Guys, My son (13 years old) is pretty active in sports and has broken 4 bones over the years. Blood showed calcium at optimal levels, but Vitamin D was at 9 ng/ml (30 - 100). After 6 weeks of 3,000 iu daily of Vitamin D, we got his levels up to 36 ng/ml (30 - 100). Really disappointed with the quality of answer I get from docs, seem they don't know shit. My question: Is supplementing with Vitamin D a possible issue only if your levels are over 100 ng/ml...or can someone, in this case a 13 year old, have toxic issues with Vitamin D supplementation while taking 3,000 iu's, but with levels, still at the lower end of the range? Thank you.
Broken Bones - Vitamin D
- Thread starter James
- Start date
Vince
Super Moderator
Yes having levels over 100 can cause toxic issues. I would considering supplementing also with a complex vitamin K supplement, we do have some threads on the subject. I also supplement with boron 3 mg twice a day after breakfast and supper, my GP told me they use it in Europe for bone strength.
When I first started supplementing with vitamin D3 I also used 10000 IU until I got my levels up within a good range now I use
6000iu everyday. That has kept me in a good range, because vitamin D3 is a fat soluble vitamin or hormone you store it. Unlike a water-soluble vitamin.
When I first started supplementing with vitamin D3 I also used 10000 IU until I got my levels up within a good range now I use
6000iu everyday. That has kept me in a good range, because vitamin D3 is a fat soluble vitamin or hormone you store it. Unlike a water-soluble vitamin.
CoastWatcher
Moderator
Living in Canada, long, gray winters, my Vitamin D levels were in the tank when I finally had them checked. I pulled mine into a solid place by supplementing at 15,000 IU for a short period of time and now maintain on 5,000 IU a day.
Vince Carter
Banned
As Vince noted and I'll expand Vitamin K helps to ensure that Calcium is going to the bones and not circulating in the blood stream, which is what is measured. Stating that "blood calcium was at optimal levels" without posting that number or the lab range is pretty useless information.
A tiny minority of persons have difficulty raising their serum 25-OHD. For them the usual supplementation does not work at all or there is painfully slow progress. Beyond mere absorption the body must process the supplement in to the final form it can use. This takes place in multiple steps in different parts of the body.
As a member of this class of non-responders I have reported my experience on these pages which was that Bio-Tech D3-50 capsules were the -only- thing that raised my labs out of single digit range. Over the course of several years none of the Rx preparations worked. I have no explanation on why this is.
The toxicity research, as far as I am aware, has always looked at serum levels of 25-OHD not daily dose. Weekly or bi-weekly doses of 50,000 IU have been used in studies and clinical practice to raise serum levels. Those that prefer to take daily doses will find it easy to open a Bio Tech capsule to take some of the powder on their tongue. There's no need to measure it. Take 50k / week total then retest. Bio-Tech also offers capsules which contain both D3 and K2 (MK7).
As a member of this class of non-responders I have reported my experience on these pages which was that Bio-Tech D3-50 capsules were the -only- thing that raised my labs out of single digit range. Over the course of several years none of the Rx preparations worked. I have no explanation on why this is.
The toxicity research, as far as I am aware, has always looked at serum levels of 25-OHD not daily dose. Weekly or bi-weekly doses of 50,000 IU have been used in studies and clinical practice to raise serum levels. Those that prefer to take daily doses will find it easy to open a Bio Tech capsule to take some of the powder on their tongue. There's no need to measure it. Take 50k / week total then retest. Bio-Tech also offers capsules which contain both D3 and K2 (MK7).
Thank you captain. Can not recall parathroid being mentioned on any Vit D thread before or seen anyone report labs with PTH. None of my docs ever mentioned it.
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/parathyroid-glands-and-vitamin-d/
"it's important to work with your doctor to decide the best course of action"
Good luck on that.
Vince - You're right. I neglected to mention Vitamin K. We checked it and it was at optimal levels.
CoastWatcher - The interesting thing is, we're in Arizona and I'm told low Vitamin D is prevalent in Phoenix. Dermatologist told me it's because people are more concerned with skin cancer and they cake on the sunscreen.
Vince Carter - Brother, you must lead the forum in passive agressive comments.
Re-Ride - Toxicity research looking at serum levels more so than daily dose, makes perfect sense. I remember my mom taking 50,000 iu's and was fine.
Captain - I'll look into that, you may be onto something. He's often tired too.
CoastWatcher - The interesting thing is, we're in Arizona and I'm told low Vitamin D is prevalent in Phoenix. Dermatologist told me it's because people are more concerned with skin cancer and they cake on the sunscreen.
