High blood pressure running higher dosage Test and Deca

[throwawayidiot]

Using throwaway account here for obvious reasons but i need some NON judgemental advise, considering i already know the levels im on are NOT therapeutic.
I started with defy back in 2015 on 100mg test, 0.25mg anastrzole and 500IU HCG injecting every 3.5d and stayed on this protocol until i moved to Texas in July 2021.
Here the urologist i work with is very liberal and works with a lots of bodybuilders. As my lifting career got serious i asked him to max out my dosages. I've been running 200mg test, 100mg deca, 500IU HCG and 0.5mg anastrozole injecting every 3.5d. So basically everything doubled and ive seen amazing results in the gym for obvious reasons. I've been on this protocol for over one year and labs always looked solid, however i never realized throughout this time that i was having high blood pressure symptoms until 2 weeks ago when severe headaches started and i finally popped a capillary in my eye and wife suggested i get a blood pressure machine. Been coming in consistently at around 160/xx when measuring blood pressure. Last Labs collected in 5/23/2022 the morning prior to my injection showed E2 at 47.3 yet im being told i look puffy in my face so def water retention here.
Ive always been on top of labs but blood pressure just never seemed something i concerned myself with, hell didnt even know how it worked until this week.
My hematocrit this morning is showing 54 (yes i purchased device for that as well). The reason the HCT is higher because they wouldnt let me donate double red due to a damn therapeuticorder someone had placed on my charts allowing me to only do whole blood. Anyways its been removed and im due to donate double red this afternoon.
I also looked at my blood pressure readings charts from the blood donation app and noticed my BP was fine between feb- april when i cut down into single digit body fats. I assume i was dry not holding any water maybe?
Diet is pretty much bodybuilder diet, counting macros etc.
Libido is through the roof, amazing

1. How much will donating double red today drop the BP, if any?
2. if I go back to my old defy protocol how long for BP to drop if at all? If so should i skip next dosage to accelerate process ?
3. If i go back to old defy protocol is it worth keeping the deca in, at the current 2:1 ratio? Basically trying to figure out if the higher test OR deca is causing more issues to BP.
4. I hear Telmisartan is good for BP, not sure i wanna throw in even more junk
5. Maybe increase AI from 0.5mg to 0.75mg every 3.5d, see if it helps with water retention ?

Im simply looking for advise on how to lower the BP as quickly as possible and what could be causing it, my head and eye pressure is awful and im constantly flushing. Just feel like crap and obviously scared of major health implications

 

[Gman86]

So these labs were done while using 400mg test, 200mg deca, 1000iu’s HCG and 1mg of anastrozole per week? If so I’m extremely impressed by ur HDL! Most guys can’t even get an HDL of 60 using low dose TRT! So good job there.

Be careful about donating, ur iron level is pretty damn low. Ur ferritin is within range obv, but I haven’t seen an iron level that low in a while.

Ur also hypothyroid. So I would look into and address that for sure

As far as ur BP goes, the #1 thing that I’ve found to keep BP in check is magnesium. I personally use a magnesium chloride liquid product called Remag. Been using it for years, and BP always stays within a good range. The other thing u could do is up ur potassium intake. That should also help with water retention. Great sources are tomato paste and coconut water. But there’s plenty of others. Those are just the main sources I personally use. Also go purchase a quality salt. I recommend Celtic salt. Here’s a great video that explains the importance of hydrating ur cells, opposed to just drinking water. Drinking water without electrolytes, especially a quality salt like Celtic salt, just goes right through u and isn’t hydrating u like u think. I’ll link the vid below. It’s amazing. Have watched it at least 5-6 times

 

[Gman86]

So libido is very high on ur current protocol? How do u feel mentally, like brain function wise? Feel pretty good? And how do u feel mood wise? And depression, anxiety or apathy on this protocol?

 

[throwawayidiot]

So these labs were done while using 400mg test, 200mg deca, 1000iu’s HCG and 1mg of anastrozole per week? If so I’m extremely impressed by ur HDL! Most guys can’t even get an HDL of 60 using low dose TRT! So good job there.

