First Test C + HCG Dosage Input

radiationkillsbirds · Mar 14, 2018

The alternative plan is:

50mg test-cyp e3d
500iu hcg e3d
.25mg adex e3d

All taken on the same day.

Deleted member 16042 · Mar 14, 2018

Seems my goals may be extremely different from yours but I agree with the recommendation of 100mg/wk T cyp, plus some HCG, test levels in 6 or more weeks and adjust.

In my own case after transdermals gave quite low results, I was started on 64mg T cyp E3D which is a couple mg shy of 150/week. labs at 6 weeks came in at over 1500/maximum measurable range at trough, estrogen was very high though I was not symptomatic. Dosage was subsequently reduced twice and I've ended up with high HCT, but can't donate blood because of low ferritin. So, in my case, high dosage created a bad situation where if we don't get the HCT down I don;t have good options.

Now on 42mg E3D which is 96.6mg/week to try to keep me in physiological range, reduce HCT and bring E2 into good range.

Re: HCG I was initially started on 350 E3D which worked at first, then effect tapered off. subsequently increased to 500iu E3D. Works well enough to keep testicles from retracting, but has not increased size.

So, my take is start 100mg/week and 350 HCG

AND NO AROMATASE INHIBITOR. Too many guys tank estrogen often when they need no reduction in the first place. This happened to me as well when I started on TD with chrysin (an AI). Low E2 is bad friggin news!

Cjh4811 · Mar 14, 2018

Me personally I’d start at 100mg a week until labs then adjust. I know the feeling of wanting results. But the doses will concentrate and add up nicely. Just be caustious.

at15 · Mar 14, 2018

JQ88 said:
At15 what were your numbers on this Protocol?

on 150 mg 2x/wk, trough level was 1533 ng/dl, used no AI, estrogen around 50 non sensitive

radiationkillsbirds · Mar 16, 2018

Just some updates:

I will be doing an 8 week combo:
150mg E3D Test-C
350iu E3D HCG
.25mg E3D Arimidex (if needed)

I know a lot of people have mentioned not taking Arimidex because Estrogen shouldn't be crashed or brought down too low. However, knowing my body, for some reason I feel like Estrogen will become an issue for me. I don't want 0 Estrogen, but if I'm already at 25 E2 With low test levels, I'm thinking with the above cycle I'm gonna be hitting 50/60+ on the E2 levels + some titties. lol. So to avoid that, I'd rather just take .25mg every 3rd day.

I have baseline bloodwork from 4 weeks ago.
Fresh Bloodwork schedule for coming Mon, 1st day of Cycle
Then 4 weeks after that. After 4wks on Cycle.
Then 4 weeks after that. After 8wks/end of Cycle.

radiationkillsbirds · Mar 16, 2018

Also, at the moment I am just on 25mg ED Clomid, so Monday's bloodwork will be a good way for me to tell you guys how 4 weeks of Clomid is working, if it has done anything for my T and E and other hormones, or if any other hormones have gone up. (I ordered the complete hormone & wellness panel).

With the above plan, unless some wild pokemon appears to ruin my day:

Here are my expectations:
(This is more for me than you guys, but might help newbies in the future)
* I'm not expecting to have natural T shutdown after the 8 weeks is over bc I am on HCG as well as T
* I am expecting my E2 to rise well above 50/60, hence .25mg E3D should keep it "down" but not at "zero". Bloodwork will show the exact number. I'm okay with E2 being high, but gyno and other symptoms, I'm not okay with.
* I am expecting my T levels to go up dramatically, in the 800/900+ range.
* I do not consider the cycle I'm about to start a super-physiological dose. It's average of 375mg ea. week test-c and 875iu of hcg weekly.
* I am currently weight-training HARD 3x a week (M,W,F) and will continue that for the entire cycle + some. In terms of training, I'm not expecting to see any "gains", but if I do, I will let you guys know.
* I currently haven't had "morning wood" in months. I am expecting this to change as things get balanced out. More on this as erections form. lol
* I am expecting some acne on shoulders/back. I have always had those as problem-areas even without HRT/TRT, so I won't be surprised if my shoulders and back break-out.
* I am expecting improved libido
* I have already had my hair-loss, not expecting it to get any better or worse.

