25M - Going back on TRT?

[bvictor]

Hey, I'm only 25 but about a year ago I started complaining of fatigue, low motivation, mood, lower sex drive, etc and bloodwork showed low testosterone (~220). I repeated this bloodwork twice (once more showing ~220 and one normal test around 540), and basis my symptoms elected to try trt.

In July I tried clomid for about a month, and then switched to 100mg / wk cypionate injections (dosed 2x/wk). I didn't notice any improvement in energy or mood as I'd hoped (only increased vascularity, and much better exercise recovery. I workout a lot but have always struggled to get stronger before). Disconcertingly, my sex drive completely vanished. I had no motivation towards women at all which is quite abnormal for me, and generally felt worse than pre-TRT.

I added HCG for a few weeks, 350IU 2x/wk at first, and then 100IU ED (switched to cyp ED as well), and noted no improvement in sex drive, but a host of side effects like bloating and anxiety. At this point I stopped trt, waited 10 days or so to start clomid for 3 weeks, and stopped clomid on 11/13. My libido came back about 3 weeks after stopping injections. About 7 weeks later I did labwork with Defy (attached) showing very low testosterone: and they recommended I resume treatment (was treated by a urologist prior). Given my bad experience w/ cypionate, I am leaning towards propionate or compounded cream: they recommended the compound cream.

In addition, Defy noted low fT3 on my first set of labs (this has been noted before, but I've resisted treatment). I've been taking 1 grain of NDT for about a month now. Have noted increased cold tolerance (used to get freezing cold for no reason) and increased HR,but not much else. They pointed to the high reverse T3 in my most recent labs to switch from NDT to pure Cytomel (t3). They also prescribed 25mg DHEA which caused bloating after a few weeks so I stopped.

Apologies for the wall of text, but has anybody had a negative experience with cypionate that was significantly improved on compounded cream? propionate?. Is the 2 month PCT (last injection -> bloodwork) enough time for my testosterone to have recovered (only on cypionate for ~11 weeks)? Is there any explanation for why my libido would have died on TRT? Is reverse T3 a good reason to switch to T3 monotherapy?

I've attached a bunch of blood work. Thanks to anyone who's taken the time to read all this!


*on the 10/26Defy labs, i took an AI the day before to see if it would help at all (hence the low E2). Didn't notice any change.

 

[TLawyer]

Hey, I'm only 25 but about a year ago I started complaining of fatigue, low motivation, mood, lower sex drive, etc and bloodwork showed low testosterone (~220). I repeated this bloodwork twice (once more showing ~220 and one normal test around 540), and basis my symptoms elected to try trt.

In July I tried clomid for about a month, and then switched to 100mg / wk cypionate injections (dosed 2x/wk). I didn't notice any improvement in energy or mood as I'd hoped (only increased vascularity, and much better exercise recovery. I workout a lot but have always struggled to get stronger before). Disconcertingly, my sex drive completely vanished. I had no motivation towards women at all which is quite abnormal for me, and generally felt worse than pre-TRT.

I added HCG for a few weeks, 350IU 2x/wk at first, and then 100IU ED (switched to cyp ED as well), and noted no improvement in sex drive, but a host of side effects like bloating and anxiety. At this point I stopped trt, waited 10 days or so to start clomid for 3 weeks, and stopped clomid on 11/13. My libido came back about 3 weeks after stopping injections. About 7 weeks later I did labwork with Defy (attached) showing very low testosterone: and they recommended I resume treatment (was treated by a urologist prior). Given my bad experience w/ cypionate, I am leaning towards propionate or compounded cream: they recommended the compound cream.

In addition, Defy noted low fT3 on my first set of labs (this has been noted before, but I've resisted treatment). I've been taking 1 grain of NDT for about a month now. Have noted increased cold tolerance (used to get freezing cold for no reason) and increased HR,but not much else. They pointed to the high reverse T3 in my most recent labs to switch from NDT to pure Cytomel (t3). They also prescribed 25mg DHEA which caused bloating after a few weeks so I stopped.

Apologies for the wall of text, but has anybody had a negative experience with cypionate that was significantly improved on compounded cream? propionate?. Is the 2 month PCT (last injection -> bloodwork) enough time for my testosterone to have recovered (only on cypionate for ~11 weeks)? Is there any explanation for why my libido would have died on TRT? Is reverse T3 a good reason to switch to T3 monotherapy?