Be careful about donating, ur iron level is pretty damn low. Ur ferritin is within range obv, but I haven’t seen an iron level that low in a while.

Ur also hypothyroid. So I would look into and address that for sure

As far as ur BP goes, the #1 thing that I’ve found to keep BP in check is magnesium. I personally use a magnesium chloride liquid product called Remag. Been using it for years, and BP always stays within a good range. The other thing u could do is up ur potassium intake. That should also help with water retention. Great sources are tomato paste and coconut water. But there’s plenty of others. Those are just the main sources I personally use. Also go purchase a quality salt. I recommend Celtic salt. Here’s a great video that explains the importance of hydrating ur cells, opposed to just drinking water. Drinking water without electrolytes, especially a quality salt like Celtic salt, just goes right through u and isn’t hydrating u like u think. I’ll link the vid below. It’s amazing. Have watched it at least 5-6 times

-yes labs are on 400mg test, 200mg deca, 1000iu’s HCG and 1mg of anastrozole per week
- I already take T3/T4 18.5/86, thinking of going to 22.5/95
-I donated pint of whole blood 5/14 and labs were drawn 5/23 maybe that lowered iron?
- being honest i cant see how Magnesium will lower BP by that much
- I use Iodized table salt
- depression only once, but shortness of breath which is prob due to high BP

 

[throwawayidiot]

So libido is very high on ur current protocol? How do u feel mentally, like brain function wise? Feel pretty good? And how do u feel mood wise? And depression, anxiety or apathy on this protocol?

Best libido I have ever had, i do get agitated easier nowadays and occasional mood swings but nothing crazy otherwise wife would have already left me

 

[Melbourne dude]

Using throwaway account here for obvious reasons but i need some NON judgemental advise, considering i already know the levels im on are NOT therapeutic.
I started with defy back in 2015 on 100mg test, 0.25mg anastrzole and 500IU HCG injecting every 3.5d and stayed on this protocol until i moved to Texas in July 2021.
Here the urologist i work with is very liberal and works with a lots of bodybuilders. As my lifting career got serious i asked him to max out my dosages. I've been running 200mg test, 100mg deca, 500IU HCG and 0.5mg anastrozole injecting every 3.5d. So basically everything doubled and ive seen amazing results in the gym for obvious reasons. I've been on this protocol for over one year and labs always looked solid, however i never realized throughout this time that i was having high blood pressure symptoms until 2 weeks ago when severe headaches started and i finally popped a capillary in my eye and wife suggested i get a blood pressure machine. Been coming in consistently at around 160/xx when measuring blood pressure. Last Labs collected in 5/23/2022 the morning prior to my injection showed E2 at 47.3 yet im being told i look puffy in my face so def water retention here.
Ive always been on top of labs but blood pressure just never seemed something i concerned myself with, hell didnt even know how it worked until this week.
My hematocrit this morning is showing 54 (yes i purchased device for that as well). The reason the HCT is higher because they wouldnt let me donate double red due to a damn therapeuticorder someone had placed on my charts allowing me to only do whole blood. Anyways its been removed and im due to donate double red this afternoon.
I also looked at my blood pressure readings charts from the blood donation app and noticed my BP was fine between feb- april when i cut down into single digit body fats. I assume i was dry not holding any water maybe?
Diet is pretty much bodybuilder diet, counting macros etc.
Libido is through the roof, amazing

1. How much will donating double red today drop the BP, if any?
2. if I go back to my old defy protocol how long for BP to drop if at all? If so should i skip next dosage to accelerate process ?
3. If i go back to old defy protocol is it worth keeping the deca in, at the current 2:1 ratio? Basically trying to figure out if the higher test OR deca is causing more issues to BP.
4. I hear Telmisartan is good for BP, not sure i wanna throw in even more junk
5. Maybe increase AI from 0.5mg to 0.75mg every 3.5d, see if it helps with water retention ?

