Are You Tired Even With Normal Testosterone? Adrenal Dysfunction

[Nelson Vergel]

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Adrenal fatigue is a collection of signs and symptoms called a functional somatic syndrome where there are imbalances that cause the reserve present in the adrenal gland to be depleted below the necessary level. When evaluating healthy adults, some studies have found that 40 percent of people 60 years of age or older may present with what is called stage 3 adrenal deficiency and depression.​

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Overall , adrenal fatigue is going to affect most people during the course of their lifetime. Signs and symptoms include feeling tired, run down, difficulty getting up, feeling depleted in the morning and feeling more energetic at the end of the day. Many people use caffeine as an antidote to help to deal with this problem.​

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The adrenal glands produce both cortisol and DHEA. Cortisol is going to be a catabolic hormone and DHEA is going to be an anabolic hormone. As we see as stressors increase, there is a decrease in the production of DHEA and an increase in the production of cortisol, so less anabolic “pump you up” and more catabolic “tear you down” hormone levels.​

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When stressors appear, the classic fight or flight response makes your cortisol levels to go up and then over time they come back down. But as we experience chronic stressors that go on for long periods of time, those cortisol levels stay elevated so they don’t drop back into normal range. This extended increase in cortisol levels eventually fatigues the adrenal glands, so they start producing less cortisol. With less morning time cortisol, our energy levels are impaired. Cortisol imbalances also affect how your thyroid gland works in ways that worsen fatigue symptoms.​

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Watch this training video on how to interpret cortisol and DHEA saliva testing. You will find it extremely useful.​

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https://www.gdx.net/learngdx/clinica…drenal-fatigue​

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The post Are You Tired Even With Normal Testosterone? Adrenal Fatigue May Be the Problem. appeared first on Testosterone Wisdom.

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[Vonko1988]

How is adrenal fatigue being fixed?
I believe I have it in some form
My morning cortisol is too high, afternoon cortisol is being too low and evening a bit too high as well according to the optimal values stated here:

Optimal Lab Values-how to interpret your results - Stop The Thyroid Madness

 

[Deleted member 12831]

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Adrenal fatigue is a collection of signs and symptoms called a functional somatic syndrome where there are imbalances that cause the reserve present in the adrenal gland to be depleted below the necessary level. When evaluating healthy adults, some studies have found that 40 percent of people 60 years of age or older may present with what is called stage 3 adrenal deficiency and depression.​

​

Overall , adrenal fatigue is going to affect most people during the course of their lifetime. Signs and symptoms include feeling tired, run down, difficulty getting up, feeling depleted in the morning and feeling more energetic at the end of the day. Many people use caffeine as an antidote to help to deal with this problem.​

​

The adrenal glands produce both cortisol and DHEA. Cortisol is going to be a catabolic hormone and DHEA is going to be an anabolic hormone. As we see as stressors increase, there is a decrease in the production of DHEA and an increase in the production of cortisol, so less anabolic “pump you up” and more catabolic “tear you down” hormone levels.​

​

When stressors appear, the classic fight or flight response makes your cortisol levels to go up and then over time they come back down. But as we experience chronic stressors that go on for long periods of time, those cortisol levels stay elevated so they don’t drop back into normal range. This extended increase in cortisol levels eventually fatigues the adrenal glands, so they start producing less cortisol. With less morning time cortisol, our energy levels are impaired. Cortisol imbalances also affect how your thyroid gland works in ways that worsen fatigue symptoms.​

​

Watch this training video on how to interpret cortisol and DHEA saliva testing. You will find it extremely useful.​

​

https://www.gdx.net/learngdx/clinica…drenal-fatigue​

​

The post Are You Tired Even With Normal Testosterone? Adrenal Fatigue May Be the Problem. appeared first on Testosterone Wisdom.

Continue reading...

The problem here is often times guys have secondary hypogonadism and never tested for Secondary adrenal insufficiency. If a guy has lower am cortisol (below 15) -according to the Cleveland Clinic and lower acth serum (35 or less) they need further testing for SAI.(or possible cyclical cushings etc. The issue is I was told I had adrenal fatigue what I had was SAI and nearly died from a adrenal crisis. A person needs provacative testing which would be metyrapone stim test or the ITT stim test. Saliva testing for cortisol is accurate for free cortisol levels however , we need to find out why it is low if it is low. Is it a pituitary issue or is it a adrenal gland issue such as another autoimmune issue like addison's -which is not that uncommon.