Sorry for the long mary jane journal, but there you go.

madman · Mar 17, 2018

radiationkillsbirds said:
Just some updates:

I will be doing an 8 week combo:
150mg E3D Test-C
350iu E3D HCG
.25mg E3D Arimidex (if needed)

I know a lot of people have mentioned not taking Arimidex because Estrogen shouldn't be crashed or brought down too low. However, knowing my body, for some reason I feel like Estrogen will become an issue for me. I don't want 0 Estrogen, but if I'm already at 25 E2 With low test levels, I'm thinking with the above cycle I'm gonna be hitting 50/60+ on the E2 levels + some titties. lol. So to avoid that, I'd rather just take .25mg every 3rd day.

I have baseline bloodwork from 4 weeks ago.
Fresh Bloodwork schedule for coming Mon, 1st day of Cycle
Then 4 weeks after that. After 4wks on Cycle.
Then 4 weeks after that. After 8wks/end of Cycle.

You are on the wrong forum discussing cycles/blasting-cruising!

Cjh4811 · Mar 17, 2018

Agreed Madman. Wrong site for what you’re doing. Those are above hrt doses and should not be discussed here. We have to maintain the integrity of the forum for the people who need help and advice for their hrt. We can’t let others get the wrong ideas about what that hrt is for by discussing cycles on here. Please try another forum like anabolic minds or evolutionary etc...they will help you with your cycle. Thanks and good luck.

radiationkillsbirds · Mar 21, 2018

Thanks. lol.

HRT, TRT, define it however you want, you guys are in the exact same boat I'm in, and many of you are probably on much higher doses than "HRT" levels. But hey, I don't judge you, nor should anyone judge me. All of my questions were valid, were posed to a relevant crowd, were in the pursuit of health and re-balancing hormones. But to each their own, I guess I will take my requests for advice elsewhere so we can maintain all this integrity. ...

Giantsrus · Aug 7, 2018

radiationkillsbirds said:
I think theres a disconnect. I used the word cycle and thats my fault. People are thinking superhero dose of 500+mg/week.

When I say cycle I mean more like 250 to 350mg/week.

Ive been legally prescribed T in the past, am not new to this stuff at all, am not playing with it for fun. Im trying to get dialed in so life is good.

Hcg during TRT maintains fertility from everything ive read. It doesnt just keep your balls fat. Again, I dont know first hand but Drs and papers and articles and lots of forumers seem to agree.

Clomid has sucked every time ive tried it. I get eye issues and it makes me feel depressed. Even if the bottom line T number does go up from 150 to 500, I still feel terrible on it.

This is a relatively old post; however I will throw in my two cents. I've done a tremendous amount of research on this subject....tremendous. I started taking T replacement not because I was clinically low, but experiencing symptoms and have extremely high SHBG (56nmol). The last 3 TT tests (pre TRT) were 775,812, with the last one being 471 (late in the day during a week I was drinking a lot...july 4th week). However, depending on your SHBG numbers and estrogen, a high T number is not all that's at play. However, with that being said, don't do yourself the disfavor of jumping on 250-300MG of test...that is WAY WAY high. Largely considered the Max dose for TRT is 200MG/Week. I've only been on 3 weeks but EVERYTHING I have read shows that your total T numbers should be in excess, maybe significantly so, of normal T levels for really high producers, shortly after your shot, and high normal (800 or so) before your next shot. You could end up with much higher numbers. The protocol I am on has the Test infused with Anastrozole (Arimidex) @.5mg, and HCG twice per week at 250IU. Most recommendations I have seen are to use an aromotase inhibitor, not estrogen blocker. And you are correct; the HCG has been shown, clinically, to keep the testes making sperm; it's not just to make them "fat". I haven't read through this whole thread; curious what you landed on. But I will make a suggestion; watch "Ask the Doc" from "muscle-insider" youtube videos. The doctor is a doctor of sports medicine, and clears up much of what you see on some sites, clearing through most of the broscience. There is no body of information that I have read that would suggest that once you are on T, you will be sterilizing yourself, or that you would be causing anything permanent. Now, everyone is different, and much is hinged on how much you have done, and for how long, and whether you used things such as HCG to keep your testicles alive. Wish you luck. I will post more of my personal numbers/experiences as time progresses.