Im simply looking for advise on how to lower the BP as quickly as possible and what could be causing it, my head and eye pressure is awful and im constantly flushing. Just feel like crap and obviously scared of major health implications

Get off the hcg man,that's what's causing the facial flushing. You only need to use that at the end of a cycle ,id also ditch the deca man, trt is about dosing test to optimal levels, deca is shit, tren is shit, you can gradually move up 500mg every 5 day of test e or test cyp and just have A.I's on hand for when u start getting teary watching romcoms and ya nips get sore. You need the elevated estrogen that comes with elevated test levels to protect ur heart bro. If u listen to what im tellin u , u will fix ur problems and get similar if not better results

 

[Melbourne dude]

Get off the hcg man,that's what's causing the facial flushing. You only need to use that at the end of a cycle ,id also ditch the deca man, trt is about dosing test to optimal levels, deca is shit, tren is shit, you can gradually move up 500mg every 5 day of test e or test cyp and just have A.I's on hand for when u start getting teary watching romcoms and ya nips get sore. You need the elevated estrogen that comes with elevated test levels to protect ur heart bro. If u listen to what im tellin u , u will fix ur problems and get similar if not better results

Using throwaway account here for obvious reasons but i need some NON judgemental advise, considering i already know the levels im on are NOT therapeutic.
I started with defy back in 2015 on 100mg test, 0.25mg anastrzole and 500IU HCG injecting every 3.5d and stayed on this protocol until i moved to Texas in July 2021.
Here the urologist i work with is very liberal and works with a lots of bodybuilders. As my lifting career got serious i asked him to max out my dosages. I've been running 200mg test, 100mg deca, 500IU HCG and 0.5mg anastrozole injecting every 3.5d. So basically everything doubled and ive seen amazing results in the gym for obvious reasons. I've been on this protocol for over one year and labs always looked solid, however i never realized throughout this time that i was having high blood pressure symptoms until 2 weeks ago when severe headaches started and i finally popped a capillary in my eye and wife suggested i get a blood pressure machine. Been coming in consistently at around 160/xx when measuring blood pressure. Last Labs collected in 5/23/2022 the morning prior to my injection showed E2 at 47.3 yet im being told i look puffy in my face so def water retention here.
Ive always been on top of labs but blood pressure just never seemed something i concerned myself with, hell didnt even know how it worked until this week.
My hematocrit this morning is showing 54 (yes i purchased device for that as well). The reason the HCT is higher because they wouldnt let me donate double red due to a damn therapeuticorder someone had placed on my charts allowing me to only do whole blood. Anyways its been removed and im due to donate double red this afternoon.
I also looked at my blood pressure readings charts from the blood donation app and noticed my BP was fine between feb- april when i cut down into single digit body fats. I assume i was dry not holding any water maybe?
Diet is pretty much bodybuilder diet, counting macros etc.
Libido is through the roof, amazing

1. How much will donating double red today drop the BP, if any?
2. if I go back to my old defy protocol how long for BP to drop if at all? If so should i skip next dosage to accelerate process ?
3. If i go back to old defy protocol is it worth keeping the deca in, at the current 2:1 ratio? Basically trying to figure out if the higher test OR deca is causing more issues to BP.
4. I hear Telmisartan is good for BP, not sure i wanna throw in even more junk
5. Maybe increase AI from 0.5mg to 0.75mg every 3.5d, see if it helps with water retention ?

Im simply looking for advise on how to lower the BP as quickly as possible and what could be causing it, my head and eye pressure is awful and im constantly flushing. Just feel like crap and obviously scared of major health implications

Also get ur high blood pressure treated, get on beta blockers ,you are in the game now and ull be chasing ur tail taking drugs to fix that side effect then more drugs to fix their side effects go to the drs and ask to be put on medication to lower ur blood pressure, you only get one heart. Im lucky im still here I exploded mine a few years ago takin the wrong shit. For too long and goin too hard. Iearn from my mistakes

 

[tareload]

1. How much will donating double red today drop the BP, if any?
2. if I go back to my old defy protocol how long for BP to drop if at all? If so should i skip next dosage to accelerate process ?
3. If i go back to old defy protocol is it worth keeping the deca in, at the current 2:1 ratio? Basically trying to figure out if the higher test OR deca is causing more issues to BP.
4. I hear Telmisartan is good for BP, not sure i wanna throw in even more junk
5. Maybe increase AI from 0.5mg to 0.75mg every 3.5d, see if it helps with water retention ?