 

[Vonko1988]

As I'm reading about the adrenal fatigue seems I have 90 percent of its symptoms and some of them seem specific to it:
intolerance to adequate dose of T3 medications(on more than 6 mcg I get hyper symptoms), difficulty falling asleep, frequent urination, waking up night time, intolerance to loud noises or music, feeling ALL the time irritated, nervous, anxious, getting angry very easy, SENSITIVITY TO SUPPLEMENTS(always wondered why is that but read it in the STTM book), feeling better after 6 PM. Also I made the flashlight in the pupil test and it was positive for adrenal issues. I will test tomorrow 4 times saliva cortisol, DHEA, ACTH, aldosterone, sodium and potasium.
I tested last year saliva cortisol and seems it is too high morning and night time and too low during the day.

However I have other symptoms that can be put to sub optimal T and thyroid - lower sex drive than before, lower libido, low energy, always tired, difficulty to focus, brain fog, always needing warmer clothes than the people around me, difficulty putting muscle and recovery from weight training.

My testosterone is normal but not very good - 500s total t and around 9ng/dl free t. Many doctors say below 15ng/dl you may have low t symptoms depending on receptors sensitivity. Also my FT3 is 2.7ng/l with very high reverse T3, so seems testosterone, thyroid and adrenals may be causing problems all together.

Can adrenal deficiency lower testosterone and thyroid hormones? And which one I need to fix first?

I was ready to start TRT very soon but now I think I need to clarify the adrenal fatigue first

 

[fifty]

How do you fix adrenal fatigue?

 

[Vonko1988]

This seems to be the question

 

[Vvs1]

This seems to be the question

Probably hydrocortisone?

 

[Vonko1988]

Probably hydrocortisone?

Can, depending on the issue but it is very complicated I need to find a doctor who is knowledgeable in this. No matter how much I read I dont wanna play my own doctor

 

[Vvs1]

Can, depending on the issue but it is very complicated I need to find a doctor who is knowledgeable in this. No matter how much I read I dont wanna play my own doctor

Your cortisol numbers are ok. Best bet is to try T3 to lower RT3. Then move on to TRT.

My cortisol was low, and there's supplements I can take to lower cortisol or keep it from breaking down. Especially timing- if I take Phosphatidylserine or ginkgo biloba (both cortisol reducers) at night, I feel awful the next day and it would have to be driving my low cortisol even lower. GB is an antiandrogen.

Licorice can extend cortisol from breaking down I believe. Licorice is an antiandrogen.

I do feel positive symptom improvement with Tribulus and ginkgo biloba taken in the morning.

 

[Vonko1988]

As I said earlier seems I have intolerance to T3 medications, whether from adrenal fatigue or something else. When Im taking 3 from extremely small dosage I get hyper symptoms and the micro dasage I tolerate seems will not do anything. I guess with NDT will be the same and I will convert more to T4.

So Im not sure how good my odds are to go in TRT with this weak thyroid and a bit messed adrenals. What is the chance testosterone improves their condition?

 

[Deleted member 12831]

As I'm reading about the adrenal fatigue seems I have 90 percent of its symptoms and some of them seem specific to it:
intolerance to adequate dose of T3 medications(on more than 6 mcg I get hyper symptoms), difficulty falling asleep, frequent urination, waking up night time, intolerance to loud noises or music, feeling ALL the time irritated, nervous, anxious, getting angry very easy, SENSITIVITY TO SUPPLEMENTS(always wondered why is that but read it in the STTM book), feeling better after 6 PM. Also I made the flashlight in the pupil test and it was positive for adrenal issues. I will test tomorrow 4 times saliva cortisol, DHEA, ACTH, aldosterone, sodium and potasium.
I tested last year saliva cortisol and seems it is too high morning and night time and too low during the day.

However I have other symptoms that can be put to sub optimal T and thyroid - lower sex drive than before, lower libido, low energy, always tired, difficulty to focus, brain fog, always needing warmer clothes than the people around me, difficulty putting muscle and recovery from weight training.

My testosterone is normal but not very good - 500s total t and around 9ng/dl free t. Many doctors say below 15ng/dl you may have low t symptoms depending on receptors sensitivity. Also my FT3 is 2.7ng/l with very high reverse T3, so seems testosterone, thyroid and adrenals may be causing problems all together.

Can adrenal deficiency lower testosterone and thyroid hormones? And which one I need to fix first?

I was ready to start TRT very soon but now I think I need to clarify the adrenal fatigue first

What are some numbers like lh , fsh serum , igf 1? shbg?

 

[Vonko1988]

What are some numbers like lh , fsh serum , igf 1? shbg?

SHBG last week - 48.38nmol/l, LH end of July - 4.54IU/L, FSH End Of July - 1.39IU/L(below reference range), IGF-1 from March - 191ug/L

 

[SilverSurfer]

How do you fix adrenal fatigue?

