Bloated and Swollen on Testosterone: What Tests to Run
- Thread starter tomas
- Start date
20% or 200mg/g
Pre levels:
RBC 5.6
Hematocrit: 49%
Hemoglobin: 17 g/dl
Back in 2013
RBC 5.8
Hematocrit: 50.6%
Hemoglobin: 17 g/dl
So got the phlebotomy done and should be good for awhile. Going in today Hemoglobin was at 19 on the machine at the blood bank. I would have to look back on earlier labs but I am thinking it should be in the 15-16 range now.
I did find this quote on another forum that corresponds directly to the result I saw in doing the about AndroForte protocol. Since I stopped my swelling has mostly subsided and my hair feels normal again.
"The scrotum is the worst place to apply T Cream because it all converts to DHT, and not T. This will also cause the HPTA to shut down any existing production of LH. If you do labs, you will find no increase in T at all, and most likely a decrease in T from baseline due to HPTA suppression. Your DHT labs however will be very high."
Today I switched from shoulders to inner arm and I actually feel better. So I am going to keep that up until my next battery of tests and see where things are at.
Can skin application sites vary that much when using testosterone cream?
I did find this quote on another forum that corresponds directly to the result I saw in doing the about AndroForte protocol. Since I stopped my swelling has mostly subsided and my hair feels normal again.
"The scrotum is the worst place to apply T Cream because it all converts to DHT, and not T. This will also cause the HPTA to shut down any existing production of LH. If you do labs, you will find no increase in T at all, and most likely a decrease in T from baseline due to HPTA suppression. Your DHT labs however will be very high."
Today I switched from shoulders to inner arm and I actually feel better. So I am going to keep that up until my next battery of tests and see where things are at.
Can skin application sites vary that much when using testosterone cream?
Respectfully... switch to shots... I messed around with every type of cream/gel known to mankind. In my experience it was just impossible to dial in consistent levels.
Vince
Super Moderator
I agree, it's so easy to manger injections and adjusting protocols.
I am 2 weeks into trying approximately 2/3 gram of 20% cream on my upper body, do you think I should just give it up before the 6 weeks and try to get injections on the go instead?
Vince
Super Moderator
I wouldn't stop, I would follow though on your protocol and get labs done.
Okay so I just reached out to Defy Medical and hopefully it will not be cost prohibitive to get dialed in correctly. I have kept up with the current 2/3 g of 20% on the arm protocol but still feel my testosterone is low and I am still slightly swelling. Hopefully I can get the tests done sooner than later as I am pretty sure being on the cream is making me feel worse than off it.
Vince
Super Moderator
I hope switching to Defy Medical works for you. I know we must be proactive in our quest for better health.
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
I apologize for jumping in late in this discussion. My time has been limited with other men's health start ups. Gladly you guys do well without me !
Swelling is one of TRT's most troublesome and hard to manage side effects. It occurs (in my estimate) to about 20 percent of users. The potential causes could be cortisol build up, increase sodium retention, in rare cases high estradiol, or cardiovascular issues. I am enclosing several posts on these issues.
Most cases of lower extremity (peripheral) edema has nothing to do with estradiol and a lot to do with cardiovascular issues. My number one suggestion if edema does not get better after a month on TRT is to get a full cardio work up by a cardiologist.
Some men report decreased edema after a short cycle of a diuretic like HTZ, so that is something to explore. Low sodium intake and plenty of water plus cardio may also help. Cardio exercise and sweating in a sauna have also been reported to help. But these are speculations that should not replace a good cardiovascular work up.
Pulmonary hypertension caused by sleep apnea has also been reported as a cause.
http://www.aafp.org/afp/2006/0215/p589.html
"A common but under-recognized cause of edema is pulmonary hypertension, which is often associated with sleep apnea. Venous insufficiency is treated with leg elevation, compressive stockings, and sometimes diuretics. The initial treatment of idiopathic edema is spironolactone. Patients who have findings consistent with sleep apnea, such as daytime somnolence, load snoring, or neck circumference >17 inches, should be evaluated for pulmonary hypertension with an echocardiogram."
edema[swelling] what is the cause
Ankle swelling after starting testosterone injections
Swelling is one of TRT's most troublesome and hard to manage side effects. It occurs (in my estimate) to about 20 percent of users. The potential causes could be cortisol build up, increase sodium retention, in rare cases high estradiol, or cardiovascular issues. I am enclosing several posts on these issues.
Most cases of lower extremity (peripheral) edema has nothing to do with estradiol and a lot to do with cardiovascular issues. My number one suggestion if edema does not get better after a month on TRT is to get a full cardio work up by a cardiologist.