Go see your doctor. You are pre hypertensive crisis and damaging your organs. Get this under control. Drop all your shit (including Test cyp) for the next 3-4 weeks then start back on 100 mg/week Test Cyp only and monitor blood work from there. Drop the AI and the nandrolone. Get your weight and fluid retention down.

And for God sake don't add more salt to your diet when you already have endothelial dysfunction. You may see 3-5 % Hct Drop with double red. Take care of yourself.

Cruise Dose Determination

Yes. No. Get it down. Think about your time averaged blood pressure over the course of the day. Keep a log and take your blood pressure at four equally spaced time points during the day with a good monitor outside the Doc’s office (if you are concerned). I saw the same effects on even...

forums.t-nation.com

The effect of high salt intake on endothelial function: reduced vascular nitric oxide in the absence of hypertension - PubMed

Within the last 25 years, it has become increasingly clear that high dietary salt intake represents a risk factor for the development of cardiovascular disease that is independent of its well-known ability to increase arterial pressure in some individuals. Studies in normotensive experimental...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[tareload]

So libido is very high on ur current protocol? How do u feel mentally, like brain function wise? Feel pretty good? And how do u feel mood wise? And depression, anxiety or apathy on this protocol?

Nice, make sure you get his symptom resolution feedback before he drops running systolic resting blood pressure at 160 mmHg.

 

[Belekas]

Go see your doctor. You are pre hypertensive crisis and damaging your organs. Get this under control. Drop all your shit for the next 3-4 weeks then start back on 100 mg/week Test Cyp only and monitor blood work from there. Drop the AI and the nandrolone. Get your weight and fluid retention down.

And for God sake don't add more salt to your diet when you already have endothelial dysfunction. You may see 3-5 % Hct Drop with double red. Take care of yourself.

Cruise Dose Determination

Yes. No. Get it down. Think about your time averaged blood pressure over the course of the day. Keep a log and take your blood pressure at four equally spaced time points during the day with a good monitor outside the Doc’s office (if you are concerned). I saw the same effects on even...

forums.t-nation.com

The effect of high salt intake on endothelial function: reduced vascular nitric oxide in the absence of hypertension - PubMed

Within the last 25 years, it has become increasingly clear that high dietary salt intake represents a risk factor for the development of cardiovascular disease that is independent of its well-known ability to increase arterial pressure in some individuals. Studies in normotensive experimental...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Agree 100% it's playing with fire at this stage

 

[Gman86]

Nice, make sure you get his symptom resolution feedback before he drops running systolic resting blood pressure at 160 mmHg.

I obv gave him some tips to lower his BP as well lol. Those are the tips that have kept my BP on average around 110/60 for a while now, even while using 125-150mg of nandrolone per week on top of my test dose. No BP meds or anything. And wasn’t telling him to add salt to his diet, just replace the crap iodized salt with healthy salt. Don’t think most people realize how much of a difference using healthy salt vs crap salt can have on their overall health.

 

[Gman86]

-yes labs are on 400mg test, 200mg deca, 1000iu’s HCG and 1mg of anastrozole per week
- I already take T3/T4 18.5/86, thinking of going to 22.5/95
-I donated pint of whole blood 5/14 and labs were drawn 5/23 maybe that lowered iron?
- being honest i cant see how Magnesium will lower BP by that much
- I use Iodized table salt
- depression only once, but shortness of breath which is prob due to high BP

Ya maybe upping ur thyroid dose would help lower TSH. Would start taking a little bit of lugol’s iodine too if ur not already. And make sure to get a decent amount of selenium in ur diet. I get a decent amount via my diet I’m sure, but eat a couple organic sprouted Brazil nuts each day just to make sure I’m getting enough

The right form of magnesium can drop BP more than u think. But it’s not a magic bullet. It’s just one very important factor that can help get ur BP down. Increasing ur potassium intake and getting rid of that crap idolized salt and switching to Celtic salt will also both do more to improve ur BP than u think.

