Gianluca
Well-Known Member
Has anyone who is using Empower Pharmacy, seen a decrease in Testosterone levels with same weekly dosage lately?
Issues with Empower Test-CYP?
- Thread starter Gianluca
- Start date
Someone posted the same thing here last year. A 20 percent difference in levels between compounding vs pharma. I can tell you personally that I no longer use their compounded DHEA. My levels barely rose on their product but yet practically doubled when using the Life Extension brand. I don’t trust their compounding plain and simple. My last deca run did nothing for me.
Interesting. It's been so long since i was on pharma that I wouldn't know the difference anymore.
madman
Super Moderator
post #12
Big Pharma vs Compounded T Comparison
I decided to run a comparison between empowers compounded cypionate vs pfizers cypionate. I ran each for 12 weeks at 70mg e3.5d with no other ancillaries and the same exact supplement regimen. Pfizer: 1268 ng/dl Empower: 979 ng/dl Sensitive estradiol was higher on the Pfizer as well. Pfizer...
www.excelmale.com
Anyone switch from Empower to Perrigo?
I’m almost out of Empower t cyp and my new urologist fills my script with Perrigo. Mine is manufactured by Hikma specifically. I’m wondering if I should keep my dose the same or plan to adjust. Any experiences?
www.excelmale.com
Gianluca
Well-Known Member
I’m going to try my last attempt tomorrow to check my Test levels again, this time on empty stomach, and I have been staying off the little biotin in my multivitamin for 3 days as well, if levels come back lower, there is no doubt something is wrong with either Empower Pharmacy, or perhaps my body started to metabolize test at a much greater degree for the past few months?
Thats discouraging about their compounded nandrolone. Did u end up getting nandrolone from a different compounder after that, or did u just drop it completely?
Has Empower’s nandrolone ever did anything for u? Just wondering if maybe it’s a quality control issue
Yes worked before. Maybe it was a bad batch. I recall that I was injecting subq more than normal this time
Hmm, guess that variable could have something to do with it
Have u ever had ur total T levels checked while adding nandrolone and seen them go up?
Does defy prescribe u the nandrolone via empower?
Lookingforward
Member
Things I have noticed. They rarely fill the test cick dispensor properly. I haven't had any success with thier Nandrolone. It could be my body chemistry but mulitple people at Defy said it works well and I had zero response from 3 months worth of injections. I asked for a copy of a reciept once and thier customer service was extremely poor. Then I asked Defy to get me the copy and they couldn't even get that done.
Was just talking with defy about something else about an hour ago and I asked if their other compounders APS and Hallandale offer nandrolone and they said they don’t unfortunately. Just empower offers it
What was your nandrolone / Test dose? Defy is very conservative with nandrolone prescriptions. I was on about 80 mg which really is not enough for a guy my size. I bumped it to 100 mg per week on my own (just ran out a little sooner) and it was better
Gianluca
Well-Known Member
just got my lab results back, after 3 days off the multivitamin, now test came back at TT 897 FT25 compared to TT 600 and FT 18, it gets even more confusing now. Again, lower levels using same dose, labs, assay and pharmacy, compared to previous history with same protocol.
Lookingforward
Member
60mg every 4 days. I am 190 lbs, 6'1"
To perform this evaluation properly it's essential to measure free testosterone; total testosterone can vary if SHBG changes, whereas free testosterone is expected to remain proportional to dose. Free testosterone must be measured with an accurate method, such as equilibrium dialysis — immunoassay-based tests, sometimes called "direct", are useless. Alternatively, free testosterone can be estimated with the Vermeulen calculation, which requires measuring total testosterone, SHBG, and ideally albumin as well.
It's also important to test at the same time in the injection cycle. However — assuming we're talking about a longer ester like cypionate — if the inter-injection interval is greater than a day or two then one should be aware that changes in the absorption rate can skew the results. This can be caused by various factors, including varying activity level and injection site. One should also inspect the injection site each time to ensure there has been no leakage.
The fairest comparison would be done with daily injections and after a significant stabilization period. You can see that it's not exactly trivial to minimize all of the possible confounding variables. It might be easier — and more accurate — to send the product out to a lab for testing. Aren't compounding pharmacies required to perform such testing anyway?
It's also important to test at the same time in the injection cycle. However — assuming we're talking about a longer ester like cypionate — if the inter-injection interval is greater than a day or two then one should be aware that changes in the absorption rate can skew the results. This can be caused by various factors, including varying activity level and injection site. One should also inspect the injection site each time to ensure there has been no leakage.
