Greetings, hoping to learn more and gain some benefits on my TRT.

[elroy]

Greetings to everyone on the boards. I've read many posts here sporadically over the last few years but decided to hop on and hopefully get some guidance on my TRT journey. I've been on TRT for 10+ years and have never really gotten the benefits I expected. I originally tested sub 300 T, low libido and ED even though I am in good health and not overweight, currently 66 years old. My only vice is I am a HEAVY coffee drinker.
I tried T cream, T cypionate from 75mg weekly to 200mg weekly and everything in between, ED, EOD, E3D, once a week, arimidex etc. no difference. I've had a ton of blood tests over the years and never really found an issue.
Trying something new now. Just started T propionate, 40mg EOD. Took 2nd shot today. So far I am noticing some difference but obviously it is to early to say anything definitive. Latest blood work from Quest: Total T 1338, Free T 419, E2 29, SHBG 31, Hematocrit 51. This was while taking 200mg T cyp a week, injected ED and 1mg arimidex. No longer taking the AI as I believe it dropped my E2 to low.

I guess my first question is what do the gurus here think about achieving a steady level with 20mg propionate ED versus more fluctuation with 40mg EOD? According to steroidplotter.com the ED protocol would peak at about 1100 and trough at 1000. While the EOD would peak at nearly 1400 and trough at 775 about every 24 hours. In terms of libido and erections which is likely to provide the best outcome? Or is this just another trial and error crapshoot? Thanks in advance to anyone who can help.

 

[Systemlord]

I've been on TRT for 10+ years and have never really gotten the benefits I expected. I originally tested sub 300 T, low libido and ED even though I am in good health and not overweight, currently 66 years old. My only vice is I am a HEAVY coffee drinker.

In my experienced when you use TRT to treat something else which is causing the lowered testosterone, you're not attacking the problem head-on, you're going around something and it doesn't always work.

I was on TRT for 7 years and never felt quite right, always had issues which I've now identified. I came off TRT recently and feel ten times better because I'm addressing the main cause of all my issues -> type 2 diabetes, which lowers testosterone.

So I came off and based on my Total T at 3:25 pm, should have tested in the early morning hours 8-10 am as testosterone declines throughout the day, I'm at the same level late in the day that be at in the morning hours several years ago.

Low-T is a symptom, no a causal factor in your health decline.

Please describe your lifestyle/diet/workout routine. Sedentary lifestyles lower testosterone, so if your testosterone is low because you don't excersise, I'm afraid TRT can't replace good old excersise.

TRT works for you better when you put in the work, eat healthy and excersise.

Sleep affects testosterone more than anything, quality of sleep is a huge factor in testosterone production.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I guess my first question is what do the gurus here think about achieving a steady level with 20mg propionate ED versus more fluctuation with 40mg EOD? According to steroidplotter.com the ED protocol would peak at about 1100 and trough at 1000.

Steroid plotter is extremely wrong in its depiction of propionate levels. Your trough on ED prop should be slightly less than half your peak. Your trough on EOD would be something like 20% of your peak. In order to tolerate EOD prop injections, many guys would need higher doses than 40 mg, or else they would feel hypogonadal during parts of the second day.

If it works for you though, it works, so don't let me talk you out of it. I personally do 25 mg ED. 20 mg ED was also very good in many respects, and much better than any previous experience with enanthate or cypionate. It really does feel like a different drug.

 

[elroy]

In my experienced when you use TRT to treat something else which is causing the lowered testosterone, you're not attacking the problem head-on, you're going around something and it doesn't always work.

I was on TRT for 7 years and never felt quite right, always had issues which I've now identified. I came off TRT recently and feel ten times better because I'm addressing the main cause of all my issues -> type 2 diabetes, which lowers testosterone.

So I came off and based on my Total T at 3:25 pm, should have tested in the early morning hours 8-10 am as testosterone declines throughout the day, I'm at the same level late in the day that be at in the morning hours several years ago.

Low-T is a symptom, no a causal factor in your health decline.

Please describe your lifestyle/diet/workout routine. Sedentary lifestyles lower testosterone, so if your testosterone is low because you don't excersise, I'm afraid TRT can't replace good old excersise.

TRT works for you better when you put in the work, eat healthy and excersise.

Sleep affects testosterone more than anything, quality of sleep is a huge factor in testosterone production.

Thanks for your input. I retired 4 years ago. Life long truck driver, last 13 years driving a car transport. Loading and unloading cars all day long, lots of walking, climbing up and down on the truck. Since I've been retired I work around the house, cutting trees, working on the cars etc. Last summer I dug up the entire foundation of the house by hand so I could tuckpoint the block and seal it. I try to keep busy but I have no exercise routine.
My blood sugar is normal, I check it regularly. As for eating, my wife cooks every day, (GREAT cook)we eat out maybe once every week or so. Very little soda, almost no alcohol. I'm in bed 7-8 hours a night but I don't sleep like when I was younger.
I am 5'11" and maybe 180 lbs, put on a little since retiring. As I think I said above I've had these issues since my early 50's.
While my sleep routine is ok now since retiring, for nearly all of my adult life it was horrific. Working 15 hours on little or even no sleep, going to work at all times of the day or night etc.

 

[elroy]

Steroid plotter is extremely wrong in its depiction of propionate levels. Your trough on ED prop should be slightly less than half your peak. Your trough on EOD would be something like 20% of your peak. In order to tolerate EOD prop injections, many guys would need higher doses than 40 mg, or else they would feel hypogonadal during parts of the second day.

If it works for you though, it works, so don't let me talk you out of it. I personally do 25 mg ED. 20 mg ED was also very good in many respects, and much better than any previous experience with enanthate or cypionate. It really does feel like a different drug.

Thanks for the input. As I said I have just switched from T cyp to the T prop EOD this week. That was my question, ED or EOD, so I may switch to ED. As I said it is to early to make any decisions but the T prop does seem to make me feel different. The only thing I ever got from the T cyp was my morning wood came back. Other than that, nothing. I'm just not somebody that gives up so I'm still experimenting and looking for answers.

 

[elroy]

I was curious what everyone's experience was with a steady T level versus a protocol that has a trough maybe 30% lower than the peak.
Example: protocol #1 low of 1,000 and high of 1,100 versus protocol #2 low of 800 and high of 1,100. In terms of libido and sexual function which is better in your experience? Most of what I read talks about maintaining a steady level.

 

[Systemlord]

In terms of libido and sexual function which is better in your experience? Most of what I read talks about maintaining a steady level.

It’s different for everyone, what works best for someone may not produce good results for another.