And ya donating can most likely drop total iron a decent amount. Would think that number would recover tho after 9 days. As far as I know total iron is the circulating amount of iron u currently have. So I would think that wouldn’t stay low for too long if donating drops it. But I’m not really sure exactly how it all works tbh

 

[tareload]

I obv gave him some tips to lower his BP as well lol. Those are the tips that have kept my BP on average around 110/60 for a while now, even while using 125-150mg of nandrolone per week on top of my test dose. No BP meds or anything. And wasn’t telling him to add salt to his diet, just replace the crap iodized salt with healthy salt. Don’t think most people realize how much of a difference using healthy salt vs crap salt can have on their overall health.

Have you run the negative control where you remove the celtic salt and add back the ionized table salt like for like? How does you BP change as a result? Or another way, how did switching from table salt to celtic salt change you BP?

At this point the OP doesn't have a hydration issue; he has a body mass and RAAS mediated big time issue with his BP.

Is sea salt healthier than table salt?

Though sea salt has become popular, learn why it isn’t healthier than table salt, and get options for other seasonings.

www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org

@throwawayidiot , what is yout height, weight and waist circumference? BF level approximately?

 

[gallant]

Sea salt is no healthier than regular salt. It might have the tiniest amount of trace ingredients but nothing of any great benefit. I like the product Lite Salt. It's a really nice mix of sodium/potassium.

 

[Gman86]

Sea salt is no healthier than regular salt. It might have the tiniest amount of trace ingredients but nothing of any great benefit. I like the product Lite Salt. It's a really nice mix of sodium/potassium.

Simply not true. But to each their own

 

[Gman86]

Have you run the negative control where you remove the celtic salt and add back the ionized table salt like for like? How does you BP change as a result? Or another way, how did switching from table salt to celtic salt change you BP?

At this point the OP doesn't have a hydration issue; he has a body mass and RAAS mediated big time issue with his BP.

Is sea salt healthier than table salt?

Though sea salt has become popular, learn why it isn’t healthier than table salt, and get options for other seasonings.

www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org

@throwawayidiot , what is yout height, weight and waist circumference? BF level approximately?

I’ve been a health freak pretty much my whole life, so I would never willingly ingest crap salt on a daily basis

 

[tareload]

I’ve been a health freak pretty much my whole life, so I would never willingly ingest crap salt on a daily basis

Not even for the scientific method?
You have the conclusion before doing the hypothesis testing.

Is sea salt healthier than table salt?

Should you take health claims about sea salt with a grain of salt? What makes it different from table salt?

www.mayoclinic.org

Sea Salt vs. Table Salt

What's the difference between sea salt and table salt? For more than a decade.

www.heart.org

Poor Kevin, such a tortured soul with all that peaky research and data...

Sea Salt Pseudoscience

The obsession with sea salt, and subsequent demonization of iodized salt, has gotten out of control. Articles like this - see here - from...

kcklatt.blogspot.com

 

[Gman86]

Not even for the scientific method?
You have the conclusion before doing the hypothesis testing.

Is sea salt healthier than table salt?

Should you take health claims about sea salt with a grain of salt? What makes it different from table salt?

www.mayoclinic.org

Sea Salt vs. Table Salt

What's the difference between sea salt and table salt? For more than a decade.

www.heart.org

Poor Kevin, such a tortured soul with all that peaky research and data...

Sea Salt Pseudoscience

The obsession with sea salt, and subsequent demonization of iodized salt, has gotten out of control. Articles like this - see here - from...

kcklatt.blogspot.com

Haha sorry, we only get one body. Not trying to experiment on it for other people’s benefit. I’ve done enough research on the topic to know that Celtic salt, or salt like redmonds real salt are what we should be ingesting, not crap table salt or iodized salt, which is the same crap table salt that just has iodine in it. I personally don’t care what others choose to do or put in their bodies. If ur research tells u that table salt is just as good, and that’s what u prefer to put in ur body, I support it. I’m just trying to help people on their health journey’s, but at the end of the day what everyone else does with their body has no effect on the health of mine, so I don’t really care tbh. I’m always willing to help others, and it makes me happy when I can, but at the end of the day, I just support whatever makes others happy, and don’t really care what they do with their bodies. If someone else has high BP, and mine is perfect, I’m gonna keep doing what I’m doing, and they should figure out what they need to adjust and change. Clearly whatever I’m doing is working, at least in regards to BP, in this example, and what they’re doing isn’t