user_joe · Aug 7, 2018

Giantsrus said:
This is a relatively old post; however I will throw in my two cents. I've done a tremendous amount of research on this subject....tremendous. I started taking T replacement not because I was clinically low, but experiencing symptoms and have extremely high SHBG (56nmol). The last 3 TT tests (pre TRT) were 775,812, with the last one being 471 (late in the day during a week I was drinking a lot...july 4th week). However, depending on your SHBG numbers and estrogen, a high T number is not all that's at play. However, with that being said, don't do yourself the disfavor of jumping on 250-300MG of test...that is WAY WAY high. Largely considered the Max dose for TRT is 200MG/Week. I've only been on 3 weeks but EVERYTHING I have read shows that your total T numbers should be in excess, maybe significantly so, of normal T levels for really high producers, shortly after your shot, and high normal (800 or so) before your next shot. You could end up with much higher numbers. The protocol I am on has the Test infused with Anastrozole (Arimidex) @.5mg, and HCG twice per week at 250IU. Most recommendations I have seen are to use an aromotase inhibitor, not estrogen blocker. And you are correct; the HCG has been shown, clinically, to keep the testes making sperm; it's not just to make them "fat". I haven't read through this whole thread; curious what you landed on. But I will make a suggestion; watch "Ask the Doc" from "muscle-insider" youtube videos. The doctor is a doctor of sports medicine, and clears up much of what you see on some sites, clearing through most of the broscience. There is no body of information that I have read that would suggest that once you are on T, you will be sterilizing yourself, or that you would be causing anything permanent. Now, everyone is different, and much is hinged on how much you have done, and for how long, and whether you used things such as HCG to keep your testicles alive. Wish you luck. I will post more of my personal numbers/experiences as time progresses.

These posts are the worst. Just regurgitating what you have read. You have no experience. Doesn’t mean you are wrong, but you have no idea. Wait and offer advice from experience.

Giantsrus · Aug 7, 2018

user_joe said:
These posts are the worst. Just regurgitating what you have read. You have no experience. Doesn’t mean you are wrong, but you have no idea. Wait and offer advice from experience.

Your post is not helpful. Yes; I am reposting what I have read from the enormous body of research I have done which documents other's experiences, studies done as well as hours upon hours of questions and answer sessions with doctors. I will never go on a TRT replacement regimen of 250-300mg because that is not TRT, so I will never speak from experience in that regard. But many have, and what I say is correct. You are saying that your comments "don't mean I am wrong" but that "I have no idea". I have an excellent idea. You can't refute what I wrote because you apparently are the one who doesn't have an idea. At least I suggested a very informative set of youtube videos to watch. Why don't you refrain from posting until you have something of merit to offer.

Giantsrus · Aug 8, 2018

user_joe said:
I’ve been there an done it. You have read a bunch of stuff on the internet. You are right. You are more helpful. I like to hire people to help me with things who read about them on the internet. My Dr has a google degree. Top notch.

This is how forums rot. No new information comes about bc of internet know it alls.

They rot because of people like you who have nothing better to do than attack other's posts. "Hire people who read things who read about them on the internet". I didn't know I was applying for a job, but how do you think Doctor's learn; they read...study articles. Yes, some lectures and texts, but I have news for you Joe, the internet is not a publication. It is not authored by someone in particular; maybe you don't know this but the internet got a large part of it's "footing" by connecting colleges and universities to share research. Some may be a repository of useless rants, and broscience, and isolated individual experiences (as you suggest is the only useful info), but the internet also contains useful things, like studies and scholarly articles. You don't use those; you just troll other's posts and make childish declarations. Just go away user joe, and find someone else to attack. I won't respond to anymore of your infantile comments. Have a great day.