TRT Effect on 5 Alpha Reductase and Upstream Hormones- Cause of Low Mood and Anxiety?

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Charliebizz said:
I always recommend trying the scrotal cream. I know so many guys who didn't do well on TRT until they made the switch.
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I vaguely remember you committed to giving the cream a try a while ago but seemed to struggle with it.

Are you still on it now? And if so how do you feel? Did you ever manage to fine tune your protocol?
 
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Charliebizz said:
I'm still using the cream and am doing very well. Once I stopped blaming TRT for every little feeling and stopped messing with my dose, things have been good.
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I'm happy to hear that, thanks for replying. Do you mind going into a bit of detail about your current protocol and how/why you settled on it?
 
I was doing very well on Empower's version of Atris base. Three clicks at 2 p.m. It was in the 800s at 20. And then they discontinued it. I went back to the HRT base, but the same dose was only getting me around 600. So I switched to 250 mg per mL and kept the same dose. Now I'm at 960 TT. I feel very good at that dose. My problem has always been that one little negative symptom would always cause me to revert to a lower dose. It seems I actually feel better up in the 800-900 range. My DHT is in the high 200s, but I have zero side effects that I'm aware of. And all my other health parameters are perfect. My libido and erections are great, and my moods are decent. The icing on the cake for me was low-dose Lexapro. It seems that TRT exacerbates my low-grade anxiety and depression, and the SSRI really helps. It may have its flaws, but it's the best workaround I have found.
 
Charliebizz said:
I was doing very well on Empower's version of Atris base. Three clicks at 2 p.m. It was in the 800s at 20. And then they discontinued it. I went back to the HRT base, but the same dose was only getting me around 600. So I switched to 250 mg per mL and kept the same dose. Now I'm at 960 TT. I feel very good at that dose. My problem has always been that one little negative symptom would always cause me to revert to a lower dose. It seems I actually feel better up in the 800-900 range. My DHT is in the high 200s, but I have zero side effects that I'm aware of. And all my other health parameters are perfect. My libido and erections are great, and my moods are decent. The icing on the cake for me was low-dose Lexapro. It seems that TRT exacerbates my low-grade anxiety and depression, and the SSRI really helps. It may have its flaws, but it's the best workaround I have found.
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Thats great news, man. I'm really happy to hear about your success.
 
Charliebizz said:
I was doing very well on Empower's version of Atris base. Three clicks at 2 p.m. It was in the 800s at 20. And then they discontinued it. I went back to the HRT base, but the same dose was only getting me around 600. So I switched to 250 mg per mL and kept the same dose. Now I'm at 960 TT. I feel very good at that dose. My problem has always been that one little negative symptom would always cause me to revert to a lower dose. It seems I actually feel better up in the 800-900 range. My DHT is in the high 200s, but I have zero side effects that I'm aware of. And all my other health parameters are perfect. My libido and erections are great, and my moods are decent. The icing on the cake for me was low-dose Lexapro. It seems that TRT exacerbates my low-grade anxiety and depression, and the SSRI really helps. It may have its flaws, but it's the best workaroun
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By the way. Where on your body are you applying this?
 
Charliebizz said:
I was doing very well on Empower's version of Atris base. Three clicks at 2 p.m. It was in the 800s at 20. And then they discontinued it. I went back to the HRT base, but the same dose was only getting me around 600. So I switched to 250 mg per mL and kept the same dose. Now I'm at 960 TT. I feel very good at that dose. My problem has always been that one little negative symptom would always cause me to revert to a lower dose. It seems I actually feel better up in the 800-900 range. My DHT is in the high 200s, but I have zero side effects that I'm aware of. And all my other health parameters are perfect. My libido and erections are great, and my moods are decent. The icing on the cake for me was low-dose Lexapro. It seems that TRT exacerbates my low-grade anxiety and depression, and the SSRI really helps. It may have its flaws, but it's the best workaround I have found.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the details. So you do three clicks on the scrotum around 2pm every day, and the results you've listed are 20 hours later around 10am?

I think I'm gonna give the cream another try. Low dose cream is to this day the best I've ever felt in my entire life. It only lasted 3 days unfortunately, but I'm hoping I'll be able to fine tune something if I take the time.

I also felt better in terms of zest for life and motivation to get things done. I'm guessing in part due to the ultra-high DHT levels as well as a lesser degree of HPTA suppression.

