Testosterone + HCG and using supplements

[Geno]

I have a question regarding introducing supplements while on Testosterone and HCG. I'm currently running Testosterone every 10days 200mg. And HCG 500ui every three days. I have been looking into post workout supplements and was wondering if anyone has used Pre JYM (preworkout) and Post JYM (post workout) supplements. I would like to know if it is going to mess with my progress on testosterone or if its ok to drink them while on testosterone therapy. I'm including the nutrition facts for both supplements. Thanks in advance.


Pre JYM
[TABLE="class: facts_label, width: 350"]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_size"]20 Servings[/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_flavor, colspan: 2, align: right"]Cherry Limeade[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_serving, colspan: 3"]Serving Size: 1 Scoop (26.5g)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_serving, colspan: 3"]Servings Per Container20[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider medium, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"]Amount Per Serving[/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"]% Daily Value[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Calories[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]15[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Total Carbohydrates[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]4 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]1%*[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Sugars[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Sodium (as sodium chloride)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]220 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]9%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider medium, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Creatine Hydrochloride[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]CarnoSyn® Beta-Alanine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Betaine (Trimethylglycine)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.5 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Taurine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]N-Acetyl L-Cysteine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]600 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]AlphaSize® Alpha-Glyceryl Phosphoryl Choline[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]300 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Citrulline Malate[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]6 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Beta vulgaris L. (beet extract)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]500 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Leucine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]3 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Isoleucine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.5 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Valine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.5 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Tyrosine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.5 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Caffeine Anhydrous[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]300 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Huperzine A[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]50 mcg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Bioperine® (Piper Nigrum Fruit Extract)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]5 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider wide, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]* Percent Daily Values are based on a 2000-calorie diet[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]† Daily value not established[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider narrow, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_title_2, colspan: 3"]Other Ingredients:[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing_2, colspan: 3"]Dextrose, Natural and artificial flavors, Calcium Silicate, Sucralose, Acesulfame Potassium, Fd&C Red #40, and Soy lecithin.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]ALLERGEN WARNING: CONTAINS: SOY. Produced in a facility that also processes PEANUTS, EGGS, WHEAT and MILK.


Post JYM
[TABLE="class: facts_label, width: 350"]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_size"]30 Servings[/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_flavor, colspan: 2, align: right"]Fruit Punch[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_serving, colspan: 3"]Serving Size: 1 Scoop (20g)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_serving, colspan: 3"]Servings Per Container: About30[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider medium, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"]Amount Per Serving[/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"]% Daily Value[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Calories[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]10[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Total Carbohydrate[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]1%*[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Sodium[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]95 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]4%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider narrow, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_l"][/TD]
[TD="class: seq_span label_heading_r, colspan: 2, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Glutamine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]3 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Creatine Hydrochloride[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Beta-Alanine (as CarnoSyn®)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Carnitine L-Tartrate (as Carnipure™)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Betaine (Trimethylglycine)[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.5 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]Taurine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Leucine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]3.6 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Isoleucine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]L-Valine[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]1.2 g[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"]BioPerine®[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"]5.3 mg[/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"]†[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_ing"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_qty, align: right"][/TD]
[TD="class: line_above seq_span label_dv, align: right"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider medium, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]* Percent Daily Values are based on a 2,000 calorie diet.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]† Daily Value not established[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: seq_span label_divider hairline, bgcolor: #000000, colspan: 3"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_title_2, colspan: 3"]Other Ingredients:[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing_2, colspan: 3"]Malic Acid, Natural And Artificial Flavors, Calcium Silicate, Sucralose, Citric Acid, Soy Oil, and Lecithin Blend, Acesulfame Potassium, FD&C Red #40.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: other_label"]
[TD="class: seq_span label_ing, colspan: 3"]ALLERGEN WARNING: Contains SOY and is produced in a facility that also processes PEANUTS, EGGS, WHEAT and MILK.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Gene Devine]

They are both good and fine to use pre and post.

The problem with pre-mixed formulas is that you don't get enough of each supplement.

Also, you should be doing a Whey Isolate shake pre and post workout as well. This is very very important.

I don't use pre-mixed as I do my own based on my research and what works for me.

 

[Vince Carter]

They are both good and fine to use pre and post.

The problem with pre-mixed formulas is that you don't get enough of each supplement.

Also, you should be doing a Whey Isolate shake pre and post workout as well. This is very very important.

I don't use pre-mixed as I do my own based on my research and what works for me.

I concur, more price wise as I was really enjoying...Legion's pre-workout but $40 every two weeks was tough to sustain plus the 350mg caffeine was effective but Ive been toning it down with Caffeine. I started making my own for much much less expense. What I see and will echo with Gene is some of those doses are on the thin side IMHO. 6g of Citrulline is good but most of the others I think are on the threshold of being clinically effective.

 

[trt4me]

I concur mostly. Start with the most proven item such as caffeine, creatine and arginine or some others.
Usually you'll end up saving money and avoiding the junk that makes it drinkable.

 

[thatoneguy]

I used both of the supplements as well as some other of the jym products. They are a very good but pricey line of supplements. The advantage of the jym line is they list the exact content of each ingredient and does not use proprietary blends.