The fairest comparison would be done with daily injections and after a significant stabilization period. You can see that it's not exactly trivial to minimize all of the possible confounding variables. It might be easier — and more accurate — to send the product out to a lab for testing. Aren't compounding pharmacies required to perform such testing anyway?
Cataceous, thank you for responding to what was otherwise an old thread. I've been following the forum for a while now and have enjoyed your frequent insight.
Agreed that other variables must be constant to truly determine if this is the issue. Sad part is I'm almost 2 years in and rather than just fine tuning I'm still on the roller coaster. Took me a while to narrow down to what potential inconsistencies are. Had many instances of too many moving variables, incomplete lab testing with inferior testing methods, total overhaul of protocol, etc.. I credit this forum for a lot of the knowledge I've obtained and to the importance of complete and accurate testing.
Thing is after too much trial and error I'm convinced its the vial now. Not saying its the manufacturer but its been the only constant for a while. Could also be storage, how I'm pressurizing the vial and/or drawing etc..
For example - Over the summer I had Empower blend of Enth/Cyp/Nandralone 35%/35%/30% and was using approximately 120mg test & 50mg Nan. per week, no AI HCG etc. Started EOD then quickly moved to daily injections. Package came with 2 vials. First bloods from first vial had me at mid/high free t and E2 top of standard quest range (not ultra sensitive i know now not best test). Felt great at first and started to progressively feel less benefit and ultimately low t in very linear fashion. Last bloods end of 2nd vial free t was 60 on range of roughly 40-250 (quest standard), and E2 came back undetectable. It was first and last time i used nandralone, and of course i blamed the nand. for either skewing labs or for competitive binding. Now having issue with Test Enanthate. Have been testing SHBG for a while now it is always in range of 32.
Excited to get final set of labs and to post. Hoping to hear your insight on.
Agreed that other variables must be constant to truly determine if this is the issue. Sad part is I'm almost 2 years in and rather than just fine tuning I'm still on the roller coaster. Took me a while to narrow down to what potential inconsistencies are. Had many instances of too many moving variables, incomplete lab testing with inferior testing methods, total overhaul of protocol, etc.. I credit this forum for a lot of the knowledge I've obtained and to the importance of complete and accurate testing.
Thing is after too much trial and error I'm convinced its the vial now. Not saying its the manufacturer but its been the only constant for a while. Could also be storage, how I'm pressurizing the vial and/or drawing etc..
For example - Over the summer I had Empower blend of Enth/Cyp/Nandralone 35%/35%/30% and was using approximately 120mg test & 50mg Nan. per week, no AI HCG etc. Started EOD then quickly moved to daily injections. Package came with 2 vials. First bloods from first vial had me at mid/high free t and E2 top of standard quest range (not ultra sensitive i know now not best test). Felt great at first and started to progressively feel less benefit and ultimately low t in very linear fashion. Last bloods end of 2nd vial free t was 60 on range of roughly 40-250 (quest standard), and E2 came back undetectable. It was first and last time i used nandralone, and of course i blamed the nand. for either skewing labs or for competitive binding. Now having issue with Test Enanthate. Have been testing SHBG for a while now it is always in range of 32.
Excited to get final set of labs and to post. Hoping to hear your insight on.
Perplexing update on this. Instead of posting labs, etc. I just decided to switch brands and test. I asked my Doc for "pharma" grade test this time and asked for westward based on skimming internet anecdotes. When i picked my prescription up for CVS it was in a different box, but low and behold it was the exact same bottle down to serial numbers that I was getting from empower (pics attached). Guess empower's products aren't all compounded and they buy and re sell big pharma test presumably for additional mark up?? Good news is my insurance picked it up so no more need for compounding pharmacies...
Attachments
Yup, been getting pharma test via empower, by way of prescription from Defy, for years now. I’m in Massachusetts, and it’s not legal to have Defy call in a test script to my local pharmacy, unfortunately. But luckily I can still get pharma test through Empower. Been getting that exact test that u have in the pic, for a while now. Hikma test enanthate. Like u said, I’m sure I pay a markup getting it through empower, but hey, everyone’s got to make money, can expect people to offer services for free
Gianluca
Well-Known Member
I think that’s ok for Empower to sell big pharma test, I’m in Cali and they can’t send compounded test here, so that is an option for us. I’m guessing people in other states have same issue.
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