physician was a clueless. He stated it wasn't his area to start off with. After listening to him ramble on, I finally was went over with him that I wanted, "Testosterone Assistance Therapy".

I wanted to take something like hCG along with a lower dosage of Testosterone. The combination would ensure that I got a boost without shutting down my natural production and that I limit my Testosterone Dosage.

The Physician replied that made sense.

Due to the time factor, he quickly under prescribe the hCG Dosage and under prescribed the Testosterone Dosage.

I tired to address that. However, he said,,,

1) It time for me to see my next patient

2) I am "The Doctor", do what I tell you.

The MD for Men In Albuquerque also stated that since he was not quite familiar with TRT, he could essentially "McGyver it". If it was working we could see the main TRT Physician.

I fired him. As to know which Physician at the clinic was the TRT Guy and requested an appointment to see him.

I went over this with the Clinic Manager. Ask to see the main TRT Guy and was told that I'd have to pay for the following appointment.

It didn't make sense.

Three Physicians, mentioned in this post, the are clueless.

My wife, a nurse, has had similar experience with other Physicians on other matters.

Finding a good Physician amount to having to "Kills a lot of frog" before you find the right one.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

Revise with typo and grammar corrections...

Good information on TEF. I am quite familiar with it.

it does appear that calories out can be affected to a degree by our macronutrient intake.

Yes, as I noted in my post, to some degree.

my physicians actually listen to me.

I am impressed.

I am on the Ketogenic Diet due to a Metabolic Condition; seeing a specialist.

There is research on how the Ketogenic Diet and Intermittent Fast may control my condition. However, the specialist was not willing to speak with me about it and was clueless.

He stated that diet didn't make a difference. If that were true, I go back to having Reese's Peanut Butter Cups and having sugar Dr Pepper for dinner; one of the best ways of getting high, sugar and some caffeine.

The specialist is a nice guy who know his specialty but had not clue about the research in the are of diet. Once he crosses into an area he know nothing about, I shut him down.

My General Practitioner Physician hammers on putting me on a statin due to my LDL Number.

I tried to go over with him that my Blood Lipid Panel is fine based on the fact that my Remnant Cholesterol Number is in the excellent column. He wasn't familiar with what Remnant Cholesterol is or how to read it. He certainly was not going to let a low life patient educate him. Good for him!

I went into how my good Particle A was higher than my bad Particle B LDL; based on the Triglyceride:HDL Ratio. That didn't interest him or a previous physician that I had.
They did not appear to know what I was talking about.

As per my present Physician, he state that he only look at LDL, nothing else. It not that simple.

I visited a MD for Men in Albuquerque about Testosterone Replacement. They supposedly specialized in the area.

The Physician was clueless. He stated it wasn't his area to start off with. After listening to him ramble on, I finally was went over with him that I wanted, "Testosterone Assistance Therapy".

I wanted to take hCG along with a lower dosage of Testosterone. The combination would ensure that I got a boost without shutting down my natural production and that I limit my Testosterone Dosage.

The Physician replied that made sense.

Due to the time factor, he quickly over prescribe the hCG Dosage and under prescribed the Testosterone Dosage.

I tired to address that. However, he said,,,

1) It time for him to see my next patient

2) I am "The Doctor", do what I tell you.

The MD for Men In Albuquerque also stated that since he was not quite familiar with TRT, he could essentially "McGyver it". If it was not working we could see the main TRT Physician.

I fired him.

I went over this with the Clinic Manager. Ask to see the main TRT Guy and was told that I'd have to pay for the following appointment.

It didn't make sense.

Three Physicians, mentioned in this post, that are clueless.

My wife, a nurse, has had similar experience with other Physicians on other matters.

Finding a good Physician amount to having to "Kills a lot of frog" before you find the right one.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Revise with typo and grammar corrections...

Good information on TEF. I am quite familiar with it.


Yes, as I noted in my post, to some degree.



I am impressed.

I am on the Ketogenic Diet due to a Metabolic Condition; seeing a specialist.

There is research on how the Ketogenic Diet and Intermittent Fast may control my condition. However, the specialist was not willing to speak with me about it and was clueless.

He stated that diet didn't make a difference. If that were true, I go back to having Reese's Peanut Butter Cups and having sugar Dr Pepper for dinner; one of the best ways of getting high, sugar and some caffeine.

The specialist is a nice guy who know his specialty but had not clue about the research in the are of diet. Once he crosses into an area he know nothing about, I shut him down.

My General Practitioner Physician hammers on putting me on a statin due to my LDL Number.

I tried to go over with him that my Blood Lipid Panel is fine based on the fact that my Remnant Cholesterol Number is in the excellent column. He wasn't familiar with what Remnant Cholesterol is or how to read it. He certainly was not going to let a low life patient educate him. Good for him!

I went into how my good Particle A was higher than my bad Particle B LDL; based on the Triglyceride:HDL Ratio. That didn't interest him or a previous physician that I had.
They did not appear to know what I was talking about.