Have you tried 2x/day application and seen a difference? Do you feel any drop in levels before your next application when applying only once/day?
 
Jerajera said:
Thanks for the details. So you do three clicks on the scrotum around 2pm every day, and the results you've listed are 20 hours later around 10am?

I think I'm gonna give the cream another try. Low dose cream is to this day the best I've ever felt in my entire life. It only lasted 3 days unfortunately, but I'm hoping I'll be able to fine tune something if I take the time.

I also felt better in terms of zest for life and motivation to get things done. I'm guessing in part due to the ultra-high DHT levels as well as a lesser degree of HPTA suppression.

Have you tried 2x/day application and seen a difference? Do you feel any drop in levels before your next application when applying only once/day?
Click to expand...
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I do 3 Clicks a.m and 2 clicks pm. I typically apply my cream at 430 am the 430 pm. On weekends it can be all over the place. Right now I'm on 12 hour work days. Been applying at 4am and 9 pm. I feel no different. I've also skipped pm dose and feel the same. I've had minor side effects when I upped the dose but everything eventually settles in for me with cream.
 
Charliebizz said:
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I do 3 Clicks a.m and 2 clicks pm. I typically apply my cream at 430 am the 430 pm. On weekends it can be all over the place. Right now I'm on 12 hour work days. Been applying at 4am and 9 pm. I feel no different. I've also skipped pm dose and feel the same. I've had minor side effects when I upped the dose but everything eventually settles in for me with cream.
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How’s things convenience wise for u with the cream? That was the biggest thing I didn’t like. But I can also see it not being very inconvenient for some. Where do u stand on that?
 
Charliebizz said:
Honestly once I started to feel really good all the inconveniences became a non-issue even applying right before sex and stuff have haven't affected my wife's levels and she gets tested regularly. all is good my brother
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This is actually exactly what I expected u to say lol. Figured u would say that it wasn’t an issue since ur feeling so good. Which absolutely makes sense. And that’s pretty cool that the transference isn’t as big of an issue as a lot of people think, at least for u and ur wife. Glad to hear that things are going so well :)
 
Charliebizz said:
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I do 3 Clicks a.m and 2 clicks pm. I typically apply my cream at 430 am the 430 pm. On weekends it can be all over the place. Right now I'm on 12 hour work days. Been applying at 4am and 9 pm. I feel no different. I've also skipped pm dose and feel the same. I've had minor side effects when I upped the dose but everything eventually settles in for me with cream.
Click to expand...
Are you applying all of your clicks to the scrotum?
 
Jerajera said:
Thanks for the details. So you do three clicks on the scrotum around 2pm every day, and the results you've listed are 20 hours later around 10am?

I think I'm gonna give the cream another try. Low dose cream is to this day the best I've ever felt in my entire life. It only lasted 3 days unfortunately, but I'm hoping I'll be able to fine tune something if I take the time.

I also felt better in terms of zest for life and motivation to get things done. I'm guessing in part due to the ultra-high DHT levels as well as a lesser degree of HPTA suppression.

Have you tried 2x/day application and seen a difference? Do you feel any drop in levels before your next application when applying only once/day?
Click to expand...
I'm not sold on the "lesser degree of hpta suppression" on 2x a day application.
 
Gman86 said:
Wouldn’t 2x/ day application possibly result in more suppression, not less?
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I can’t say whether or not it’s more or less suppressive, but I can say that levels on 2x/day cream are flatter than people might think.

I once had two consecutive blood draws done. One about 4-5 hours after morning application, then another the following morning before my next morning application (about 12 hours after evening application). T levels were roughly the same on both labs.
 
HSLD said:
I can’t say whether or not it’s more or less suppressive, but I can say that levels on 2x/day cream are flatter than people might think.

I once had two consecutive blood draws done. One about 4-5 hours after morning application, then another the following morning before my next morning application (about 12 hours after evening application). T levels were roughly the same on both labs.
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And u were applying it to ur scrotum?
 
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FunkOdyssey said:
Yes it would, by making the troughs higher.
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I’m thinking he meant more suppression, and just wrote it out wrong. Don’t think anyone would ever assume that 2 applications per day would result in less suppression than one per day, with the total dosage per day remaining the same
 
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