 

[throwawayidiot]

Hi everyone
Quick update as of this morning
I donated automated double red at 10am this morning. The donation place tested my blood and showed 50 HCT and 16 on the hemoglobin. So nothing too crazy and i already knew HCT wasnt my issues because my labs usually dont show HCT over 50. Anyways came home BP still 160/80, 150/90 give or take. Felt like shit. Went to a general practitioner and asked for 20mg Telmisartan. Took the 20mg waited 45min nothing added another 20mg and BP is now hovering around 123/76, 127/78.
For those asking im 5'11, 190lbs around 13-14% measured with skin caliper.
The high BP in my opinion is def due to the 400mg test and deca 200mg, i cant see any other reason, considering i lift 5 days a week and eat pretty damn clean.


Following questions remain:
-why is my resting heart beat continuously in high 90's or low 100,101,102, while the BP has now dropped?
- where do i go from here on dosages ? stay on current 400/200 or maybe 300/150, or 200/100 or just 200 test and take deca out and go back to my defy protocol? Hate to do this considering ill prob lose mass
- why is the damn blood pressure med so expensive ? with insurance i paid $1.27 per tablet for Telmisartan 20mg tablets.
- Is staying on BP med sustainable long term? I checked drug interaction site and it doesnt interfere with any of the meds i take, thank god
-anyone here take higher dosdages with BP meds? whats your experience ? Is it sustainable?

Please add opinions to the above and not salt discussions, i hardly use any salt and its usually ms dash for me and the occasional eating out that's all
I just dont want this convo to turn into another salt debate, we have plenty of those already

 

[tareload]

Hi everyone
Quick update as of this morning
I donated automated double red at 10am this morning. The donation place tested my blood and showed 50 HCT and 16 on the hemoglobin. So nothing too crazy and i already knew HCT wasnt my issues because my labs usually dont show HCT over 50. Anyways came home BP still 160/80, 150/90 give or take. Felt like shit. Went to a general practitioner and asked for 20mg Telmisartan. Took the 20mg waited 45min nothing added another 20mg and BP is now hovering around 123/76, 127/78.
For those asking im 5'11, 190lbs around 13-14% measured with skin caliper.
The high BP in my opinion is def due to the 400mg test and deca 200mg, i cant see any other reason, considering i lift 5 days a week and eat pretty damn clean.


Following questions remain:
-why is my resting heart beat continuously in high 90's or low 100,101,102, while the BP has now dropped?
- where do i go from here on dosages ? stay on current 400/200 or maybe 300/150, or 200/100 or just 200 test and take deca out and go back to my defy protocol? Hate to do this considering ill prob lose mass
- why is the damn blood pressure med so expensive ? with insurance i paid $1.27 per tablet for Telmisartan 20mg tablets.
- Is staying on BP med sustainable long term? I checked drug interaction site and it doesnt interfere with any of the meds i take, thank god
-anyone here take higher dosdages with BP meds? whats your experience ? Is it sustainable?

Please add opinions to the above and not salt discussions, i hardly use any salt and its usually ms dash for me and the occasional eating out that's all
I just dont want this convo to turn into another salt debate, we have plenty of those already

You got your answers in post 8. Good luck.

Be grateful you have a short term bridge with the BP meds and now work on your RHR and getting yourself in a better place. You only get one working heart. Or keep trying to get big or die/injured trying. If you sup with the devil make sure you have a long straw.

High blood pressure running higher dosage Test and Deca

Using throwaway account here for obvious reasons but i need some NON judgemental advise, considering i already know the levels im on are NOT therapeutic. I started with defy back in 2015 on 100mg test, 0.25mg anastrzole and 500IU HCG injecting every 3.5d and stayed on this protocol until i moved...

www.excelmale.com