HCG effect on thyroid and DHEA levels

[HealthMan]

Just would like to share my experience with HCG increasing T3, T4 and DHEA levels. I have read that HCG structure is similar to TSH hence it can stimulate the thyroid gland to produce hormones. Also that HCG can have an effect on DHEA and pregnenolone. From my experience this is true. Numbers below:

No HCG
Free T4 - 1.24(0.8-1.73)
Free T3 - 3.3(2-4.7)

400IU HCG E3.5D
DHEA-S - 484.6 (138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

500IU HCG 3x week
Free T4 - 1.54(0.82-1.77)
Free T3 - 4.1(2-4.4)
DHEA-S - 699.7(138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

Now I have reduced HCG to 500IU E3.5D and i will probably adjust DHEA/Pregnenolone lower.
At somepoint I was using both armour thyroid and HCG and i had symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I dropped the thyroid meds and all went back to normal.

 

[Vince]

I haven't noticed that with me. I inject 500iu of HCG twice weekly and find no effect on my thyroid or DHEA levels. I do take thyroid meds and supplement with DHEA.

 

[ratbag]

Dr. Saya wrote:
A less known fact about testosterone is that it can lower TBG (thyroid binding globulin), thus impacting free T3/free T4 levels. As with SHBG and sex hormones, the consequences of this TBG lowering are NOT always universal or straightforward. For instance, many folks can experience and INCREASE in FT3/FT4, as somewhat expected, with the decrease in TBG. However, some folks can experience (over time) a DECREASE in FT3/FT4 concurrent with the decrease in TBG, presumably from more rapid excretion of the thyroid hormones with lower TBG (analogous to more rapid excretion of testosterone with lower SHBG).

Read more in post 16 here

 

[Dr Justin Saya MD]

Thanks for linking that ratbag (I feel like I'm insulting someone just by writing that screename lol).

There is truth that TSH and HCG are similar in structure (they share the same alpha subunit), in fact we were just having this same discussion on PeakT. There also is data of VERY HIGH HCG levels during pregnancy impacting thyroid function for precisely this reason. However, the levels of HCG in pregnancy quite literally dwarf the levels we are dealing with for TRT-related HCG dosing. Although there are always exceptions, the potential cross-reactivity of HCG/TSH is mostly a moot point at our typical dosage range.

 

[HealthMan]

Thanks for all the comments all very helpful! It seems like i am an exception to the rule but indeed HCG most definitely has an impact on my thyroid. But is the increase in pregnenolone/DHEA via activation of p450 SCC enzyme by HCG true?

 

[Gene Devine]

Yes, it is true HealthMan.

Here's another fact about HCG as an LH analog; it is principally responsible for activating the P450 side chain cleavage enzyme which synthesizes Cholesterol into Pregnenolone which in turn supports all three metabolic pathways.

This is just one more very important reason my men on TRT need HCG beyond keeping their testes alive; without it all three pathways can/may be compromised...not good nor healthy!

 

[HealthMan]

Yes, it is true HealthMan.


Here's another fact about HCG as an LH analog; it is principally responsible for activating the P450 side chain cleavage enzyme which synthesizes Cholesterol into Pregnenolone which in turn supports all three metabolic pathways.

This is just one more very important reason my men on TRT need HCG beyond keeping their testes alive; without it all three pathways can/may be compromised...not good nor healthy!

Thank you Gene!

 

[ratbag]

No worries Dr. Saya it's just a nic name..

Interestingly I was on Test-Cyp only when I learned my FT4 had dropped substantially below range. Before Test-Cyp my FT4 was always mid range.

 

[Dr Justin Saya MD]

No worries Dr. Saya it's just a nic name..

Interestingly I was on Test-Cyp only when I learned my FT4 had dropped substantially below range. Before Test-Cyp my FT4 was always mid range.

I've seen just about everything with N=1!

 

[BillyJ03z]

Just would like to share my experience with HCG increasing T3, T4 and DHEA levels. I have read that HCG structure is similar to TSH hence it can stimulate the thyroid gland to produce hormones. Also that HCG can have an effect on DHEA and pregnenolone. From my experience this is true. Numbers below:

No HCG
Free T4 - 1.24(0.8-1.73)
Free T3 - 3.3(2-4.7)

400IU HCG E3.5D
DHEA-S - 484.6 (138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

500IU HCG 3x week
Free T4 - 1.54(0.82-1.77)
Free T3 - 4.1(2-4.4)
DHEA-S - 699.7(138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

Now I have reduced HCG to 500IU E3.5D and i will probably adjust DHEA/Pregnenolone lower.
At somepoint I was using both armour thyroid and HCG and i had symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I dropped the thyroid meds and all went back to normal.

How long were you on TRT without HCG and did you experience Hypo symptoms during this time?
and what were your Thyroid panel numbers prior to TRT?

do you feel good mood, libido, energy wise now with the numbers as they are?

I am seriously considering adding HCG because since I started TRT my T4/FT4 have dropped from mid-range to very bottom of range, my DHEA has dropped from top range to below range and I have hypo symptoms that are increasingly getting worse....

I want to present your info to my Doc.

 

[Omi7276]

Just would like to share my experience with HCG increasing T3, T4 and DHEA levels. I have read that HCG structure is similar to TSH hence it can stimulate the thyroid gland to produce hormones. Also that HCG can have an effect on DHEA and pregnenolone. From my experience this is true. Numbers below:

No HCG
Free T4 - 1.24(0.8-1.73)
Free T3 - 3.3(2-4.7)

400IU HCG E3.5D
DHEA-S - 484.6 (138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

500IU HCG 3x week
Free T4 - 1.54(0.82-1.77)
Free T3 - 4.1(2-4.4)
DHEA-S - 699.7(138.5-475.2)
Taking 25mg DHEA and 25mg Pregnenolone

Now I have reduced HCG to 500IU E3.5D and i will probably adjust DHEA/Pregnenolone lower.
At somepoint I was using both armour thyroid and HCG and i had symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I dropped the thyroid meds and all went back to normal.

How much time after starting HCG did you go for lab testing your thyroid and dhea levels ?

 

[Shawn]

I'm glad to hear HCG increased DHEA. However, you had 484. Why you were taking DHEA to begin with. What was your DHEA level before the 484? Did the HCG or DHEA come first? Were you on the same dose of HCG for a while before that?

I believe that it does increase DHEA for some people. I did a blood test while I was on HRT 6 years ago using HCG as well and my DHEA came back in the mid-range and off everything now, it is rock bottom.