I've attached a bunch of blood work. Thanks to anyone who's taken the time to read all this!


*on the 10/26Defy labs, i took an AI the day before to see if it would help at all (hence the low E2). Didn't notice any change.

I would give Natesto or the Empower nasal gel (if going through Defy) a try. I am using it now, and although it’s only been a few days, feeling good on it. Enclomiphene is another option. There are lots of posts on both.

 

[Strengthandlibido]

Hey, I'm only 25 but about a year ago I started complaining of fatigue, low motivation, mood, lower sex drive, etc and bloodwork showed low testosterone (~220). I repeated this bloodwork twice (once more showing ~220 and one normal test around 540), and basis my symptoms elected to try trt.

In July I tried clomid for about a month, and then switched to 100mg / wk cypionate injections (dosed 2x/wk). I didn't notice any improvement in energy or mood as I'd hoped (only increased vascularity, and much better exercise recovery. I workout a lot but have always struggled to get stronger before). Disconcertingly, my sex drive completely vanished. I had no motivation towards women at all which is quite abnormal for me, and generally felt worse than pre-TRT.

I added HCG for a few weeks, 350IU 2x/wk at first, and then 100IU ED (switched to cyp ED as well), and noted no improvement in sex drive, but a host of side effects like bloating and anxiety. At this point I stopped trt, waited 10 days or so to start clomid for 3 weeks, and stopped clomid on 11/13. My libido came back about 3 weeks after stopping injections. About 7 weeks later I did labwork with Defy (attached) showing very low testosterone: and they recommended I resume treatment (was treated by a urologist prior). Given my bad experience w/ cypionate, I am leaning towards propionate or compounded cream: they recommended the compound cream.

In addition, Defy noted low fT3 on my first set of labs (this has been noted before, but I've resisted treatment). I've been taking 1 grain of NDT for about a month now. Have noted increased cold tolerance (used to get freezing cold for no reason) and increased HR,but not much else. They pointed to the high reverse T3 in my most recent labs to switch from NDT to pure Cytomel (t3). They also prescribed 25mg DHEA which caused bloating after a few weeks so I stopped.

Apologies for the wall of text, but has anybody had a negative experience with cypionate that was significantly improved on compounded cream? propionate?. Is the 2 month PCT (last injection -> bloodwork) enough time for my testosterone to have recovered (only on cypionate for ~11 weeks)? Is there any explanation for why my libido would have died on TRT? Is reverse T3 a good reason to switch to T3 monotherapy?

I've attached a bunch of blood work. Thanks to anyone who's taken the time to read all this!


*on the 10/26Defy labs, i took an AI the day before to see if it would help at all (hence the low E2). Didn't notice any change.

I'm going through the same thing now: libido has crashed after four weeks on T cypionate. I don't want to bother tweaking protocols with hCG and such.

I would give Natesto or the Empower nasal gel (if going through Defy) a try. I am using it now, and although it’s only been a few days, feeling good on it. Enclomiphene is another option. There are lots of posts on both.

I'm considering stopping the cyp now and then requesting from Defy both enclomiphene for HPTA recovery and nasal gel which is supposed to be markedly less suppressive and possibly better for libido. I'm sure @Cataceous will jump in here, possibly with a chart to make the point.

 

[Cataceous]

...
I'm considering stopping the cyp now and then requesting from Defy both enclomiphene for HPTA recovery and nasal gel which is supposed to be markedly less suppressive and possibly better for libido. I'm sure @Cataceous will jump in here, possibly with a chart to make the point.

@madman is the one who gets credit for posting the Nastesto research. For example:

ACERUS ANNOUNCES PUBLICATION OF RESULTS FOR NATESTO® SPERMATOGENESIS STUDY IN JOURNAL OF UROLOGY

NATESTO® Increases Serum Testosterone and Improves Hypogonadal Symptoms While Preserving Sperm Parameters Within Normal Range...

www.excelmale.com

The study concluded that NATESTO® was found to be both effective in restoring hypogonadal men to normal testosterone levels, while also simultaneously improving both erectile function and quality of life. Importantly, gonadotropin hormones remained within normal ranges and semen parameters were preserved through 6 months of treatment in 95% of men.