Some men report decreased edema after a short cycle of a diuretic like HTZ, so that is something to explore. Low sodium intake and plenty of water plus cardio may also help. Cardio exercise and sweating in a sauna have also been reported to help. But these are speculations that should not replace a good cardiovascular work up.
Pulmonary hypertension caused by sleep apnea has also been reported as a cause.
http://www.aafp.org/afp/2006/0215/p589.html
"A common but under-recognized cause of edema is pulmonary hypertension, which is often associated with sleep apnea. Venous insufficiency is treated with leg elevation, compressive stockings, and sometimes diuretics. The initial treatment of idiopathic edema is spironolactone. Patients who have findings consistent with sleep apnea, such as daytime somnolence, load snoring, or neck circumference >17 inches, should be evaluated for pulmonary hypertension with an echocardiogram."
edema[swelling] what is the cause
Ankle swelling after starting testosterone injections
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Surprisingly my ankles are not swollen, it is more of my face, neck, chest and abdomen. My current doctor checked for edema in the ankles and found none. When I first went on testosterone cream I felt awesome for 3 months then I went downhill with swelling and feeling horrible. I have noticed last time it took only a week from feeling good to the downhill slide. I really am wondering if my skin is just converting the cream into high levels of DHT or estrogen.
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
tomas
I would decrease your salt and sugar intake, sweat and may be ask your doctor for a short cycle of HTZ diuretic.
I would decrease your salt and sugar intake, sweat and may be ask your doctor for a short cycle of HTZ diuretic.
Tommy Wall
Member
Nelson what is normally a short cycle? A week or?
Nelson Vergel
Founder, ExcelMale.com
You should lose water weight within 5-7 days of any diuretic.
Here is an update on my testosterone levels applying 1/2-2/3 gram of 20% a day to upper body.
16 hours after applying cream:
Serum Testosterone: 500 ng/dl
Free Testosterone: 11 pg/ml
My swelling does seem to be subsiding and from what I have read I think it has to do with the very high levels of DHT from applying it to scrotal skin previously. I am wondering if the DHT levels will subside or if Saw Palmetto or possibly Propecia (finasteride) will be able to bring it down? Also can anyone chime in on the amount of DHT conversion on normal skin vs injections?
16 hours after applying cream:
Serum Testosterone: 500 ng/dl
Free Testosterone: 11 pg/ml
My swelling does seem to be subsiding and from what I have read I think it has to do with the very high levels of DHT from applying it to scrotal skin previously. I am wondering if the DHT levels will subside or if Saw Palmetto or possibly Propecia (finasteride) will be able to bring it down? Also can anyone chime in on the amount of DHT conversion on normal skin vs injections?
CoastWatcher
Moderator
Please, please, please have NOTHING to do with propecia (finasteride) or saw palmetto. Use of it is akin to playing Russian Roulette with your endocrine system. Google "post finasteride syndrome" to read how use of this drug can Rob men of libido, erectile function, energy, and focus.
As soon as I moved over to upper body I could tell the DHT was coming down due to my hair becoming less greasy and coarse. It went back to feeling like pre-TRT within a few days. Physically I am feeling like the DHT levels are decreasing on their own. Since the testosterone levels are looking fairly normal now I am thinking that in a couple weeks get a sensitive estrogen test to make sure that falls in range along with a DHT test to see if it is normalizing or at least if there is a decline in DHT levels.
New blood test and it is not looking good so far, here are some notable numbers :
DHT 315 ng/dl (up from 242)
Estradiol Sensitive 26.6 pg/ml
RBC 5.87
Hemoglobin 18.2
Hematocrit 53.7
Cholesterol also jumped:
Cholesterol, Total 204
LDL, Cholesterol Calc 131
I am thinking of just going off the cream at this point and hopefully my natural axis recovers quickly since I am still having issues with DHT and high RBC.
Does anyone have any idea how long it takes for DHT to go down?
FYI: Test was taken about 8 hrs after applying the cream
.
DHT 315 ng/dl (up from 242)
Estradiol Sensitive 26.6 pg/ml
RBC 5.87
Hemoglobin 18.2
Hematocrit 53.7
Cholesterol also jumped:
Cholesterol, Total 204
LDL, Cholesterol Calc 131
I am thinking of just going off the cream at this point and hopefully my natural axis recovers quickly since I am still having issues with DHT and high RBC.
Does anyone have any idea how long it takes for DHT to go down?
FYI: Test was taken about 8 hrs after applying the cream
.
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CoastWatcher
Moderator
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/sho...ne-Man-s-Enemy-or-Friend&highlight=Dht+friend
Please keep in mind that DHT is not a waste product and can be suppressed with more enthusiasm than is called for.
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