You don’t, because it isn’t a thing. It’s quackery. https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/is-adrenal-fatigue-real-2018022813344

 

[wondering]

You don’t, because it isn’t a thing. It’s quackery. https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/is-adrenal-fatigue-real-2018022813344

HPA dysregulation is a more accurate term. It is not a an issue of the adrenals, but of signaling. It is very real. Nutrition, hormone balance, and most important - reduction of stress and habits that go with the...yoga, meditation, exercise, less screen time, sleep improvement etc etc.

 

[Charliebizz]

As I said earlier seems I have intolerance to T3 medications, whether from adrenal fatigue or something else. When Im taking 3 from extremely small dosage I get hyper symptoms and the micro dasage I tolerate seems will not do anything. I guess with NDT will be the same and I will convert more to T4.

So Im not sure how good my odds are to go in TRT with this weak thyroid and a bit messed adrenals. What is the chance testosterone improves their condition?

i suffers from low normal cortisol. And have a lot of the issues you have. Haven’t been able to find a fix for it. Low dose ssri is the only thing that makes me feel decent. It’s something dr mariano spoke often about. It was the only way I was even able to tolerate trt. Trt isn’t the answer for me either. Still can’t get dialed in was a patient of dr crislers for years also. Same as you I tried t3 and when hypo with only 5 mcg.

 

[bixt]

i suffers from low normal cortisol. And have a lot of the issues you have. Haven’t been able to find a fix for it. Low dose ssri is the only thing that makes me feel decent. It’s something dr mariano spoke often about. It was the only way I was even able to tolerate trt. Trt isn’t the answer for me either. Still can’t get dialed in was a patient of dr crislers for years also. Same as you I tried t3 and when hypo with only 5 mcg.

I suggest you try a trial of preferably hydro cortisone or if unavailable low dose prednisone. Taken together with TRT and t3 this may result in a vast improvement, without the ssri (which is just masking symptoms, and may not do so forever).

Most docs will go with prednisone as its cheaper and has a long half life, but even if your symptoms improve it would be prudent to keep trying for hydro cortisone.

 

[Charliebizz]

I suggest you try a trial of preferably hydro cortisone or if unavailable low dose prednisone. Taken together with TRT and t3 this may result in a vast improvement, without the ssri (which is just masking symptoms, and may not do so forever).

Most docs will go with prednisone as its cheaper and has a long half life, but even if your symptoms improve it would be prudent to keep trying for hydro cortisone.

I’ve tried hc a few times in the past zero symptom relief. And I don’t see prednisone as a long term solution just to be able to be on trt.

And the same is said with hrt as masking symptoms obviously something is making my t low and being on t would cause me to take more medication. Yet on ssri alone I’m doing better then I ever had then trying to manipulate hormones.

I’ve already tried everything you’ve said with horrible results. I was on hc mono. T3 mono, trt,mono, trt with hc and t3. Trt and hc only. Trt and t3 only. All absolutely the worst times in my health journey. Only time I could tolerate trt is with 2.5 mg of lexapro.

Neurotransmitters and hormones are so intertwined. I know your trying to help but I’ve been at this a long time. No easy fix for me

 

[wondering]

I dont see armour/NP/levothyroxine in that list. Adding T4 made a HUGE difference in my mood. If you are having HPA issues, t3 by itself may be hard to tolerate.

How did you dose the HC and for how long?

 

[Charliebizz]

I was doing 5 mg 4x a day. I went as high as 35mg per day. I did Armour for very short time. I don’t even remember the dose it was kinda low. Didn’t anything but it wasn’t a fair trial.

My thyroid numbers are pretty damn good that’s why it was hard to get anyone to prescribe thyroid meds. Dr crisler gave me t3 because back then my rt3 was high. But I do suffer from low body temp 97.0-97.6. And I have symptoms of low thyroid

 

[wondering]

I was doing 5 mg 4x a day. I went as high as 35mg per day. I did Armour for very short time. I don’t even remember the dose it was kinda low. Didn’t anything but it wasn’t a fair trial.

My thyroid numbers are pretty damn good that’s why it was hard to get anyone to prescribe thyroid meds. Dr crisler gave me t3 because back then my rt3 was high. But I do suffer from low body temp 97.0-97.6. And I have symptoms of low thyroid

I am on 90mg NP thyroid. Wasnt until I added 25mcg levothyroxine that depression lifted. My FT4 went up slightly but symptom change was dramatic. T3 can be too powerful in presence of HPA issues. Something to consider. How are ferritin, b12, other nutritional levels.