 

[TLawyer]

I'm going through the same thing now: libido has crashed after four weeks on T cypionate. I don't want to bother tweaking protocols with hCG and such.



I'm considering stopping the cyp now and then requesting from Defy both enclomiphene for HPTA recovery and nasal gel which is supposed to be markedly less suppressive and possibly better for libido. I'm sure @Cataceous will jump in here, possibly with a chart to make the point.

I had to bail on the nasal gel again. Did it for another weeklong stretch, and I had even dropped the Enclomiphene for a few days. The testosterone levels felt fine, but it's just too much with the nasal application. My throat was constantly bothering me after a few days, and my nose felt stuffed all the time. I just don't view its application method as a long-term solution. It would have been nice to fully realize its benefits, but it was just too much for me up the nose. I'm back to Enclomiphene only.

 

[Strengthandlibido]

I had to bail on the nasal gel again. Did it for another weeklong stretch, and I had even dropped the Enclomiphene for a few days. The testosterone levels felt fine, but it's just too much with the nasal application. My throat was constantly bothering me after a few days, and my nose felt stuffed all the time. I just don't view its application method as a long-term solution. It would have been nice to fully realize its benefits, but it was just too much for me up the nose. I'm back to Enclomiphene only.

This is good to know, thank you. How are you feeling on the enclomiphene only? Libido, anxiety, any eye floaters?

In July I tried clomid for about a month, and then switched to 100mg / wk cypionate injections (dosed 2x/wk). I didn't notice any improvement in energy or mood as I'd hoped (only increased vascularity, and much better exercise recovery. I workout a lot but have always struggled to get stronger before). Disconcertingly, my sex drive completely vanished. I had no motivation towards women at all which is quite abnormal for me, and generally felt worse than pre-TRT.

I added HCG for a few weeks, 350IU 2x/wk at first, and then 100IU ED (switched to cyp ED as well), and noted no improvement in sex drive, but a host of side effects like bloating and anxiety. At this point I stopped trt, waited 10 days or so to start clomid for 3 weeks, and stopped clomid on 11/13. My libido came back about 3 weeks after stopping injections. About 7 weeks later I did labwork with Defy (attached) showing very low testosterone: and they recommended I resume treatment (was treated by a urologist prior). Given my bad experience w/ cypionate, I am leaning towards propionate or compounded cream: they recommended the compound cream.

I find this fascinating as my sex drive has completely crashed since I started a low-dose injection regimen of 10 mg t cypionate/day. I had been toying with the idea of stopping for a while, and your post tipped me over the edge.

 

[TLawyer]

This is good to know, thank you. How are you feeling on the enclomiphene only? Libido, anxiety, any eye floaters?

I find this fascinating as my sex drive has completely crashed since I started a low-dose injection regimen of 10 mg t cypionate/day. I had been toying with the idea of stopping for a while, and your post tipped me over the edge.

I have done pretty well on Enclomiphene for the past year and a half. I don't have a raging libido, but I think it's normal. No eye floaters or anxiety. I don't feel like Superman on it like some talk about being on TRT, but I am definitely better on it than off it. I'm always playing with dosage and frequency to try and find the best combo.

 

[JA Battle]

I have done pretty well on Enclomiphene for the past year and a half. I don't have a raging libido, but I think it's normal. No eye floaters or anxiety. I don't feel like Superman on it like some talk about being on TRT, but I am definitely better on it than off it. I'm always playing with dosage and frequency to try and find the best combo.

What has been the best dose and frequency for enclom for you

 

[TLawyer]

What has been the best dose and frequency for enclom for you

I have labs for both every day and every other day. My free T was about the same level for both, E2 was in a better range for every other day. I need to get some labs for every third day next and see where that leaves me.

 

[Shivam]

I have done pretty well on Enclomiphene for the past year and a half. I don't have a raging libido, but I think it's normal. No eye floaters or anxiety. I don't feel like Superman on it like some talk about being on TRT, but I am definitely better on it than off it. I'm always playing with dosage and frequency to try and find the best combo.

From which did u purchase the enclomiphene