This way you can add additional of certain supplements and know exactly what total you are getting. I add extra citrulline with my pre and post workout drinks.

I used to mix my own pre and post workout shakes, but i got tired of having a 100 different bottles of powder and pills laying around.

 

[Vince Carter]

I used both of the supplements as well as some other of the jym products. They are a very good but pricey line of supplements. The advantage of the jym line is they list the exact content of each ingredient and does not use proprietary blends.

This way you can add additional of certain supplements and know exactly what total you are getting. I add extra citrulline with my pre and post workout drinks.

I used to mix my own pre and post workout shakes, but i got tired of having a 100 different bottles of powder and pills laying around.

...and the taste...choke it down!

 

[MikeXL]

When you add the PreJym and PostJym together you get clinic doses of most of the ingredients. Except, Tyrosine where the clinical dose is close to 10 grams. Also, I don't know what the clinical doses of glutamine, tuarine, beet root and Huperzine A are because I have never seen a clinical study on any of those that was impressive.

In any event, if you are in a caloric surplus, probably 3/4 of the benefit of this product is coming from caffeine and creatine

 

[Geno]

Thanks everyone for your input. I was worried about the ingredients hindering my testosterone in anyway since I'm already introducing Testosterone + HCG into my body. Now that I got some feed back i will give it a try and look for something cheaper later.

 

[ERO]

Just curious - How do you feel on one T injection every 10 days?

 

[Geno]

Around day 8 I start feeling a little decline in mood and well being. Anxiety starts to creep up slowly then kind of mellows out after my next injection. Initially my doctor wanted to start me on every three weeks but I told him I would like something shorter. Based on research I wanted to start on weekly injections but he did not approve. My next appointment is coming soon and will express my concerns and see if he can change my dosage to weekly inj. If you don't mind me asking what are you dosages, are you using any HCG?

 

[James]

If you're feeling good with a once every 10 days injection schedule, I suspect you'll do really well with once a week. I'm taking 120 mg (60mg twice weekly). Never used HCG.

 

[Vince Carter]

When you add the PreJym and PostJym together you get clinic doses of most of the ingredients. Except, Tyrosine where the clinical dose is close to 10 grams. Also, I don't know what the clinical doses of glutamine, tuarine, beet root and Huperzine A are because I have never seen a clinical study on any of those that was impressive.

In any event, if you are in a caloric surplus, probably 3/4 of the benefit of this product is coming from caffeine and creatine

The dosing can't be cumulative to reach an effective dose; pre and post workout.

 

[MikeXL]

Vince Carter - that is incorrect. Creatine has to build to saturation levels. It doesn't matter if you take it pre, post or on you day off. Same goes for beta- alanine. Studies done with beta-alanine, the compound wasn't even take pre or post. Again it has to build to blood levels. The studies done with betaine were done with 1.25G pre and 1.25G post.

So why put creatine or beta-alanine in a pre or post if it doesn't matter when you take it. That is because pre and post WO formulas are all the rave. It is all marketing bull shit so that the consumer thinks that he is getting a lot

And why would jim stoppani put 2G of beta alanine in PreJym and 2G in PostJym when infact all of the studies were done with between 3.2 and 6.4 G? Well, let's see to get the dose in the 3.2 to 6.4 range you need to buy both his products now don't you?

 

[Spinkter]

I've tried them all just about currently my favorite pre is EWP "Enter with Purpose" from run everything labs, and Jet Mass creatine. And I'm on Test Cyp 200 split every 3.5 days. No HCG. Works for me.

 

[Vince Carter]

Vince Carter - that is incorrect. Creatine has to build to saturation levels. It doesn't matter if you take it pre, post or on you day off. Same goes for beta- alanine. Studies done with beta-alanine, the compound wasn't even take pre or post. Again it has to build to blood levels. The studies done with betaine were done with 1.25G pre and 1.25G post.

So why put creatine or beta-alanine in a pre or post if it doesn't matter when you take it. That is because pre and post WO formulas are all the rave. It is all marketing bull shit so that the consumer thinks that he is getting a lot

And why would jim stoppani put 2G of beta alanine in PreJym and 2G in PostJym when infact all of the studies were done with between 3.2 and 6.4 G? Well, let's see to get the dose in the 3.2 to 6.4 range you need to buy both his products now don't you?

YOu can't take 2g pre, and 2g post, and reach the efficacy of having taken 4g in one dose though I get where you're going.

 

[ERO]

Around day 8 I start feeling a little decline in mood and well being. Anxiety starts to creep up slowly then kind of mellows out after my next injection. Initially my doctor wanted to start me on every three weeks but I told him I would like something shorter. Based on research I wanted to start on weekly injections but he did not approve. My next appointment is coming soon and will express my concerns and see if he can change my dosage to weekly inj. If you don't mind me asking what are you dosages, are you using any HCG?

If you are doing your own shots (not going to the clinic every 10 days for them to do it) I would recommend getting some 27 or 29 gauge insulin syringes and injecting smaller amounts of T every 3.5 days. (Say Monday AM, Thursday PM, as an example) You get far more even T levels that way and less conversion to E2. I have low SHBG so I inject a very small amount daily as do some of the other low SHBG guys here on the forum. If your SHBG is in the normal range though, every 3.5 days is often optimal.