Total testosterone MS and Nandrolone

[Gman86]

Is Total T MS panel specific enough to recognize a testosterone molecule from a nandrolone molecule?

I know the standard non sensitive Total T panel can’t differentiate test and nandrolone and will add them together, and the Total T LC/MS/MS panel is specific enough to know the difference and won’t add them together, but does anyone know if the Total T MS panel is specific enough to know the difference, or will it add them together?

 

[tareload]

Start here and read down. Amount of interference nandrolone will present on an ECLIA TT assay depends on the manufacturer and which assay:

Does anyone use Nandrolone (Deca Durabolin) ?

I'd have to dig up my exact numbers, but basically on daily injections of 20mg of test enanthate (140 a week), I was at total t of ~820 and free t was around 19. I had to take anastrozole 2x a week to keep my estrogen in the low 30's, which is consistently the highest I can get it without side...

www.excelmale.com

Notice the reported interference varies widely between the Roche and Abbott ECLIA TT assays (updated table below):

An LC-MS/MS TT assay done correctly will physically separate the nandrolone from testosterone and hence won't suffer from nandrolone interference.

 

[Gman86]

Start here and read down. Amount of interference nandrolone will present on an ECLIA TT assay depends on the manufacturer and which assay:

Does anyone use Nandrolone (Deca Durabolin) ?

I'd have to dig up my exact numbers, but basically on daily injections of 20mg of test enanthate (140 a week), I was at total t of ~820 and free t was around 19. I had to take anastrozole 2x a week to keep my estrogen in the low 30's, which is consistently the highest I can get it without side...

www.excelmale.com

Notice the reported interference varies widely between the Roche and Abbott ECLIA TT assays (updated table below):
View attachment 13694


An LC-MS/MS TT assay done correctly will physically separate the nandrolone from testosterone and hence won't suffer from nandrolone interference.

what’s ur opinion on Mass spectrometry tho, do u think it’s sensitive enough to separate the nandrolone from testosterone like LC/MS/MS does?

 

[tareload]

what’s ur opinion on Mass spectrometry tho, do u think it’s sensitive enough to separate the nandrolone from testosterone like LC/MS/MS does?

Short answer, no without separation and sometimes derivatization of the compounds you wouldn't have the selectivity.

In the case of LC-MS/MS you would be using chromatography (typically HPLC) to separate the hormones and then Mass SpecX2 to selectively identify and quantify them based on their mass-to-charge ratio and product ion counts (using electron multiplier). Please see the link I shared above on LC-MS/MS and example chromatogram below:

Small Molecule HPLC

Small molecules are ions and compounds of molecular weight typically less than 900 daltons. These compounds can be effectively separated and analyzed by HPLC, UHPLC and LC-MS using mainly silica particles or monolithic stationary phases with a broad range of column chemistries (modifications).

www.sigmaaldrich.com

If you are referring to this assay:

Quest Diagnostics: Test Directory

testdirectory.questdiagnostics.com

It's not just MS but actually chromatography combined with MS. No accredited/commercial lab uses just MS to quantify testosterone. You wouldn't want to use MS by itself since the mass spectra of testosterone and nandrolone (and a bunch of other steroids) are overlapping:

Testosterone

webbook.nist.gov

Nandrolone

webbook.nist.gov

Of course the assumption is the lab is using chromatography correctly to properly resolve testosterone from all other sex steroids/hormones in the matrix (see example HPLC column above).

 

[Gman86]

Was talking with a guy in one of the fb groups about this and he added nandrolone to his protocol a while back and had the MS total test panel done through quest diagnostics. Here’s the test that quest offers that I found on their website. It’s the same test he had done I assume.

Quest Diagnostics: Test Directory

testdirectory.questdiagnostics.com

Here’s our convo about it. What’s ur take on this? Looks to me the MS panel from quest was able to decipher testosterone from nandrolone. Either that or his nandrolone is no good. Because even tho he lowered his test dose from 180mg to 140mg, he added in 70mg of nandrolone. So if the MS panel wasn’t able to to tell the difference between test and nandrolone, and added them both together, his total T level should be higher than what it’s currently at, and should technically be higher than when he was on 180mg of test alone. He’s currently now on 210mg of total androgens vs 180mg of total androgens when on test by itself. His nandrolone is from Empower btw. So it has to be real obv. What do u make of these results?