As per my present Physician, he state that he only look at LDL, nothing else. It not that simple.

I visited a MD for Men in Albuquerque about Testosterone Replacement. They supposedly specialized in the area.

The Physician was clueless. He stated it wasn't his area to start off with. After listening to him ramble on, I finally was went over with him that I wanted, "Testosterone Assistance Therapy".

I wanted to take hCG along with a lower dosage of Testosterone. The combination would ensure that I got a boost without shutting down my natural production and that I limit my Testosterone Dosage.

The Physician replied that made sense.

Due to the time factor, he quickly over prescribe the hCG Dosage and under prescribed the Testosterone Dosage.

I tired to address that. However, he said,,,

1) It time for him to see my next patient

2) I am "The Doctor", do what I tell you.

The MD for Men In Albuquerque also stated that since he was not quite familiar with TRT, he could essentially "McGyver it". If it was not working we could see the main TRT Physician.

I fired him.

I went over this with the Clinic Manager. Ask to see the main TRT Guy and was told that I'd have to pay for the following appointment.

It didn't make sense.

Three Physicians, mentioned in this post, that are clueless.

My wife, a nurse, has had similar experience with other Physicians on other matters.

Finding a good Physician amount to having to "Kills a lot of frog" before you find the right one.

Kenny Croxdale

AMEN bro! Kenny, honestly that is when I would have walked out and gotten a new doctor. In Houston, they are a dime a dozen. I was going to have knee surgery once and my ortho pissed me off not listening. I walked out, cancelled surgery and got a better one that did listen in a few days.

Hey, my wife discovered something with fasting. By using that diet she was about to stop covid 19 long haulers that she had. Her case was so bad she had to see a cardiologist for tachycardia. Apparently the fasting creates autophagy and cleanses the body of the protein spikes. So there are lots of things most doctors don't know and we find our more and more all the time. Those that don't keep and open mind and always further their knowledge get left behind.

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

I was going to have knee surgery once and my ortho pissed me off not listening. I walked out, cancelled surgery and got a better one that did listen in a few days.

Good for you. This most likely occurs a lot.

Gaining 10 lbs Is Normal As Per The Doctor

My wife had her thyroid removed. She is now on thyroid medication.

She watches everything she eats. She had a weight issue over ten years ago, losing 120 lbs.

She goes to visit her sister for a two week. Maintains her diet she gains 10 lbs.

It's a no brainer. I tell her that her thyroid medication need to be adjusted.

The doctor look at her thyroid reading and tell her it is normal. No medication needed.

My reply, "So, the doctor essentially is telling you that gaining 10 lbs in a week is normal?!

She goes back to see him. He then get off his ass. Look at her previous thyroid reading and notes on her previous visit she was at the top of the normal zone, hers is now at the bottom of normal.

That equates to having a low IQ that is one point above being above Moron rather that an IQ that is one point below above normal. Which would you rather have? Duh!

He readjusted her thyroid medication. She then dropped 7 lbs in 10 days, while maintaining the same diet she end up gaining 10 lbs on.

Intermittent Fasting and Covid

I wasn't aware the Intermitting Fasting could help with Covid.

There is some information on how the Ketogenic Diet fight off the Flu. It is believe that the Ketogenic Diet may also do the same with Covid.

Can Keto Help Fight The Flu
https://www.medicaleconomics.com/view/can-keto-diet-help-fight-flu

The ketogenic diet has gained popularity for its weight loss results, and new research indicates that it may also be helpful in fighting the flu.

In a study published in Science Immunology, researchers at Yale University found that specific diet changes may be effective in helping to fight influenza A infections.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Kenny, neither one of your links seemed to work.

Here are some interesting reads on fasting and covid 19. Interestingly enough after my wife does a long fast she goes on a ketogenic diet. Her mother is also going through the same thing in Argentina from covid 19. My wife seem to have eliminated the protein spikes over time.

Long Covid - Could fasting hold a key to preventing and treating PSCS

The Buchinger Wilhelmi fasting clinics launched programmes with a focus on treating Long Covid PSCS - Learn more!

www.buchinger-wilhelmi.com

Fasting beneficial in time of COVID-19: expert

Strong immune system most important protective measure against coronavirus - Anadolu Ajansı

www.aa.com.tr

Study

Intermittent fasting, a possible priming tool for host defense against SARS-CoV-2 infection: Crosstalk among calorie restriction, autophagy and immune response - PMC

Keywords: SARS-COV-2, Calorie restriction, Autophagy, Cytokine storm, Immune responses, COVID-19

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Metformin

Fasting beneficial in time of COVID-19: expert

Strong immune system most important protective measure against coronavirus - Anadolu Ajansı

www.aa.com.tr

Very interesting stuff but I had to use Duckduckgo to find it. Seems Google and Bing both have this information hiding somewhere.