Vince Carter - Brother, you must lead the forum in passive agressive comments.
Re-Ride - Toxicity research looking at serum levels more so than daily dose, makes perfect sense. I remember my mom taking 50,000 iu's and was fine.
Captain - I'll look into that, you may be onto something. He's often tired too.
Vince Carter
Banned
Dr says its all optimal and normal. How's that workin out for your boy? have you seen his numbers? Parroting what your Dr is telling you? You come here for help...posting labs is chore #1 and with 649 posts in 4 years time you should know this by now.
Vince Carter, OP's question was about the maximum safe dose of D3 for a boy age 13. The answer, which I believe to be correct, is that it is the serum level not the daily dose one needs to be concerned with.
James, beyond your simple but important question on daily dosing of D3 which is shared by many consumers you added background information and a comment about trust in the doctor's knowledge and advice. This opened your thread to suggestions from others who want to help. Compelling studies exist which may guide your decisions. The truth is that you and your doctor are confronted with areas of medicine, metabolism and nutrition that are as yet not well understood.
It's commendable to want to help your son, this being at least the second thread you've posted about him. Someday this forum may have a template where the relevant labs, current, former and proposed protocols appear in the opening post in abbreviated outline with an ability to update the lead-in post. Readers are then spared the tedium of sifting through pages to understand a poster's situation. Until such a template may be offered, if ever, it behooves posters to include tables or add images prior to discussion. Vince Carter's comment might be a bit hard-hitting but it does reflect the tedious tooth-pulling that is all too often the case in this and other forums.
James, beyond your simple but important question on daily dosing of D3 which is shared by many consumers you added background information and a comment about trust in the doctor's knowledge and advice. This opened your thread to suggestions from others who want to help. Compelling studies exist which may guide your decisions. The truth is that you and your doctor are confronted with areas of medicine, metabolism and nutrition that are as yet not well understood.
It's commendable to want to help your son, this being at least the second thread you've posted about him. Someday this forum may have a template where the relevant labs, current, former and proposed protocols appear in the opening post in abbreviated outline with an ability to update the lead-in post. Readers are then spared the tedium of sifting through pages to understand a poster's situation. Until such a template may be offered, if ever, it behooves posters to include tables or add images prior to discussion. Vince Carter's comment might be a bit hard-hitting but it does reflect the tedious tooth-pulling that is all too often the case in this and other forums.
Vince
Super Moderator
Boron for bone density
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?7007-Boron-for-bone-density
What is it?
Boron is a mineral that is found in food and the environment. People take boron supplements as medicine.
Boron is used for building strong bones, treating osteoarthritis, as an aid for building muscles and increasing testosterone levels, and for improving thinking skills and muscle coordination.
Women sometimes use capsules containing boric acid, the most common form of boron, inside the vagina to treat yeast infections.
People also apply boric acid to the skin as an astringent or to prevent infection; or use it as an eye wash.
Boron was used as a food preservative between 1870 and 1920, and during World Wars I and II.
Boron is a mineral that is found in food and the environment. People take boron supplements as medicine.
Boron is used for building strong bones, treating osteoarthritis, as an aid for building muscles and increasing testosterone levels, and for improving thinking skills and muscle coordination.
Women sometimes use capsules containing boric acid, the most common form of boron, inside the vagina to treat yeast infections.
People also apply boric acid to the skin as an astringent or to prevent infection; or use it as an eye wash.
Boron was used as a food preservative between 1870 and 1920, and during World Wars I and II.
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?7007-Boron-for-bone-density
Great info guys. Much appreciated.
Vince - I was able to watch most of the video this morning and they had some interesting stuff there as well. I'd like to rule out any thyroid issues as well with his next labs. Boron, parathyroid, Vit D, K and calcium. Several things to consider.
Re-Ride - good comments, and I agree.
Vince - I was able to watch most of the video this morning and they had some interesting stuff there as well. I'd like to rule out any thyroid issues as well with his next labs. Boron, parathyroid, Vit D, K and calcium. Several things to consider.
Re-Ride - good comments, and I agree.
Vince
Super Moderator
I wouldn't supplement with calcium. When someone supplements with D3, they become a hyper absorber of calcium. If someone needs more calcium, check levels and eat foods rich in calcium.
Yes, that's what I read, and certainly something to be careful with when supplementing. Since he's at an ideal level with both calcium and K, the wife and I elected to supplement with D only. Had a good conversation with a young 20 something salesperson at the health food store who was smart enough to caution against calcium supplements if his levels are high and he's taking additional vitamin D. I think we're on the right path.
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